Forums > General Discussion   Shooting the breeze...

Computer Assistance Required

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Created by frant > 9 months ago, 1 Mar 2011
frant
VIC, 1230 posts
1 Mar 2011 11:27PM
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I have just returned from a three week sailing trip across to Tasmania and cant get my head around a little computer problem that I have, any assistance would be most appreciated.
I have an ARL 3460 OES Spectrometer which is controlled by proprietary software (WIN OES v2.1) which is can be loaded into Windows 95 environment only. The upgrade to Windows 7 software (OXAXIS) costs about $15k and is out of the question at that price. On Monday when I went to fire up the old Windows 95 computer things remained blank. Most probably the graphics card but it was pretty full of mouse droppings and dust in the case. Tried a whole assortment of cards but none seemed to work. None of the local computer stores or SH computer shops have stuff for old computers anymore. I installed the hard drive into another old retired computer and got part of the way through booting up before it hung up.
I then downloaded Virtual Computer 2004 which is host compatible with Windows XP and guest compatible with Windows 95. Downloaded Acronis Image Maker and made a backup of the spectrometer W95 hardrive. What I have is a fully functional hardrive with W95 OS, the Spectrometer Software and all of the callibration data and results for the past several years. I also have the original Spectrometer Software CD and callibration data on floppy discs. I do not have a Windows 95 installation or boot disk.
I think that I need a Windows 95 installation disk. Anyone know where I can get one? Then can anyone guide me through the process of setting up a Windows 95 virtual computer on my XP host. Is it possible to restore the backed up spectrometer W95 hardrive in the virtual computer and then as if by magic simply press start and see it boot up.(with or without the W95 installation disk). I have set up a virtual W95 computer but am really out of my depth already and it keeps asking for the boot disk.
Cheers
Frant

oliver
3952 posts
1 Mar 2011 9:13PM
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Crikey, I know enough about computers, to know that I'm glad I'm not you. That sound like pretty heavy going. You will be able to do it, but it will take time - probably lots, but you could get lucky. Google, patience and blind determination will be your friend during this process. If you get stuck - walk away - then come back to it when you have another idea.

I'd persist with the virtual machine method for a while longer, if your host computer and your virtual machine has and can read from the floppy disk drive, I'd keep going. After that, it's just a matter of installing win 95 with the disk you asked for and then installing the proprietary software you have.

If you can't get that happening, look at purchasing some old computer with 95 already loaded on it with a floppy drive - there must be thousands of these in landfill. And then install the proprietary software from floppies. If all goes well then you should be up and running.

Computers are all about input and and output.

The bigger problem I see with this is that when you eventually get this all running on win 95, you are probably going to want to save your output into some format that newer computers also understand so you can mess with it and interpret it on a newer system. I'm guessing it's some sort of database.

What sort of files does this program output?

========

Sorry, just read your post again. As you already had this up and running on an old machine running 95 and your software - it sounds like your old video card is dead. Look at getting another one, newer cards won't work - the old 95 software drivers probably don't understand the architecture of the new cards. I'd keep trying that for a while. Do this until you get a picture happening - that's what I would do first. If this fails for too long then go virtual machine.

nebbian
WA, 6277 posts
1 Mar 2011 10:32PM
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I reckon you're on the right track with the virtual machine idea -- I know of at least one program that's written in BASIC on an Apple ][e which is still in production... of course the hardware is long dead but it keeps on trucking inside a virtual machine. Funny thing is it runs a million percent quicker now

Do a google for Win95 Boot Disc image and you should be able to connect the image to the virtual machine's 'floppy drive', which should put you back in business...

kiteboy dave
QLD, 6525 posts
2 Mar 2011 8:56AM
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Try posting on the 'broadband' forum that sounds like a washing machine, there's a lot more computer nerds there...

Sailhack
VIC, 5000 posts
2 Mar 2011 11:48AM
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kiteboy dave said...

Try posting on the 'broadband' forum that sounds like a washing machine, there's a lot more computer nerds there...


'Whirlpool forum'?

jetstream
WA, 57 posts
2 Mar 2011 3:42PM
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Frant

Go to the computer recyclers and pick up a dozen pc's running WIN95 and try them theres bound to be one that works.

seafever17
WA, 360 posts
2 Mar 2011 5:03PM
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Have you tried turning it off and then turning it back on again?".

Mark _australia
WA, 22377 posts
2 Mar 2011 6:03PM
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I wanna know why you have a spectrometer - just something you have in the shed ?

Probably next to the GC mass spec, particle accelerator, MRI machine and a small prototypre fusion reactor?

busterwa
3777 posts
2 Mar 2011 6:07PM
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Mark _australia said...

I wanna know why you have a spectrometer - just something you have in the shed ?

Probably next to the GC mass spec, particle accelerator, MRI machine and a small prototypre fusion reactor?




Windows 95.. sounds like a high tec terrorist lol...

doggie
WA, 15849 posts
2 Mar 2011 6:13PM
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I've got a mini hadron colider if anyone is interested? I've just finished the tunnel under my house so I can use a large one now

SandS
VIC, 5904 posts
2 Mar 2011 11:28PM
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yes , last time i looked [about 30 years ago] a spectrometer was something that anolized the particals in any substance.
interesting gadget to carry on the yacht frant!

frant
VIC, 1230 posts
3 Mar 2011 12:01AM
Thumbs Up

Mark _australia said...

I wanna know why you have a spectrometer - just something you have in the shed ?

Probably next to the GC mass spec, particle accelerator, MRI machine and a small prototypre fusion reactor?




Mark, This would be funny if it wasn't true. I do actually have the spectrometer in the shed at home, (set up as a lab). Another bit of my business designs and builds radiation protection equipment for Positron Emission Tomography facilities in the Nuclear Medicine Department of hospitals. PET uses a cyclotron to accelerate particles (electrons) and bombard a target element which then becomes a short lived positron emitting radio isotope. These isotopes are manipulated in a reactor housed inside the equipment that we build, the QC is carried out using a mass spectrometer and the product is then administered to a patient and a scan using a Gamma Camera which is awfully similar to an MRI machine is used for diagnostic purposes. There are various plans and bits and pieces of prototype equipment in my shed at home next to the spectrometer. And just to keep Buster happy the Spectrometer was bought in the late 90's when we had contracts to supply Kuwait with magnesium anodes after all their infrastructure was destroyed in the Gulf war and the US and their allies were not welcome to bid on these contracts so it was a bit cloak and dagger.

And I am not a great deal closer to getting Windows 95 running again. You would be surprised or maybe not to realize that just about everyone chucked all their W95 stuff out about 10 years ago. The recycling places might just go back to XP if your'e lucky.

decrepit
WA, 12133 posts
2 Mar 2011 9:08PM
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Hmmm, I wonder if it would run in "wine" in linux?
That's a program that provides a windows environment, for windows programs.
I've just checked mine, and I can set it to windows 95.

I've just purchased the January edition of Linux Magazine, it has a live DVD of Knoppix with it.

If you're interested I can check if that has "wine" installed if so you could run your computer with the knoppix DVD, and use wine to simulate windows 95.

It's not guaranteed to work, but it's only $15 to find out.

frant
VIC, 1230 posts
3 Mar 2011 12:16AM
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Decrepit, for $15 I can buy 3 bottles of red wine. Will share them with you if your idea works!

decrepit
WA, 12133 posts
2 Mar 2011 9:19PM
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frant said...

Decrepit, for $15 I can buy 3 bottles of red wine. Will share them with you if your idea works!


OK I'll go and plug the DVD into my old spare computer and see if wine is on it.

kitegirl21
NSW, 439 posts
3 Mar 2011 12:35AM
Thumbs Up

frant said...

Mark _australia said...

I wanna know why you have a spectrometer - just something you have in the shed ?

Probably next to the GC mass spec, particle accelerator, MRI machine and a small prototypre fusion reactor?




Mark, This would be funny if it wasn't true. I do actually have the spectrometer in the shed at home, (set up as a lab). Another bit of my business designs and builds radiation protection equipment for Positron Emission Tomography facilities in the Nuclear Medicine Department of hospitals. PET uses a cyclotron to accelerate particles (electrons) and bombard a target element which then becomes a short lived positron emitting radio isotope. These isotopes are manipulated in a reactor housed inside the equipment that we build, the QC is carried out using a mass spectrometer and the product is then administered to a patient and a scan using a Gamma Camera which is awfully similar to an MRI machine is used for diagnostic purposes. There are various plans and bits and pieces of prototype equipment in my shed at home next to the spectrometer. And just to keep Buster happy the Spectrometer was bought in the late 90's when we had contracts to supply Kuwait with magnesium anodes after all their infrastructure was destroyed in the Gulf war and the US and their allies were not welcome to bid on these contracts so it was a bit cloak and dagger.

And I am not a great deal closer to getting Windows 95 running again. You would be surprised or maybe not to realize that just about everyone chucked all their W95 stuff out about 10 years ago. The recycling places might just go back to XP if your'e lucky.


small world, i perfom pet scans amongst other scans... we could talk physics and positron/electron annihilation for hours on end

decrepit
WA, 12133 posts
2 Mar 2011 9:48PM
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OK, it does have wine on it and I was able to run an old windows scrabble game on it.
But I did have trouble trying to find the floppy drive, so I just used a program from the hard drive.

You may have to copy the calibration data from floppy and the software from CD on to the hard drive, unless you have separate DVD and CD drives. (The DVD has to stay in from boot to shutdown)

Also be aware that there are 2 operating systems on the DVD, fedora 14 and knoppix.
Fedora isn't a "live" system it's for installing fedora.

Feel free to PM me if I can help.

cisco
QLD, 12326 posts
2 Mar 2011 11:57PM
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Frant,
I have a Win 95 OEM disk and a few licence numbers.

I also have a Win95B boot floppy which, would you believe it, I created on 03/03/2001, exactly 10 years ago.

I also have a floppy with usbsupp.exe which is a patch for Win 95 to support usb devices and upgrades the OS to OSR 2.1 which also allows the use of an AGP slot in Win 95.

You are welcome to them if you want them or if all you need is a boot disk, go here www.bootdisk.com/bootdisk.htm

If you need a laptop to run the OS and software Ramona seems to know where to find them.

PM me if I can help further. Cheers Cisco.

seafever17
WA, 360 posts
2 Mar 2011 10:03PM
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Geez.
It sounds like the future of the free world depends on it.

I hope you get it going.

jetstream
WA, 57 posts
2 Mar 2011 10:05PM
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GOTO Gumtree.com post a wanted add . It free and should find what you need.

busterwa
3777 posts
2 Mar 2011 10:46PM
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im impressed !

doggie
WA, 15849 posts
3 Mar 2011 5:24AM
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Now that's funny!!!

myusernam
QLD, 6123 posts
3 Mar 2011 9:20AM
Thumbs Up

frant said...

Mark _australia said...

I wanna know why you have a spectrometer - just something you have in the shed ?

Probably next to the GC mass spec, particle accelerator, MRI machine and a small prototypre fusion reactor?




Mark, This would be funny if it wasn't true. I do actually have the spectrometer in the shed at home, (set up as a lab). Another bit of my business designs and builds radiation protection equipment for Positron Emission Tomography facilities in the Nuclear Medicine Department of hospitals. PET uses a cyclotron to accelerate particles (electrons) and bombard a target element which then becomes a short lived positron emitting radio isotope. These isotopes are manipulated in a reactor housed inside the equipment that we build, the QC is carried out using a mass spectrometer and the product is then administered to a patient and a scan using a Gamma Camera which is awfully similar to an MRI machine is used for diagnostic purposes. There are various plans and bits and pieces of prototype equipment in my shed at home next to the spectrometer. And just to keep Buster happy the Spectrometer was bought in the late 90's when we had contracts to supply Kuwait with magnesium anodes after all their infrastructure was destroyed in the Gulf war and the US and their allies were not welcome to bid on these contracts so it was a bit cloak and dagger.

And I am not a great deal closer to getting Windows 95 running again. You would be surprised or maybe not to realize that just about everyone chucked all their W95 stuff out about 10 years ago. The recycling places might just go back to XP if your'e lucky.


frant I can mail you an oem 95 disk if you want. Think someone else has already offered?

surprised you cant get it from the net..probably just not looking hard enough

I recommend shadow protect desktop....make an image of your functioning drive with this software, put the drive in a new pc and then do a hardware independant restore (feature of this software). You can also edit the image and it still works.
Load the drivers for the new pc. presto.
you can download a trial from the net but I dont know if it has full functionality. There are cracked versions or it costs under $100. best backup program for home pc anyway.

frant
VIC, 1230 posts
3 Mar 2011 10:45AM
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kitegirl21 said...

frant said...

Mark _australia said...

I wanna know why you have a spectrometer - just something you have in the shed ?

Probably next to the GC mass spec, particle accelerator, MRI machine and a small prototypre fusion reactor?




Mark, This would be funny if it wasn't true. I do actually have the spectrometer in the shed at home, (set up as a lab). Another bit of my business designs and builds radiation protection equipment for Positron Emission Tomography facilities in the Nuclear Medicine Department of hospitals. PET uses a cyclotron to accelerate particles (electrons) and bombard a target element which then becomes a short lived positron emitting radio isotope. These isotopes are manipulated in a reactor housed inside the equipment that we build, the QC is carried out using a mass spectrometer and the product is then administered to a patient and a scan using a Gamma Camera which is awfully similar to an MRI machine is used for diagnostic purposes. There are various plans and bits and pieces of prototype equipment in my shed at home next to the spectrometer. And just to keep Buster happy the Spectrometer was bought in the late 90's when we had contracts to supply Kuwait with magnesium anodes after all their infrastructure was destroyed in the Gulf war and the US and their allies were not welcome to bid on these contracts so it was a bit cloak and dagger.

And I am not a great deal closer to getting Windows 95 running again. You would be surprised or maybe not to realize that just about everyone chucked all their W95 stuff out about 10 years ago. The recycling places might just go back to XP if your'e lucky.


small world, i perfom pet scans amongst other scans... we could talk physics and positron/electron annihilation for hours on end


Would love to talk physics for hours on end, poor old Decrepit is going to miss out on the red after all. After my three weeks cruising I tried to hitch a ride from Beauty Point to Launceston airport, people with kids in the car would slow down as if to pick me up and then drive off with wide eyes of fear. However, I look like a weathered version of Decrepits avatar and you would probably run with fear as well!!
Have left the boat at Beauty Point and am heading back next week.
Have gone through all of my old computer stuff and found a card that works but I don't have the driver installed on the HD. The computer boots and loads up W95 but I can't read the screen. The video card that was installed had a big patch of corrosion under a mouse poop and the terminals of one of the chips have corroded away. My current solution is to source a video card that will get the present computer back on line. I will then put together a backup machine capable of running W95 and take up Cisco's kind offer of the W95 OS disk. There is a "486" with W95 installed on Ebay at present so I hope to outbid the $0.99 highest bidder.
Then I will rely on the computer literate to instruct me at leasure how we get a virtual machine going.
Cheers
Frant

frant
VIC, 1230 posts
3 Mar 2011 11:12AM
Thumbs Up

I have just installed a brand new Gigabyte G Force 6200 Graphics Accelerator and it works!!!
My primary problem is solved. Let analysis begin.

FormulaNova
WA, 14670 posts
3 Mar 2011 11:13AM
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I migrated a windows 95 machine for my parents a few years back to a more current machine from ebay. It is really hard to find contemporary machines that have windows 95 drivers available. In the end, the machine, a HP D530 I think, ran Win95 fine, after I tracked down their drivers.

The funny thing is that I found the programs I needed to run ran fine in XP compatibility mode.

frant
VIC, 1230 posts
3 Mar 2011 3:37PM
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Just been at home installing the computer back on the spectrometer. Turned the spectrometer vacume pump on and smoke poured out of the motor setting off the fire alarms. Now I am waiting on an urgent courier delivery of a new pump motor. The original Alcatel vacume pump motor is a 0.37kW motor with a 14mm dia shaft but standard mounting flange for a 0.18KW motor. Will have to machine an adaptor flange to mate the new motor to the pump body. But at least you can see what you are doing with mechanical stuff unlike those damn computers.

Mark _australia
WA, 22377 posts
3 Mar 2011 2:12PM
Thumbs Up

frant said...

Just been at home installing the computer back on the spectrometer. Turned the spectrometer vacume pump on and smoke poured out of the motor setting off the fire alarms. Now I am waiting on an urgent courier delivery of a new pump motor. The original Alcatel vacume pump motor is a 0.37kW motor with a 14mm dia shaft but standard mounting flange for a 0.18KW motor. Will have to machine an adaptor flange to mate the new motor to the pump body. But at least you can see what you are doing with mechanical stuff unlike those damn computers.


Thumbs up for the last sentence. Give me something I can SEE and bodgy up with JB weld and a coathanger, or manufacture a new part, anyday

nebbian
WA, 6277 posts
3 Mar 2011 2:17PM
Thumbs Up

Mark _australia said...

Thumbs up for the last sentence. Give me something I can SEE and bodgy up with JB weld and a coathanger, or manufacture a new part, anyday


The irony of posting a message like that on an internet forum isn't lost on some people

Mark _australia
WA, 22377 posts
3 Mar 2011 6:10PM
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nebbian said...

Mark _australia said...

Thumbs up for the last sentence. Give me something I can SEE and bodgy up with JB weld and a coathanger, or manufacture a new part, anyday


The irony of posting a message like that on an internet forum isn't lost on some people


Haven't you seen my coathanger wire and JB weld PC?

doggie
WA, 15849 posts
3 Mar 2011 7:49PM
Thumbs Up

Mark _australia said...

nebbian said...

Mark _australia said...

Thumbs up for the last sentence. Give me something I can SEE and bodgy up with JB weld and a coathanger, or manufacture a new part, anyday


The irony of posting a message like that on an internet forum isn't lost on some people


Haven't you seen my coathanger wire and JB weld PC?

OMG!!




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"Computer Assistance Required" started by frant