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Forums > Kitesurfing General

ss octane p line lengths

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Created by hotballs > 9 months ago, 3 Jul 2011
hotballs
VIC, 114 posts
3 Jul 2011 6:54PM
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does anyone have the specs for the different lenghts of p line for the ocatne 7m, 9m and 13m. wanna make my own out of a decent rope.

COL
NSW, 551 posts
3 Jul 2011 10:13PM
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Certainly do but not on the top of my head. I'll let you know tomorrow if noone else gets in 1st.
Col

COL
NSW, 551 posts
4 Jul 2011 8:43AM
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2010 Octane 'P' line lengths. 7m= 1690mm. 9m= 1960mm. 13m= 2400mm.
cheers
Col

ok
NSW, 1089 posts
4 Jul 2011 10:21AM
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change ur pulleyss aswell to bigger ones the lil plastic ones are rope wreckers

hotballs
VIC, 114 posts
5 Jul 2011 4:56PM
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thanks very much indeed for that

puppetonastring
WA, 3619 posts
8 Jul 2011 2:43PM
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Strongly reco anyone with Revs or Octanes (and others with problem puilleys) take a leaf out of the BWS Noise bag of tricks and replace pulleys with stainless rings.

The problem of the wearing P lines is caused by the pulley that is fitted tight to the LE which makes the lines pull through at an unco angle scraping on the housing. With stainless rings this problem disappears.

Rob S
VIC, 391 posts
9 Jul 2011 1:33PM
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puppetonastring said...

Strongly reco anyone with Revs or Octanes (and others with problem puilleys) take a leaf out of the BWS Noise bag of tricks and replace pulleys with stainless rings.

The problem of the wearing P lines is caused by the pulley that is fitted tight to the LE which makes the lines pull through at an unco angle scraping on the housing. With stainless rings this problem disappears.


After buying a new REV1 and a then a new REV2 I became sick of making & replacing P lines. Ended up changing to Ozone. Still have my old REV2. Are you basing your recommendation on your own experience of using the rings on a set of REV P lines for 20+ hours or are you theorizing? I would have thought the friction over the ring would produce the same result.

COL
NSW, 551 posts
9 Jul 2011 1:44PM
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puppetonastring said...

Strongly reco anyone with Revs or Octanes (and others with problem puilleys) take a leaf out of the BWS Noise bag of tricks and replace pulleys with stainless rings.

The problem of the wearing P lines is caused by the pulley that is fitted tight to the LE which makes the lines pull through at an unco angle scraping on the housing. With stainless rings this problem disappears.


I haven't seen these rings. Can you give more detail of them? Does the Noise still use the same size spectra? How do the lines fair with this setup?
Thanks
I was using little Ronstan ball brg pulleys on the 'P' lines with good success, but they could still jam with sand if dumped in the shorey. I excepted the hefty $25 ea price thinking I'd just put them on the next years model. But then came the pulleyless Rally.
Col

puppetonastring
WA, 3619 posts
9 Jul 2011 12:14PM
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@ Rob S
NO - I havent converted any of the older kites to this system so I guess you could say Im theorising.
But its a bit of a no brainer really. The Noise runs a very similar bridle set up with rings replacing pulleys at the LE point. These kites have been flown like this since the early days of R&D.
Yes "P" lines still wear. Any system that includes 2 surfaces interacting will create abrasive effect. The smooth & open stainless ring reduces this abrasive factor significantly compared to a line being dragged sideways across the sharp edge of a plastic pulley housing. You could expect at least a full solid season of kiting before any signs abrasive wearing - if at all.
@ COL
Yes. 'P' line spectra is very noticably thicker on the Noise.
Sorry not up with tecki rope speks. or Id quote the actual figures.

Rob S
VIC, 391 posts
9 Jul 2011 11:32PM
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puppetonastring said...

@ Rob S
NO - I havent converted any of the older kites to this system so I guess you could say Im theorising.
But its a bit of a no brainer really. The Noise runs a very similar bridle set up with rings replacing pulleys at the LE point. These kites have been flown like this since the early days of R&D.
Yes "P" lines still wear. Any system that includes 2 surfaces interacting will create abrasive effect. The smooth & open stainless ring reduces this abrasive factor significantly compared to a line being dragged sideways across the sharp edge of a plastic pulley housing. You could expect at least a full solid season of kiting before any signs abrasive wearing - if at all.
@ COL
Yes. 'P' line spectra is very noticably thicker on the Noise.
Sorry not up with tecki rope speks. or Id quote the actual figures.


The problem with SS REV P lines isn't wear.
The problem is the line un-braids / twists and causes the line to shrink by at least 150 mm in a few months of hard kiting. (boosting not wave riding) It's a strange effect that I've not seen on any other kite. Still, I'm interested to know if anyone has actually tried the rings and found that it stopped the line shrinkage.

naturally
WA, 2 posts
5 Aug 2011 5:57PM
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I'am doing the winter maintenace on my slingshot kites and have renewed all p-lines on my rev 2s but are having trouble finding lenght of 5 metre octane p-strings for the missus kite. Anybody happen to know what this lenght is your help would be much appreciated cheers.

towradgi
NSW, 430 posts
5 Aug 2011 8:26PM
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Puppets right ,the p-line pulleys are substandard and an insult to the consumer for a high performance product octane 11m.The friction is the sharp edge topside of pulley.basically pulley should be deeper and wider.I replaced with stainless rings from Bunnings next to chain section,even a D-link works.

bws
QLD, 26 posts
6 Aug 2011 10:12AM
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Ill add a bit from our experience with the ring on the NOISE

firstly you can get some wear on the pline - but this varies with the user -
SOme guys have replaced their p lines in 3 months while i have not replaced any on the kites i have had and all those are over 6 months old and i ride way more the the average kiter - i think keep your kite free of fine sand is a key

secondly the ring does NOT twist the line - therefore eliminating the rope twisting the line and shortening it -

last point - the length of pline is critical to the flying performance of the kite -
if your kite is back stalling like the rev and oct tend to do then try adding another 10-15 of pline - you can experiment with extensions- or you could sell your kites and just buy the NOISE!!!! ( that was a joke)

hope that is useful
Bruce


COL
NSW, 551 posts
6 Aug 2011 12:43PM
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naturally said...

I'am doing the winter maintenace on my slingshot kites and have renewed all p-lines on my rev 2s but are having trouble finding lenght of 5 metre octane p-strings for the missus kite. Anybody happen to know what this lenght is your help would be much appreciated cheers.


1415mm
Col

naturally
WA, 2 posts
6 Aug 2011 10:46AM
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Thanks Col

Lovely
QLD, 248 posts
6 Aug 2011 1:48PM
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Remove the unnecessary ropes.
Bridal kites are for gheylords.

COL
NSW, 551 posts
6 Aug 2011 2:44PM
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Lovely said...

Remove the unnecessary ropes.
Bridal kites are for gheylords.


you don't often say something of value do you Luv
Col

djdojo
VIC, 1610 posts
6 Aug 2011 4:59PM
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Lovely said...

Remove the unnecessary ropes.
Bridal kites are for gheylords.


I never cease to be entertained by these Lovely posts. And on this occasion I half agree!! Lose the pulleys, lose the stainless rings, keep a minimal bridle to add range and support, and you can enjoy hassle-free kiting whether you're a gheylord, a macho man, or neither.

kitingtopher
SA, 313 posts
6 Aug 2011 10:27PM
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have rallies what pully's?

Robbo2099
WA, 738 posts
7 Aug 2011 1:09AM
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Using a metal ring to replace the pulleys is great idea.

Last week I went to replace the P-lines on my REV1 and REV2 and upon closer inspection was astounded to discover that all four of the pulleys (two on each kite) were completely jammed up and seized tight, presumably from sand or the bearings just being worn down and destroyed. No wonder the P-lines get stuffed so quickly! No idea how long they've been that way.

Try as I might, I was unable to free up any of the four and was about to embark on replacing all of them til I saw this post.

A small metal ring in place of the pulley is an obvious simple and trouble-free solution and will cause certainly no more friction than a seized pully!

Thanks Bruce!

Rob

dafish
NSW, 1649 posts
7 Aug 2011 9:00AM
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Does anyone have any suggestions for tying loops on 3.5mm spectra? I can't find a fid anywhere that small. Making my own p lines is an obvious way to go to keep the kite maintained, but I would like to avoid big bulky clumsy knots that I can so easily make that might not be so aerodynamic.
The rings sound like a great and inexpensive solution, thanks for that advice!

puppetonastring
WA, 3619 posts
7 Aug 2011 4:22PM
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Hey Robbo (hope ur good)
Id still consider a quality pulley as replacement on the front pulleys. The noise has them there and I dont think they would be a problem at all being free to align properly on the lines. It was the skewed angle of the LE pulley that caused the problem.

You should check your gear more often slakker!

Robbo2099
WA, 738 posts
7 Aug 2011 7:17PM
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puppetonastring said...

Hey Robbo (hope ur good)
Id still consider a quality pulley as replacement on the front pulleys. The noise has them there and I dont think they would be a problem at all being free to align properly on the lines. It was the skewed angle of the LE pulley that caused the problem.

You should check your gear more often slakker!


Hey mate, good to hear from you. hahah. I check it every couple of uses actually! Just never thought to check the pulleys!

Today I replaced the P-Line pulleys with small D-shackles and managed to free the pulleys on the front part of the bridle, but when I pulled the old P-line pulleys apart to get them off the lines, it became obvious why they seized up -- there are NO bearings inside and a huge amount of play between the hole in the pulley and the post so the hole will easily fill up with sand and seize up.

Hope to get a chance to test the kite on Thursday with a forecast of a decent southerly in Sydney for the first time in six weeks!

I also replaced the p-lines with dyneema again. Getting to be an expensive exercise! I'll report back how it works.

Brien
NSW, 172 posts
7 Aug 2011 11:19PM
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To dafish, you don't need a fid to splice this type of spectra or dyneema. Just get some thin stiff wire, bend about 20cm back on itself and push it up inside the rope, stick the tail inside the fold at the end of the wire and slide the tail back inside the rope. It is very easy as the weave is so loose and if you stuff it up before sewing it you can just re do it. Getting exact lengths can be a bit fiddly.

Robbo2099
WA, 738 posts
8 Aug 2011 9:02AM
Thumbs Up

Brien said...

To dafish, you don't need a fid to splice this type of spectra or dyneema. Just get some thin stiff wire, bend about 20cm back on itself and push it up inside the rope, stick the tail inside the fold at the end of the wire and slide the tail back inside the rope. It is very easy as the weave is so loose and if you stuff it up before sewing it you can just re do it. Getting exact lengths can be a bit fiddly.


This is a great vid: If you don't have fids, just tape the line onto the end of any pointy metal object that you can push through the line. I used a double-ended screwdriver shaft that has a phillips head on one end (pointy end) and a slotted head on the other (to tape the line to). Worked a charm.

daggy
WA, 528 posts
8 Aug 2011 12:00PM
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the pulleys on both my waroos seized pretty much from day 1, Rode the guts out of them for 4 years till I killed them both in the winter storm surf. ( torn canopies )
All pulleys absolutely seized - but zero wear on any of the bridle lines! a bit flattened out where they sat on the pulley but no damage. still got em in my shed for spares.
I'd say if the diameter of the metal used to form the ring is nice and fat then you should eliminate most wear probs.
But pulleys as" pulleys " just don't seem to work in kite construction 1 grain of sand in the right spot seems to end their ability to spin. The kite designers should know this!!!
You aint gonna get sand caught in a 20mm ss ring, I like it - great idea!!!

Adfreetv
VIC, 114 posts
11 Sep 2011 7:04PM
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Ok I have replaced the LE pulleys with Stainless Steel rings and I have 2 questions.

1. What is the p line length for an Octane 11m? Only could find 7, 9, and 13?

2. Do you thread from outside in through the ring from kite end to middle or the other way around?

My last p lines lasted only 6 months. I am very hopefully the rings will help.

Thanks all

Robbo2099
WA, 738 posts
12 Sep 2011 2:34PM
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Replaced pulleys with small D-loops and it works a charm on both th 9m REV2 and 11M REV1.

I noticed a bigger difference on the bigger kite (turns faster now) but it works fine on both.

So far, after two flights each, I don't notice any twisting or shortening of the lines.



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"ss octane p line lengths" started by hotballs