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Is this the new Best Nemesis HP 2009

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Created by kitebad > 9 months ago, 18 Jun 2008
kitebad
NSW, 74 posts
18 Jun 2008 5:26PM
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Is this the new 2009 hp??????????????









Adrenalin Rush
QLD, 876 posts
18 Jun 2008 9:22PM
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Mmmm. New kite, what new kite?? maybe.

Adrenalin Rush
QLD, 876 posts
2 Jul 2008 1:48PM
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We have all seen the inovations that the kite industry have released in previous years, but I can assure you that the new Nemesis HP from Best is innovation. The new technology in the Leading Edge is by far the most down to earth smartest idea I have seen yet, and best of all it works. I have flown the 10, and 12 and comming from the Nemesis HP in 08, the 09 kites are better in every shape and form as well as graphics.

Unfortunately Im not allowed to let much out of the bag yet, but I will say that the whole range this year is beyond anything I have seen in any kite boarding company ever, Ive been involved in this industry now for nearly 10 years, and over the past 3 years the products that all companies are releasing are making the transition into Kiteboarding easier and progression quicker. This year with Best Kiteboarding's release, we will see the Beginners become Intermediates and the Intermediates become Adavanced quicker than ever before....

Hang on to your pocket money, cause you will need to fly a new Best kite for 2009, if not you will be missing out on a very cool experience..

walshd
SA, 601 posts
2 Jul 2008 1:36PM
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The new technology in the Leading Edge is by far the most down to earth smartest idea I have seen yet, and best of all it works.


So whats the innovation? stopping the LE from exploding

Adrenalin Rush
QLD, 876 posts
2 Jul 2008 2:16PM
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Yeh, thats probably one thing that shouldnt happen, No brand sets out to design a kite for anything to go wrong with it hey.

2009 Best will have a new warranty policy, "Fair and Reasonable". If you happen to break your kite, take back to your local dealer and they will asses it. The policy looks after those that buy a kite, only fly it a few times in the first 3 months, then in the 6,7,8,9,month whatever, they take it out and something goes wrong, then there is a good chance if the problem is a manufacturers fault, it will be replaced.

This is a solid warranty policy that doesnt set a time barrier for warranties. This product has been tested properly, and a lot of work has gone into it.



Neill
VIC, 484 posts
2 Jul 2008 8:09PM
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arsa said...

We have all seen the inovations that the kite industry have released in previous years, but I can assure you that the new Nemesis HP from Best is innovation. The new technology in the Leading Edge is by far the most down to earth smartest idea I have seen yet, and best of all it works. I have flown the 10, and 12 and comming from the Nemesis HP in 08, the 09 kites are better in every shape and form as well as graphics.

Unfortunately Im not allowed to let much out of the bag yet, but I will say that the whole range this year is beyond anything I have seen in any kite boarding company ever, Ive been involved in this industry now for nearly 10 years, and over the past 3 years the products that all companies are releasing are making the transition into Kiteboarding easier and progression quicker. This year with Best Kiteboarding's release, we will see the Beginners become Intermediates and the Intermediates become Adavanced quicker than ever before....

Hang on to your pocket money, cause you will need to fly a new Best kite for 2009, if not you will be missing out on a very cool experience..




to be fair, we really can't trust your opinion. i haven't seen a lot of innovation from best over the years so i'm a little skeptical on pretty much everything you have said.

TheChad
QLD, 142 posts
2 Jul 2008 8:21PM
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Looks like its a twin skin??

kitecrazzzy
WA, 2184 posts
2 Jul 2008 6:25PM
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Neill said...

arsa said...

We...to fly a new Best kite for 2009, if not you will be missing out on a very cool experience..




to be fair, we really can't trust your opinion. i haven't seen a lot of innovation from best over the years so i'm a little skeptical on pretty much everything you have said.


serious? the LE on those are brilliant in their simple fix for a problem that effects most SLE/hybrids and the bar is one of the best in the business. I just can't see where you are coming from with that comment

Adrenalin Rush
QLD, 876 posts
2 Jul 2008 11:49PM
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i haven't seen a lot of innovation from best over the years so i'm a little skeptical on pretty much everything you have said.


The Cuben fibre material in the leading edge,, VP2 front line bridle system,, the canopy framing material, reduced diameter of the LE, these are only a few innovations that no other company are using and they are innovations that I think make a big difference to kite control, performance and durability.

I look at the other brands over the past few years and they have almost released the same kite each year just with a new splash of graphic, tweaked aspect ratio and different length bridle lines. Best Kiteboarding tend to have the guts to try ideas that are not the norm, and have the technology and will to make progression in design.

When I saw the new shaped kites from a paticular brand last year I was amped on them. I was told that they were the way of the future, that the shape and the performance were better than any before. The first day I got one I noticed the difference, but unfortunately for the worst, it was stable and performed ok, but I had this picture in my mind that when I flew this kite for the first time I would notice a massive difference to anything I had ridin before, and that this kite would progress my riding to the next level. I felt differently and after a few weeks of solid riding, wasnt prepared to waist my time and went back to what felt better and performed better and allowed me to constantly progress my riding. The 3 or 4 of those kites we sold in our area were all sold from our initial enthusiasm we had of the product.

Skeptisism is probably a good thing, but dont turn a blind eye to something new. One day all companies will step up to the design demands and everyone will be in the same boat. After trying the new Best kites in Spain last week, I am convinced that the company, their backup service, their warranty policies, kite design and kite construction will lead them into a good year. The new Leading edge technology is a great idea and allows the kite more flexibilty in areas that need it. Hope you have a chance to at least see it.

Joe

Paul1
QLD, 1011 posts
3 Jul 2008 9:47AM
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Neill said...

arsa said...

We have all seen the inovations that the kite industry have released in previous years, but I can assure you that the new Nemesis HP from Best is innovation. The new technology in the Leading Edge is by far the most down to earth smartest idea I have seen yet, and best of all it works. I have flown the 10, and 12 and comming from the Nemesis HP in 08, the 09 kites are better in every shape and form as well as graphics.

Unfortunately Im not allowed to let much out of the bag yet, but I will say that the whole range this year is beyond anything I have seen in any kite boarding company ever, Ive been involved in this industry now for nearly 10 years, and over the past 3 years the products that all companies are releasing are making the transition into Kiteboarding easier and progression quicker. This year with Best Kiteboarding's release, we will see the Beginners become Intermediates and the Intermediates become Adavanced quicker than ever before....

Hang on to your pocket money, cause you will need to fly a new Best kite for 2009, if not you will be missing out on a very cool experience..




to be fair, we really can't trust your opinion. i haven't seen a lot of innovation from best over the years so i'm a little skeptical on pretty much everything you have said.


Which brands have you seen the most innovation from over the years then, and what innovations have they made? I bought my first Best kite in 2008 and could not believe the progression they have made with their kites. No, I am not affiliated with Best, just a very happy punter.

Saffer
VIC, 4501 posts
3 Jul 2008 10:16AM
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Personally I don't see minor bridle changes or additional canopy material as innovations. These are improvements but not exactly massive innovation, its a simple case of "Hmmm, our canopy keep breaking, how do we fix this? Oh, I know, lets put extra material on them!"

The bow/sle concept was innovation, everything else is currently more on a level of refinements.

cjcos2
VIC, 37 posts
3 Jul 2008 11:30AM
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Another photo

walshd
SA, 601 posts
3 Jul 2008 3:31PM
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It looks like a pretty damn sweet kite.

Has anything major changed on the bar this year? I were quite impressed with the 08 bar.

I'm guessing Best have changed that dicky 2 piece stainless insert design on the bar?

Neill
VIC, 484 posts
3 Jul 2008 7:24PM
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Cuben fibre material on the leading edge - not really an innovation, just a different material. they still suffered blowouts like a lot of other kites.

VP2 front bridle system was merely an expansion on GK's original idea with the sonic 2006. Then again, most bow bridles are an expansion on this idea so best is not alone in copying that one.

Canopy framing material? you mean ripstop dacron? errr........ yeah.......... nothing needs to be said.

Reduced LE diameter, now there's an innovation! nobody has ever done that before. This drips with sarcasm. have a look at ozone kites, or the wind-x monsoonz. Anyway a lot of manufacturers are moving away from thin LE's because they have some undesired effects on flight. I'm all for thin LE's though, i think they are the way of the future.

the most innovation has probably come from matt pendle to be honest. His 06 sonic was really a revolution, look how much stuff was copied by other companies from that kite. If the LE hadn't exploded cause the stitching sucked, it would have been an epic kite. After the 06, he was the first one to introduce a properly "modifiable" kite which had 4 TE attachment options and 5 LE attachment options. These changed the kite dramatically depending on how it was setup. Look how many companies have followed suit in the later years...... once again it's an excellent idea. The V-sonic is great, but i think now we're just starting to tweak the designs, not "innovate" as such. Same as the sigma series.

I would like to see someone make a kite that has an infill panel behind the LE to stop rotoring behind the thick tube of the leading edge. I cannot understand why nobody has done this yet - this is one of the major aspects that makes a kite canopy inefficient compared to a solid airfoil section. It really can't be that hard to do?

Adrenalin Rush
QLD, 876 posts
4 Jul 2008 10:28AM
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Neill said...

Cuben fibre material on the leading edge - not really an innovation, just a different material. they still suffered blowouts like a lot of other kites.



Canopy framing material? you mean ripstop dacron? errr........ yeah.......... nothing needs to be said.




The Cuben Fibre material is the reason the LE diameter can be so small, along with its durability. There have been very few blo outs on the Cuben material itself, it has always been the standard Dacron material that has given way.


The Canopy Framing material isnt what it is made of, it is how it is positioned to protect the canopy from a hard blow. I thought this was a well thought out progression in canopy design and it seems that Best is the only company to do so.

Thats my opinion on it. I think Best have not only thought of different ways to improve quality in their sails but have implemented it without increasing the prices to a unafordable level. I only pimp Best because it is what I believe is the better product on the market in all areas.

Thanks

Joe

Paul1
QLD, 1011 posts
4 Jul 2008 12:33PM
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Neill said...


I would like to see someone make a kite that has an infill panel behind the LE to stop rotoring behind the thick tube of the leading edge. I cannot understand why nobody has done this yet - this is one of the major aspects that makes a kite canopy inefficient compared to a solid airfoil section. It really can't be that hard to do?


Why don't you make one, if its that easy, captain cynic?

kitebad
NSW, 74 posts
4 Jul 2008 7:17PM
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Neill , nice pic's of cook islands last year

I have punished the waroo pro's and HP's
cuben fibre material on the leading edge - not really an innovation, just a different material. they still suffered blowouts like a lot of other kites.
with respect "thats a load of crap!!"[}:)]
i use 10-12psi flat water & in big surf ' strong wind my kites have been trashed in on-shore 3m + waves dumped on them torn lines but the kites are sweet , you dont need a heap of bride lines like the ozone edge (centre Y lines) what a mess !, to hold the shape in the leading edge , the hp is simple easy set up ,
my own experience cuben fibre is bullet proof , kite does not twist at all even throught strong wind kite loops ,sensitive / super response to slightest bar movement ( Q pro power lines)just holds it shape in the most extreme conditions ,awesome to jump and fly /glide `

thats why i stick to the brand 4 line C kite feel & simplicity



general_dude
WA, 150 posts
11 Jul 2008 8:59AM
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Neill,

I'm with you. The infill behind the leading edge seems like such an obvious thing to do to improve aerodynamics. Sort of like a twinskin with an inflatable LE.

I wonder if any manufacturer's tried this?

Mr float
NSW, 3452 posts
11 Jul 2008 8:32PM
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general_dude said...

Neill,

I'm with you. The infill behind the leading edge seems like such an obvious thing to do to improve aerodynamics. Sort of like a twinskin with an inflatable LE.

I wonder if any manufacturer's tried this?


Yep twas tried by a czech company about 5 years ago .C kite

Neill
VIC, 484 posts
11 Jul 2008 9:01PM
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I would really like to see a company like Ozone make an infill panel and make the most efficient kite ever, i reckon it would reduce drag by about 20% if they could get some proper boundary layer adhesion on the underside of the foil. there may be a manufacturing reason that it hasn't been done though, i'm not sure.

regarding the cuben fibre stuff, i've seen three of them blow up in the last 6 months, all different kites, all waroo pro's. one had strange wear patterns on the LE and the material ripped simultaneously on both sides of the kite, had to be repaired. another blew up when hitting the water rather mildly after a hindenburg. the other one i'm not sure of but it had a whopping great hole around the stitching for one of the bridle attachment points. as a consequence, i'm not entirely confident in the stuff as a kite material. cabrinha, ozone, F-one bandit LE's all seem to have zero problems - everyone should make their LE's like that i reckon.

4lines
WA, 2 posts
13 Jul 2008 6:45AM
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I was riding waroo pro’s in 07 kited all summer here WA and Tarifa in the winter 07,
All the waroo pros riders I’ve seen in my travels which in Tarifa their was a heap never seen or heard about “ cuben fibre leading edge “ blow outs ”

toppleover
QLD, 2043 posts
15 Jul 2008 9:39AM
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Anyone have any idea how this works?


kusu
QLD, 485 posts
15 Jul 2008 2:18PM
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When a kite turns, it actally twists.
So if you have sections that allow the twisting section to be alot easier, yet have a rock hard solid leading edge as you can with cuben fibre, you're going to get a kite that turns in a much more refined manner, easier and faster.
I'm really looking forward to test the 12 and 14.

As for the infill panel, that would be great if the kite was actually a wing and you had thrust. In a kite sitauation if it is too efficient it would just overshoot the edge of the window when powering through.

If you were looking for efficiency, I'd be looking at nice thin strong non stretch lines, pump your kite hard (with cuben even better) , have a nice fast responsive board and ditch the booties

Neill
VIC, 484 posts
15 Jul 2008 3:41PM
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It wouldn't overshoot the window, it would just be more efficient. as the AOA dropped (nearing edge of wind window) the drag would begin to outweigh the lift, and the kite would be fine. it's never going to be as efficient as a solid foil anyway, infill panels do make sense for a kite.

the pic above looks like they've sewed flexible sections into the LE to allow it to torsion up more easily. as kusu mentioned it looks like they're trying different things to see if it will turn easier and better. definately a step in the right direction, the start of some real innovation from best with any luck?!

Paul1
QLD, 1011 posts
16 Jul 2008 2:17PM
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2009 Best kit tested here:www.xtremebigair.com/ Does not tell you a great deal though.

Adrenalin Rush
QLD, 876 posts
5 Aug 2008 7:17PM
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Twister Tech explained in more detail.. This is a copy of the info sent out today.












The 09 Nemesis HP is the first kite to be fully equipped with Twister Tech.

Twister Tech is a new leading edge construction technology that uses continuous segments of Kevlar-reinforced fabric built into the leading edge. These kevlar inserts are arranged so that they are able to deform with a twisting motion when exposed to steering loads via the canopy.

The addition of Twister Techtm to the LE of the 09 Nemesis HP allows almost the entire canopy to generate effective turning force in response to rider input. By allowing each LE section to twist independently, Twister Techtm increases the kite's turning speed, reduces the turning circle, and minimizes the bar pressure required to make any turn when compared to a standard leading edge construction.



Twister Techtm helps make your kite turn faster and tighter, with less rider effort.

For the full picture on Twister Techtm and how it integrates with the 2009 Cuben Equipped leading edge construction, check back next week!


Smedg
NSW, 836 posts
5 Aug 2008 10:21PM
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do these segments also inadvertently allow for bending or are there cool crazy fibres arranged in a certain direction to allow for twisting but not extra bending?

Neill
VIC, 484 posts
5 Aug 2008 10:46PM
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It's a pretty good idea, i'll give it that!

I do wonder how they will go with bladder wear at the torsion points though - although i guess at 10psi the bladder will probably just deform and not rub anyway?

Smedge you could be right (haven't seen it up close yet) but i think there would always be a little more lengthwise distortion than if it weren't in place. I gather best would have thought of this and arranged for the bridling attachments to take up the slack (to coin a shocking pun)

Adrenalin Rush
QLD, 876 posts
5 Aug 2008 11:28PM
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I do wonder how they will go with bladder wear at the torsion points though - although i guess at 10psi the bladder will probably just deform and not rub anyway?




The animated picture exagerates the movement more than what actually occurs. There is definately movement there but not enough to allow the bladder to be effected at all.

do these segments also inadvertently allow for bending or are there cool crazy fibres arranged in a certain direction to allow for twisting but not extra bending?


You got it, the cool crazy fibres (kevlar) are positioned so that the horizontal non stretch fibre runs in line with the leading edge. There is no loss of strength from tip to tip at all, Also there has been some tweaks to the bridle system but nothing dramatic.

kungfupete
VIC, 149 posts
6 Aug 2008 4:57PM
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Would the twist tech affect the stability of the kite? I always pump my kites really really hard so they hold shape and remains stable. This also pretty important when relaunching so the kite doesn't flop around. I'm not saying i don't think it will work, but rather just wondering if the up side is faster and tighter turning then maybe the downside is less stable arch?

Adrenalin Rush
QLD, 876 posts
6 Aug 2008 7:16PM
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The strength of the kite (tip to tip) isnt compramised at all. The shape is as solid as the previous Nemesis but has the ability to twist. This idea has been tested in the Best R & D now for a couple of years and Ive been riding my pre prod mod for a few months. There is no sign of wear, the LE is super strong and relaunch for the experienced rider is not a prob. The added performance with consistant turning power, makes this kite better than the 08 Nemi,.

You just got to try one out. Im not kidding...

Joe



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"Is this the new Best Nemesis HP 2009" started by kitebad