They are worth every accolade available to be bestowed on them.
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I cannot believe that anyone actually thinks that the troops are there for altruisitic reasons. Wake up guys.
The foreign presence in Afghanistan, Iraq and anywhere else is for commercial reasons and commercial reasons only. If you do not believe that then you have been sold a lemon.
Yes we are awake alright, particularly when uninformed prattle directed at the front line digger, then tried to be smoothed over with crap quoting stats by fools who would direct their tirade at those who cant defend the decision, instead of directing it at the those calling the shots in senior government positions.
The topic was directed at how well the lads who are there, are trying, no matter what the internal pressures are, to make a bloody difference They are worth every accolade available to be bestowed on them.
Those who want to slag off at them, go and stand in front of those families associated with the fallen, and tell them your tale of woe, while you watch them battle to make ends meet for the rest of their lives on a meager piss weak support packaged from the people who sent them to the front line. Yep we are awake, and dont intend to doze off, until our foreign diggers are all back home
Oh one more rant, Unless your a digger, referring to a serving digger, nobody has a right to refer to any ANZAC's as a "grunt"
x2 to the power of 30 000 000
Notwal,
I am looking up "hominem error" after star wars and will take your opinion on board then.
I would like to know docs life experience and seeing as his opinion on working men are so strong I wonder what he does. I am all for people having an opinion, I am also all for people taking offence and making it known, I am definately offended by his comments.
I am most fond of people who at least try to make a difference in everything they do despite who is pulling the strings; rather than talk about what they 'think' others have done badly with out knowing didlysquat..and how its all coz of some mystical string pullers.
a few of you out there really suk.
my dad served in Kenya as part of a peace-keeping force in the 1950's.
the mau mau were labelled as terrorists by the British.
if they were caught,according to my dad,they would be tried in a military/kangaroo court,usually accused of terrorism.
if found guilty the sentence was death by hanging.
no right of appeal and trial my military court.
in other words ... no f....ng chance!
a rubber stamp to kill.
an unjust,unlawfull and savage system.
not by Afghan law but by our very own law.
the numbers of Mau Mau hanged by the British according to my dad is a scary number.
in one case my dad was asked to give evidence against a young mau mau....it went something like this.
out in the jungle on patrol an altercation took place between around 5 Mau Mau and a dozen British soldiiers.
one of the young Mau Mau was alledgedly captured.....before the trial the very next day,my dad was approached by higher up's in the military to give evidence against the accused.
he was told to flat out lie.
he told the military court the person he saw in the darkness was older and fatter.
the accused was young and thin.
despite this the accused was hanged.
who were really behind these hangings?
not the British or U.N peace-keeping soldiers, but the powers that be,the same powers that are behind the fraudulent wars in Afghanistan ,Iraq and Bosnia.
There is no massive conspiricy when it comes to Afghanistan. The truth is more like the last few passages of this page:
www.lewrockwell.com/2010/07/fred-reed/the-beltway-journalism-cabal/
I watched the first part of the Quiet War. The most depressing factor is that the locals don't appreciate what the foreign soldiers are doing. However thats probably fair enough as no one like foreign troops in their country telling them what to do. So really there is nothing Australian or other western forces can do to get the locals onside.
From what I understand the Taliban has largely moved out of the areas where there are large numbers of foreign forces. The Taliban know they cannot win a pitched battle. So they choose their time, as was mentioned many times by the soldiers. The Taliban choose their time tactically and they are strategically.
So the Taliban will wait till there are no more foreign troops in Afghanistan. They will pay or threaten the warlords and then retake most of Afghanistan. The national government will be lucky if it survives two months. Karzai and his cronies will spend as much time dragging as much loot out of the country before jumping on an aeroplane or helicopter for Dubai and then London.
Funny how back in the 80s it was the Soviets in this position, foreign troops backing up the national government and now its us.
islam does not tell the extremeists to do what they do. These are the same people that smash the limbs of kids that take a loaf of bread to feed their families- great values some of you are supporting there. Just as in christian faith there is misinterpetation of the scripts. Maybe the brits should have done a bit more misinterpreting and taken up limb smashing & stoning a few hundred years ago, maybe there'd be less unpatriotic do-gooders having this argument now.
This is not all out war, this is a war against ghosts that kicked the ass of over half a million soviets 25 years ago. The taliban openly supported the training of terrorists, remember this is a case of history biting us in the ass- the west trained these same people in the techniques they are using against us now.
As for kenya, there are many rules in war- many of them arent right but thats what the world agree's upon.
There are comments in this thread i cant believe, i dont know if its just some people that lack attention in their physical lives and need to get it here. I can definitely say any respect i had for some of the forum members has gone.
Yes everyone is entitled to their opinion but that doesnt make opinions uninformed, inconsiderate or just plain bs. Before any of you jump to the conclusion that i believe australia is always right i will say this- iraq was an invasion, we never should have been there. Can the same be said for afghanistan? Sure up to a point, but when their disregard for human life started conflicting with our values something had to be done.
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I dread to think what could eventuate if if everyone thought like you doc,
You pathetic comments make me sick
Like you said Cisco ,, true hero's
I have the feeling that the Doctor is unlikely to reply to your enlightening comments, enlightening by way of exposing your inabiliy to employ logic in your thought processes.
I personally am uplifted that there are people out there who detest the fact that we find it okay to send soldiers anywhere overseas and then put them on a pedestal when they die.
If everyone thought like the Doctor we would not be having this debate, there would be no coffins and we would all be a hell of a lot richer for it.
How "dreadfull" would that be?
^^^^^
Despite these outcomes, no matter where some of these people are and how much they do; recognised or not.... The blokes and shiellas that are making an effort, do so no matter what you DH say.
While some of you.... think like homer simpson....
cant win dont try...
how pathetic.
wait 1 minute, 3 of my brain cells are no longer distracted by evlPanda's boob pic, so I can muster a reply... the real heroes are the people who put they're lifes in danger in order for us to continue ours, like Firemen, SES, *police, Drs, nurses... if Australia had been invaded by say the Germans cos we don't drive fast enough or the Americans because we want to filter our internet traffic or even the Dutch cos we don't smoke enough and our army was dying in the Resistence against the invaders... well they would be heroes too.
@teatrea: yes they were inside out jobs, not sure about 2012 but some siht better go down, biach!
@Mark _australia: the Taliban are Afghans... kind of like the labour party. Afghans have been invade by many and they always endup giving up before the Afghans... and while I wouldn't wish Afghanistan on anyone, being a liberatarian I realise that places like that make places like Australia look good. So leave them the **** alone.
I have/had a good friend who used to be in the ADF, and he threw a BIG hissy fit cos they wouldn't send him to East Timor... 3 years later he joined a security contractor who is working in Iraq doing I don't know what but not defending Australia.
When I was younger I wanted to join the Army cos I had a lot of aggression, luckily I discovered programming. So most of the people in the Army are ****up hotheads who want to blow siht up and go on an adventure.
U's homes need invading cos u's have been infected with Satan's words... Naa that doesn't sound right, how about I leave u the fck alone and you leave me alone.
But seriously what are we doing in Afghanistan, it was relatively stable before we got there... don't give me no Taliban bullsiht!
New interim government of Australia has rowed back on plans to introduce a wide-ranging mandatory internet filtering system, with communications minister Stephen Conroy saying a further 12 months is needed to review what content should be blocked in the country.
Conroy announced plans in December that would force Australian internet service providers to ban access to any websites listed as "inappropriate." If implemented, the policy would have made Australia one of the strictest internet regulators in the world.
This prompted the USA to bomb Canberra back to the stone ages in "Operation enduring freedom".
www.theguardian.com/technology/2010/jul/09/australia-internet-filtering-system
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I have the feeling that the Doctor is unlikely to reply to your enlightening comments, enlightening by way of exposing your inabiliy to employ logic in your thought processes.
I personally am uplifted that there are people out there who detest the fact that we find it okay to send soldiers anywhere overseas and then put them on a pedestal when they die.
If everyone thought like the Doctor we would not be having this debate, there would be no coffins and we would all be a hell of a lot richer for it.
How "dreadfull" would that be?
Logic , WTF ! reading all the negative comments on these great aussies hard at work in a dangerous environment ,genuinely make me sick,
If doc's comments make you feel , uplifted, well
dangerous for whom and for what...?
my security, afghan stability...?
i highly doubt it.
to finish zbigniew brzezinski's master plan...?
heroes my butt
I'm not sure the primary motive for something has to be altruistic to make it a noble aim.
We may only be in Afghanistan to stop it becoming a really really effective university town for terrorists (and this may be backfiring) and we may be very concerned with the location of the gas pipeline or whatever it is.
In general though, I would rather live in a country that is governed in a similar way to ours than a country that was governed in a taliban kind of a way. Even if ours and their governments aren't perfect, they're better than governments that circumcise and refuse to educate their women.
Doc and Japie are being naive in criticising the war for being selfish. All wars are selfish when you pull apart the motivations. In fact this war is fairly unselfish, because terrorism kills less people than road deaths and the pipeline (or whatever it is) benefits vs war cost can't be that great a comparison.
If we take Doc and Japie's argument to its natural conclusion then we would only be able to intervene if we were absolutely convinced that our motives were 100% pure - and that's never going to happen.
And this is only referring to the political decision making, the poor armed forces that actually have to implement it are nothing to do with it. You are more to blame as a voter that allows your government to go to war or as an individual that doesn't march at every occasion, than the poor guys who actually get sent to Afghanistan vs Timor vs Darfur vs Former Yugoslavia vs wherever...
The way that soldiers conduct themselves on a day to day basis is their business and if they conduct a badly thought out war (if that's what you think it is - and if it is then that's YOUR fault as a voter) with dignity and professionalism then that is admirable.
An action to improve something doesn't have to be perfectly motivated to be admirable and motivation is nothing to do with implementation.
Sorry dave, it was done on mobile web and many painkillers so yer even I dont understand some of it 
. I edited it a bit just for you- please excuse the structure of my argument, im not the wordsmith you are 
.
That particular statement you quoted was meant for those that sit back on their internet and sprout right or wrong because they want a reaction, nothing more. By doing so they conveniently ignore all of the horrors that the "innocent" enemy partake it. This country was founded as a colony for those whom have committed similar acts, you'd think their ancestors might be a little more lenient on those taking to feed their impoverished families, not saying that is right but nor is cutting of their hand or crushing them. Yer the original statement was laced with sarcasm.
Barn- you wish to google quote against me? Are you from or have you studied islam? Islam is no different to christianity with it's many denominations and interpretations. It actually made more sense to me in that it supports they right way to live life as opposed to telling stories. The quran encourages compassion, forgiveness, treating people right and paying ones debts (even of crime). The quote is to mark the hand not cut it off. But what chance does islam have, look how many misguided christians and how many wars have started due to interpretations despite the west generally having a greater regard for life.
. I edited it a bit just for you- please excuse the structure of my argument, im not the wordsmith you are . (its not the same text exactly so heres the text in from my personal copy)
Interesting that some would suggest the Taliban are the heroes and our troops are not.
So those Taliban "heroes" would be the ones that take pot shots at the Australian troops while they are interacting with Afghani children would they???
Well of course they are!! Those stinking Australian troops were using the children as human shields weren't they??
These "hero" Taliban are the ones that change sides as soon as they see who has the upper hand.
The thread has gone right off topic a few times, reasons for the war, idealogy etc etc.
I was just expressing my admiration for the guys on the ground over there and the way they conduct themselves.
If there were any hot heads among them, I suspect they would come to an early demise.
Mercenaries??? You could not pay me enough money to be there.
what we have done to Afghanistan and Iraq is beyond the word sick.
in future generations these two countries will be dead like a desert.
Iraq population est 29 million. Afghanistan 24 million.
that's over 50 million potentially breathing in the D.U dust daily.
morning noon and night, 24/7 they are being radiated.
that's every second of every day 24/7!!!
the Depleted Uranium weapons the Yanks + Brits used has seen to this.
in Iraq wars 1991 + 2003, Afghanistan 2001 to present day.
this stuff affects your D.N.A .
look at the high percentage of birth defects in Iraq, look at the photos of the hundreds/thousands of babies / kids born with horrendous defects.
the percentage of babies born in Iraq with birth defects is an unbelievable figure.
the more time you are exposed to high level radiation the worse the effect.
the more time the parents are exposed to this stuff, so the rate of birth defects will increase.
Alex Jones ''the highest reading recorded in Iraq was 123 times above safe limits'',taken near a blown up tank.
i have listened to many interviews with Doug Rokke and Loren moret, the evidence is overwhelming.
so why did they use this weaponry if the effects are so deadly and lasting?
the question should be, did they use this weaponry and is it a weapon of mass destruction?http://www.mindfully.org/Nucs/2003/Rokke-Depleted-Uranium-DU21apr03.htm
> 50% of the world believe the terror camps to be in the USofA and the echelon countries. And a lot are scared they're gona get bomb by them.
Building on Petermac's argument I REALLY recommend y'all watch
Beyond Treason (Depleted Uranium US-WMD Iraq War Veterans Dying 2005)http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2205254052040284660#
Let's get one thing straight... we're in Iraq and Afghanistan cos America wants us there showing our support for America.
Americans don't want to be there (i know enough of them) but America has been taken over politically by Jewish and corporate interests. The Jews want us to kill and maim as many muslims as we can.
The corporations want to sell equipment, steel energy and build energy infrastructure.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trans-Afghanistan_Pipeline
When the Taliban wanted too much for the pipeline, we invade!
The West doesn't give a f**k about people, it's resources fools! Terrorist, ha ha... more like camel jockeys sitting on oil minding their own business.
Coalition of the willing, ring a bell? Your either with Us or with the Terrorist?
Man some of u's need to drag your knuckles of the ground, turn of the TV and ask yourself what would make me want to work?
Once you have the answer to that question then you can apply that filter to what you see on TV... until then, I'm sorry but you're just not rational enough to watch it.
There are another 5 filters you need to have before you can objectively watch TV. They include psychology, history, 
