GingerPom,
Are you a banker?
Or are you just so brainwashed that you have not the nouse to realise that you have been had?
Perhaps your ego combined with your intelligence won't let you look at the facts. Whatever it is you are selling yourself short. I have to give you credit for involving yourself in debate, unless you are a banker, in which case I understand your propensity to protect your own little **** pile.
Have a little read of this, copied from a search on fractional reserve banking on google. If you think it is a crock of **** then do your own search and see how much the actual history differs from any other search you come up with. I challenge you to come up with an intelligent answer to the facts as they are portrayed.
Banks are the movers and shakers of the economic, financial and political worlds. It is a long story of cheating, fraud, double-dealing and deceit.
In the late 1600s the money-changers of England were in conflict with the Stuart king, James II. They combined with the Netherlands money-changers who had a central bank to finance the invasion of William of Orange to replace James II in the revolution of 1688.
When England in the late 1600s was in financial ruin after 50 years of on and off wars with France, the politicians pleaded with the money-changers for necessary loans. They demanded a government-sanctioned privately-owned central bank that could issue money as loans. It was chartered in 1694 as the Bank of England with one and a quarter [million] pounds in gold coins, but only 750,000 pounds was received.
However, it lent several times the money it supposedly held in reserves, all at interest. The Bank of England lent the politicians as much as they wanted, with the debt secured by direct taxation of the British people. In just four years, 1694 to 1698, the Government debt grew from 1.25 million to 16 million pounds.
FRACTIONAL RESERVE LENDING
Money-changers in England, generally goldsmiths, started keeping other people's gold in their safe rooms. They gave receipts for the gold that were used to pay others and so became paper money. To simplify the process the receipts were made out to bearer. The goldsmiths found that only a small fraction demanded gold at
any one time, so they started cheating by lending out some of the gold and keeping the interest earned by the lending. They found they could print more receipts as money than they had gold and collect interest on it.
This was the birth of "fractional reserve lending," lending out more money than the reserves held. It was fraud, often specifically outlawed once understood. This practice evolved into modern banking and is known as "fractional reserve banking."
It gives the power of money-making to private banks. This practice is their strength, the source of the rapidly-growing profits of banks, but also their inherent weakness, for banks live in fear of bad debts and bank runs when they hold only a small part of their obligations.
When the Bank of North America was set up in 1781 there was no clause prohibiting fractional reserve banking. Nowadays, banks in the USA are allowed to lend up to ten times more money than they actually have. Questions in the House of Commons are not allowed regarding the conduct and objects of the Bank of England!
THE MONEY WAR
By the middle 1700s Britain had waged four wars in Europe and was burdened with a national debt of 140 million pounds, much to the Bank of England. Britain set out to tax the American colonies who were issuing their own paper money not backed by gold or silver. It was issued in proportion to the demands of trade and industry, so that products passed easily from producer to consumer. It paid no interest.
The British Currency Act 1764 prohibited the colonial officials issuing their own money and all taxes had to be paid in gold or silver coins. Benjamin Franklin wrote that this caused depression in the colonies with the streets filled with unemployed, and claimed it was the basic cause of the revolution.
In 1775 the Congress of the colonies issued $2 million in paper money. At the start of the war there was $12 million colonial money; by the end of the war $500 million because the British had counter-attacked with massive counterfeiting and caused overwhelming inflation. A pair of shoes sold at $5,000.
INTERNATIONAL ADVANTAGE
Banks that are international have great advantage over banks that are only national. They are the driving force of globalisation and the push for one world government. The first to realise this and practice it was Amschel Bauer of Frankfurt. He took over from his father's goldsmith counting house and about 1770 set up as a banker under the sign of the Roman Eagle, or Red Shield and took on the name of Rothschield.
He found that lending money to governments and kings was more profitable than to private individuals. They were bigger loans and were secured by taxes. He sent his five sons to European capitals to carry on the family banking businesses.
Nathan Rothschield went to London in 1798 with 20,000 pounds, but in seventeen years claimed to have 50 million pounds. He realised the political and financial importance of the battle of Waterloo. He organised a speedy courier from the battlefield and had the news of Wellington's victory 24 hours before the official news. He came to the British stock market looking depressed and started selling shares. The British stock market traders, reading this as a victory for Napoleon, sold their shares in a panic. Using agents, Nathan bought the shares for a song, gained economic control and dominated the New Bank of England. The Prussian Treasury director wrote: "He regulates the rate of exchange in the City. His power of a banker is enormous."
ROTHSCHILD INTERNATIONAL
By the mid 1800s Rothschield dominated all European banking, lending to both sides in any wars. Rothschields provided huge loans to monopolies, such as Cecil Rhodes so that he gained monopoly over the gold fields of South Africa and De Beers diamonds. British Rothschield money is behind Rio Tinto Zinc.
Rothschield moved to USA where it financed both sides of the civil war. In the following industrial reconstruction the National City Bank of Cleveland, one of the three Rothschield banks in USA, backed John Rockefeller to begin the oil monopoly in Standard Oil. Jacob Schiff, Rothschield agent, backed J.P.Morgan and Kuhn Leob to hold 95% of US railroad mileage.
But banking monopolies did not have full control; the US Reserve Bank was government controlled, and issued the US dollar. In 1913 the agents of the major banks were able to railroad the Federal Reserve Act through Congress transferring control of money supply to a private banking elite.
The Federal Reserve Bank of New York in 1997 had 19 million shares, with Chase Manhattan Bank holding 32% and CitiBank NA 20.5%. It operates outside the control of Congress, issues the US dollar and manipulates the credit of USA.
Information extracted from The Money Makers, by Patrick Carmack, in Nexus Dec-Jan 1999, Feb-Mar 1999.
HUGE WAR DEBTS
With huge US spending on armaments (80% of the budget 1942-45), the Korean and Vietnam wars, by 1971 the US Government national debt was $455 billion. In 15 years, 1980 to 1995 (including Star Wars spending of Reagan), the national debt went from $1 trillion to $5 trillion and to $26 trillion by 1999. The major banks hold the debts and reap the interest.
Chase Manhattan, Morgan group, CitiBank, the Californian Bank of America and others control the US armaments industry and the transnationals. These banks control three-quarters of the stock of the main networks, the major newspapers, motion picture companies, almost total control of the mass media. There is total blackout in media or investigative reporting on bank control of governments and policies and they influence public opinion to their purposes.
They call the tune in the Pentagon and the White House and set out to maintain the militarised economy most profitable to them.
I.M.F. THE GLOBAL WEAPON
The International Monetary Fund, set up at Bretton Woods in 1944, is a global weapon of finance. It is funded by major countries. Major decisions require 85%, but USA with 17.8% has power of veto and controls decisions. Countries with great financial problems and nowhere else to go, must accept conditions of cuts in social welfare and education, and open their markets to world trade. Michael Camdessus, then head of IMF, demanded that Australia adopt the GST [Goods and Services Tax] which is now almost world wide in capitalist countries. It imposes tax on the poor and relieves the tax on the rich and the transnationals.
INHERENT INSTABILITY
But the US dollar and the banks are not all-powerful. The inherent instability of the banks comes from fractional reserve banking, where a series of bad debts or a run on the banks in a panic can bring bankruptcy.
Raisa Pages in Granma International Jan 2001 exposed the instability of the finance market. In 1975 foreign exchange related to 80% of real goods, but now it is just 2%. Finance markets manage seventy times more money than the real economy, and 98% of the $1.5 trillion on stock markets today is speculation on currency rates exchange. Internal monetary reserves, the defence mechanism of individual countries, are more and more insecure.
With finance a titanic battleground of the dollar against the euro, this instability multiplies. When the dollar fell 30% in five years against the mark and the yen, in 1978 the European countries formed the European Monetary System against the dollar. They launched the euro in 1999, and in Jan 2002 it is planned to be the de-facto currency of the several hundred million people of European, Balkan and central Asian countries. US, through its finance control is fighting back, determined to control "money creation," the central feature of US expansion.
AUSTRALIAN ECONOMY AND BANKING
Australian economy and its banking has to try and live in this world banking circus of globalisation.
Australia in the 1890s had a decentralised financial system of trading banks organised as joint stock companies. When the international price of the economic staple, wool, slumped, in the depression of 1892-93 some 15 of the 25 banks suspended operations.
The Australian constitution of 1901 gave the Commonwealth the right to regulate banking. It took its first step with formation of the Commonwealth Bank in 1911, but did not assume central banking functions till 1929. With the depression, and the concern of the people, the Commonwealth Bank was granted the full range of national central powers.
(This was the time when Montagu Norman of the Bank of England came to Australia and demanded 10% cut in wages.)
A 1937 Royal Commission recommended that banks be licensed, that governments have direct control of interest rates and the volume of credit. But it was not till 1945, after the financial problems of the war, that the Commonwealth Bank Act and Banking Act gave the Commonwealth Bank these powers, power over gold and foreign exchange, power to ensure banks deposited surplus funds with the Commonwealth, and power over lending and investment powers.
These powers mobilised money power for big projects and protected people from the rapacity of private banks. It became the banker of the government and the banking system. It had supervision over life companies and influence over the level of bank deposits and credit.
SPECULATIVE CAPITAL
In the early 1980s the massive wave of speculative capital inflow wrecked attempts to manage the exchange rate and money supply. In 1983 the government decided to float the dollar and abolish exchange and deregulate the financial market. After the 1989 world-wide recession and the crash of government banks in Victoria and South Australia public banks were sold there and in NSW, WA, and Tasmania. The Commonwealth Bank was privatised in 1991, 1993 and finally in 1996.
Deregulation damaged the economy by misallocation of capital, more company bankruptcy and huge and growing debt. Finance followed the market signals to areas of highest return. World finance affected the exchange rate and had considerable influence on government policy.
MAJOR BANKS IN AUSTRALIA
The four major banks in Australia hold 65% of total financial assets, with 80% of home finance and 90% of credit cards. The banks no longer wanted to be financial warehouses of small depositors with low interest and cost of servicing a burden. Many branches of banks particularly in the countryside were closed because they were not profitable enough, and from 1990 to 1994 employment in retail banking fell 30%. They have introduced automatic teller machines and a high rate of fees.
Ginger Pom,
We may have very different points of view but I have to give you this, you come across as a person who is forthright. Certainly someone who it is a pleasure to bounce ideas off (of).
It is very difficult to debate an idea or concept on a written forum for so many reasons, one of which you have highlighted in you reply, that is where is Petermac coming from. Who knows, maybe he does not, sometimes I don't know it of myself, particularly when Bourbon plays a leading hand!
Like youself I come from a scientific background. I have a qualification in fishery management and a lot of ecology training and experience. I am however a lot older than you, 55, and am very dissillusioned by the way things are. I share a common heritage, indeed passport, although have only ever spent 4 years in the UK. I consider myself african having been brought up in Tanzania and SA but have been in Aus since 83.
Anyone who knows me from those days would be astounded at my "swing" in politics. I came here on the cusp of Margeret Thatcher who was a "childhood" hero.
On finding out that fishery management was and still is a concept in Aus I went into a completely different field, labouring, which gave me a huge insight into the way things really is!
I have never forgotten my training, that is to ask the question why of anything that I do not understand and to try and research the answers.
My greatest love is the outdoors. My heart cries when I see the travesty wrought on nature.
And it goes on and on and on, with no real reason. It is like someone coming into your back yard and trashing your garden, wantonly, with a blindfold. You must know the feeling, when you take your antiquated sports equipment out on the water and cross over plastic bags! Or trip over crap on the beach.
If the institutions that govern us had no impact on our environment I would likely as not be silent.
Unfortunately it is not to be. If we continue to **** things up as we are currently doing life on this planet will cease to exist as we know it long before it's use by date and that is very, very sad.
So I started to ask questions and I am afraid that the answers lie in what I post. The truth is out there. I know it takes a while to sort the **** from the clay, but at the end of the day we have to come to terms with the fact that we are all one and the same thing. We are the custodians of this place and it's future, and ours, lies in our hands.
It is not an economy, it is an environment. It is our spiritual inheritance.
If and when you come to Newcastle there is a standing invitation to share a pint and have a yarn. Give me a warning and I may be able to dredge up a windsurfing spot!
Wait, it goes even further than I thought.
While, um, researching Bill Murray's time travels I found even more on Keanu Reeves:
A world wide financial crash!!!
Probably.
Robert Kiyosaki discusses this in his book "Prophecy". Worth a read considering he converses with the likes of George Soros and Warren Buffet.
Wow - Bill Murray got his start on Saturday night senate live (or dead in Ceasar's case
). Thanks for exposing that one Panda 
Conspiracy o' the week: All that cycling (and lack of circulation to the nads) has re-invigorated John Howard.. he's turned 30 yrs younger - and into Tony Abbott!
Women have either a button face or a horse face. Think about that and women you know and you will see it.
SJP Definitely HORSE.
whilst we are on that topic, i just discovered that lady gaga is a man (not personally or directly of course)...
^^^^^ well she states she has a wee willie...thats nothing new a hermaphrodite...and women have adams apples just usually not as large as mens
and the important part...lady gaga or man gaga...who gives a rats bottom.
again the worst 4 mins of my life and I sat there like an idiot and watched it...
Crisco...well I don't have a button face I think 
so that leaves me with your other option not much of an option
or is there some underlying subliminal thing that you aren't saying ? 
i keep trying to read this thread but always seem to get lost right about here
as for conspiracies go, got sent a link for a discussion going on at the moment about the sudden increase of cattle mutilations, pasted below is the best comment i have read so far....
this ones for you pander, rellie and ginger balls...
It's part of the secret genetic experiments being done by Nazi's at the Dulce base. They have created 57 species at#65279; the base including the greys. They do it to create other species to cover up the fact that the UFO's and the aliens are made on earth. Fake alien invasion planned. They have also created a human like species that is plant based that survives on sun and water. They plan on wiping out most of the human population by 2030 and replacing them with plant based human slaves
speaking of cancer.. i cant help but wish cancer upon the ignorant twats that walk down the street waving their their f'ing cigarettes out in the air as far as possible as they saunter down to the dole queue. the fat ones are the worst, they already take up enough space as it is but then they have to create a massive no-go zone around them (much like a kite
). i just want to get where im going without getting 3rd degree burns. so dont look so surprized when i snatch that death stick from your evil clutches before you burn a hole in my pants and put it out in your eye - hurry up and die already!
But they don't want to live in Perth as we have a water problem here so they say
Economics 101, buy silver...(LOL)
www.abc.net.au/reslib/201005/r570104_3512541.asx
ginger pom are you aware of the Plunge Protection Team?
an arm of the Federal Reserve.[private central bank]
the Plunge Protection Team can buy or sell stocks so manipulating the stockmarket.
the stockmarket is in effect a giant scam.
the Money Masters documentary is trying to get across that the system, [fractional reserve banking]is run not by the government but by the international bankers.
if the Plunge Protection Team[fed reserve] were to pull the pin on the stockmarket,then we would see the true value of stocks.[which would nose-dive]
a stockmarket collapse could be used as a ruse for the set-up of a world government.
google Bob Chapman / Gerald Celente / George Soros.....the stockmarket will collapse between Sept 2010 and end of 2011.
i go along with this.
people who are uni educated are less likely than the average working man to believe in such talk. [thinking they are too smart to be duped by such rubbish]
they think they are in some way part of the establishment.
that it could not possibly be working against them.
the lower class tend to be more open to the possibility as they can see they are being screwed so to speak. you need to open up to the possibility and research.
team
i have just finished watching the video posted of Lady Gaga......this scares me!
can i take back all the times i .........ed, while thinking about this possible tranny.
Doc, i think you are now starting to see chemtrails everywhere!
as i am starting to see pyramid logo's everywhere.
perhaps we both need to take some Paxil so ''we can again live a healthy and normal life''.
Hilarious thread.
So many people who feel that they know it all on both sides... conspiracy theorists are sick... non-believers are fooling themselves.
The really funny thing is that a lot of people on this thread are self-validating, showing that they know more than anyone else... which screams of insecurity in their own beliefs.
@FormulaNova: This is just my opinion, but if I owned property, I would have already sold. I bought ASX:GOLD and I'm doing fine
from www.henrymakow.com/
The Gulf Gusher & the NWO Agenda
"It's clear where they're heading: forced evacuation to FEMA camps of millions of Gulf residents. In this way the NWO will be grabbing an opportunity to unleash martial law on a grand scale in the Southeastern USA, so that we'll all get used to it, like we got used to airport security and torture."
by Richard K. Moore
(Posted on Yahoo groups)
As the NWO project has progressed, it has been very difficult to anticipate accurately how things are going to unfold.
9/11, for example, caught us completely off guard, and who could have predicted how rapidly the entire Constitution could be dismantled, along with international law, and have it all accepted by most Americans? Some things happen faster that we expect. With Iran, on the other hand, it seemed attack was imminent many times in the past few years, and yet it still hasn't occurred. Some things happen slower.
And then they throw things at us like the swine flu non-pandemic, and we still don't know what it was about. It certainly had nothing to do with public health, and pharmaceutical profits just doesn't seem like a strong enough motive for such a vigorous global campaign of disinformation. Perhaps it was all just to keep us off balance and confused, as we tried to find some rational scheme behind the fiasco. Or perhaps it was to test our various social defenses against vaccine warfare.
There is a lot of documentation about the New World Order, from the elites themselves, and other kinds of evidence. There are a few outcomes that are definitely included in the plans, even if we don't know the timing. These include world government (in essence if not in name), centralized control of currencies, drastic depopulation, and a major nuclear war.
(Illuminati Plays Its Cards, as in 1995 Card Game)
We need to recognize that this is no longer something in the future, something that might happen or might not happen. We are now in the midst of the switchover process. The toxic-bubble- collapse- bailout project was a clear sign that the switchover process has now been launched. With that one move, essential sovereignty was transferred from national governments to the financial elite. Greece is the poster child of this transfer, but it applies throughout the West. The Greece 'crisis' was a psy-op event aimed at giving other governments an excuse to tighten down austerity. It was like whipping one slave in front of the rest, so the rest will behave.
Once we recognize that the switchover process has begun, then we have no reason to expect it will proceed piecemeal, or at a slow pace, like an unfolding TV series. Instead we are seeing parallel assaults from different directions. And in any assault, it usually makes sense to get it over as quickly as possible, as we saw with the 9/11 assault on the Constitution.
Daniel Estulin and his friends tell us, from the very latest Bilderberger meeting, that the folks there are in a bit of disarray, and they're worried about people losing their fear, and beginning to resist. We need to remember however that Bilderberger is not a decision-making group. It is a place where filtered elite plans are discussed with secondary puppet elites... politicians, media moguls, and the like.
Bringing Bilderberger into line is simply one of the threads of the switchover process, not yet completed. Meanwhile, other threads of the switchover process can continue in parallel. The Soros article (below) gives us, more or less, a status report on the progress toward world government and global currency control. The attack on Iran will be the stepping stone toward a major nuclear war. Meanwhile, apart from the ongoing mega-genocide in Africa, what progress are they making toward depopulation? It is in this context that we need to consider the events in the Gulf.
When the Valdez spill occurred in Alaska, there was no reason to suspect that it was an intentional act, designed to destroy the local environment. It was clearly an accident, due to inadequate safety measures, and everyone involved wishes it had never happened. There was no motive for intentionality, even though there were means and opportunity.
But now in the Gulf, in the midst of a switchover process that calls for drastic depopulation, motive clearly enters the picture. What better way to move the project forward? Whatever toxic brew they cook up in the Gulf will be spread by the Gulf Stream all over the Atlantic Ocean and coastal areas, and into the global current system. And when the hurricanes begin, which they soon will, the toxic brew will be sprayed all over the Gulf region, making large areas of the coastal states, and probably all of Florida, uninhabitable and toxic to crops and creatures.
And it is indeed a toxic brew. They tapped into a major migration channel of abiotic oil, deep down at the level where volcanos originate, and all kinds of toxic gases are being released along with the oil, under enormous pressure that cannot be contained and is leaking out from many places in the Gulf. And in case that's not toxic enough, they're adding all that Corexit, a neuro toxin banned in Europe because of bitter experience with its toxicity.
None of this can be chalked up to accident. The geological properties of the area, and the nature of the deep oil system, were well known to the experts. The Gulf is one of the oldest and most studied drilling areas in the world. Any legitimate attempt to tap into that deep oil system would have called for better-than- usual safety measures, not systematically shoddy safety measures. Deep Water Horizon was an accident meant to happen, and the witnesses have been scared into silence.
Consider in addition these points, from the 'BP Oil Spill False Flag' article above:
- Sales of shares and stocks in days and weeks beforehand
- Halliburton link, acquisition of cleanup company days before explosion
- BP report cites undocumented tampering with well sealing equipment
So we have motive, means, opportunity, and an abundance of circumstantial evidence, all pointing to an intentional depopulation project. In conclusion, let's consider the modus operandi of the NWO, the parallels between this operation and some of their other operations.
First of all, there's the 'shock and awe' tactic: a decisive and unexpected first-strike into new apocalyptic territory: first 9/11, then the financial collapse, and now the gusher. Each one, in its own way, changing the world instantly and forever, and each covered over by a systematic disinformation campaign in the global mass media, and a confusion campaign in the alternative media and in conspiracy circles.
Second, there's the 'shock doctrine' tactic: grabbing as much apocalyptic territory as possible, after the first strike. With 9/11, they grabbed the Constitution and the justification for two wars. With the financial collapse, they got by with the bailout scam, and grabbed the West's national treasuries.
They haven't starting grabbing yet in the case of the gusher, but it's clear where they're heading: forced evacuation to FEMA camps of millions of Gulf residents. In this way the NWO will be grabbing an opportunity to unleash martial law on a grand scale in the Southeastern USA, so that we'll all get used to it, like we got used to airport security and torture. It's not that elites like martial law particularly, it's just that the switchover project can't succeed without martial law being readily deployable wherever needed.
The folks who will be evacuated from the Gulf region can expect the same kind of 'relief' that was experienced by the folks in New Orleans and Haiti, which were practice exercises for the NWO's disaster-relief protocol. This protocol is an expression of the shock doctrine, and what it means is that disaster victims are treated more or less as insurgents, and the investment bankster vultures come in to lay claim to whatever assets have been freed up by the forced relocations. Each disaster is a new redevelopment opportunity, and those who die contribute to the depopulation agenda. That's why relief supplies were blocked by the US military from being distributed in Haiti during the first few critical days, to make sure those trapped by the earthquake wouldn't survive.
To bring about the financial collapse, they injected toxic derivatives into the global investment streams. To bring about a major ecosystem collapse, they injected a toxic soup into the global ocean streams. Their fingerprints are everywhere.
---
"BP Gulf Disaster Could Kill Millions"
Jon Christian Ryter - "Obama's Oil Spill"
Insider- No Reason to Drill There- Oil Plentiful as Water
Background material:
George Soros outlines NWO plans
groups. yahoo.com/ group/newslog/ message/3438
Daniel Estulin exclusive: Bilderberg are terrified!
www.youtube. com/watch? v=UN9eiicrm8M
BP ecocide: 1 million gallons of neurotoxins added to oil
