Forums > Land Yacht Sailing Construction

Modifications and experimentation.

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Created by aus230 > 9 months ago, 25 Jun 2012
aus230
WA, 1660 posts
25 Jun 2012 11:31AM
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Just thought I would start post on what modifications or experimentation that we are doing or would like to try or have seen. Have a think outside of the box and see what we come up with.

Starting the ball rolling I have attacked aus230 during the off season.
Moved the mast post back 100mm
Added suspension to the front of the mast post using parts salvaged from the local tip.
Built new 98mm wide rear wheels
Built new composite 60mm wide front wheel.(still some work required,sand and paint)
Some mods to the seat.
Cheers
aus230







aus230
WA, 1660 posts
25 Jun 2012 4:04PM
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Some items that I think would be worthwhile discussing (design and pics if possible)
Out haul systems for class5.
Adjustable steering
Brake setups.

Couple of out hauls



landyacht
WA, 5921 posts
25 Jun 2012 8:20PM
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blimey Vic , you have been busy!!!!!
sure you dont want to move back to kambalda
I havent put up a drawing of the moving steering I use as it is basically a modification of what Ive seen on a standart and an airtrack promo.
I want to discuss putting up a drawing with JPC and PC before I put up drawings
meanwhile , those new wheels look happy

colk2004
317 posts
26 Jun 2012 2:36AM
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Those wheels are very 'this years mainland Europe'. All looking very tidy.

Which wheel are you looking at braking? I saw a neat front brake on a class 5 at the regatta - hopefully he'll be using it this weekend and I'll get a photo (if not for you but for me). Simple cable running inside the front chassis tube to a pivoting loop of 8mm rod pulled onto the front tyre. Simple, tidy, well out of the way. I'll be wandering around the worlds 'blagging' ideas with the camera

Cheers Col

aus230
WA, 1660 posts
26 Jun 2012 9:56AM
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The brake will be in the hub of the front wheel using an idea that aus4 came up with. will be installing it in the next few days

Clemco
430 posts
29 Jun 2012 2:15PM
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Outhaul system I made a few years ago. I found if I changed the rear pulley to a larger diameter (arround 30mm) I only needed a 2:1 ratio instead of the 3:1 which meant less chord to deal with when it was fully hauled in. The wheels were from a sliding door track.

colk2004
317 posts
29 Jun 2012 3:58PM
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www.ronstan.com.au/marine5/outhaul_systems.asp

I'm running option number one with the variation of a small block on the clew and line to the end of the boom giving me the 4:1.

Cheers Col

aus230
WA, 1660 posts
3 Jul 2012 8:57PM
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Aus230 is now ready for next season.

Ended up fitting a 2 lever out haul




The front break idea that AUS4 came up with is a back peddle bike brake activated by a peddle above my steering arm it works great.



aus230 ready to race

nebbian
WA, 6277 posts
4 Jul 2012 9:11AM
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That outhaul looks easy to adjust at speed, three settings, great design

I imagine the only time you'd use the brake is on the starting line?

aus230
WA, 1660 posts
4 Jul 2012 11:01AM
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Yes it is only for the starting line, This is an area that I have had problems with in standing starts that we have here in aus. as I can not stop the yacht rolling when powered up so it has caused for a slow start.

lachlan3556
VIC, 1066 posts
4 Jul 2012 4:40PM
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Both ideas look great! Especially like the front wheel brake, no reason the other wheels couldn't be done in a similar fashion? Bring on the skids, and hoon landyachters Should be fun!

Hiko
1229 posts
4 Jul 2012 6:21PM
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Havent seen a two lever outhaul before Vic Clever stuff!
Or the back pedal brake being used either

Test pilot 1
WA, 1430 posts
5 Jul 2012 12:29AM
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We used the double outhaul on our promo's in 2008

nebbian
WA, 6277 posts
5 Jul 2012 9:44AM
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nebbian said...

That outhaul looks easy to adjust at speed, three settings, great design


Edit: FOUR settings. You tricky little engineer you... having the rope in different holes so that lever 1 down and 2 up is different to 2 down and 1 up.

aus230
WA, 1660 posts
5 Jul 2012 10:53AM
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I first seen the double lever at Lake Gillies a few years ago. The only difference that I have done is installing it on a rail so that I can make quick adjustments back or forward depending on the sail used. The locating pin has been removed on the front traveler.

VindisDad
117 posts
5 Jul 2012 9:55PM
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Hi Vic,
Just thought I'd mention that I developed the double lever as an improvement on the single one for the Faze 5 Given. I've used them on all my racing cl 5 yachts since then.
Some of your efforts look like they would work even better, I tried always to keep the whole thing very compact, which meant that sometimes there wasn't enough leverage.

VindisDad
117 posts
5 Jul 2012 9:57PM
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sorry, faze 5 was developed same time as club 88 (ie 1988)

aus230
WA, 1660 posts
5 Jul 2012 10:01PM
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Thanks Bill, good to know where it all started. Have you a pic of your setup.
Cheers
vic

FreCo
24 posts
9 Jul 2012 6:09PM
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I'm not definitely not the expert here, so I just dare to ask....

I've been wondering about the need and use of some quick-release at the downhaul for emergency-situations.
In extreme situations, instead of letting go the power out of the sail, wouldn't it be safer/better/faster to release the sail from the boom totally?
Whatever breaks, whatever position the sail would take, whatever turn you take, there would not be any possible power anymore.

Something like this?


Test pilot 1
WA, 1430 posts
9 Jul 2012 10:23PM
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That would be a good way to damage the sail, as the sail would be free to flap around and lead to tearing/ripping at batten pockets etc.
Also it would be another rope to tangle and it would take time to use(by which time you would most likely to have tipped over)

Gizmo
SA, 2865 posts
10 Jul 2012 9:33AM
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Test pilot 1 said...

That would be a good way to damage the sail, as the sail would be free to flap around and lead to tearing/ripping at batten pockets etc.
Also it would be another rope to tangle and it would take time to use(by which time you would most likely to have tipped over)


A wild flapping sail is bad news.... My worst memory of that sort of thing was a clip 'just like the one pictured' accidentally opened on a number 2 head sail of an S&S 34 yacht with the wind blowing 30+knots at dusk in the middle of Bass Straight. A captive sail is a lot safer.

Nikrum
TAS, 1972 posts
10 Jul 2012 10:03AM
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Freco,
It seems to me that your idea is tantamount to dropping the Sheet to releasing the sail and loosing all wind from it. The end result will most likely be a mast and sail brought down on top of you, a very expensive mistake. It happened to me when Land Yacht and my self where traveling too fast in a restricted area. Coupled with forcing the YL to spin out and dropping the Sheet to release wind pressure causing the Mast to Whip madly and Crunch the whole thing came down around my ears causing all of what TP1 said above plus a Broken 100% Carbon Fiber Mast. No I too, do not think a quick release. You will find that by hauling your sail in tight and spinning out will cause you to slow very quickly and be an enjoyable experience to boot.
Ron

PS; aus230, Will you take those damned pic's down?? They are causing me to turn GREEN (Envy) every time I see them.

aus230
WA, 1660 posts
25 Jul 2012 10:44PM
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What is the benefit of a mast crane, it is used on some sails others just fit straight on to the top of the mast by a loop?

cisco
QLD, 12346 posts
26 Jul 2012 10:07AM
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The standard blokart has what they call a turban which is a cup made from nylon strap material that fits over the top of the mast.

The top eyelet of the sail is attached to the turban with a short piece of line which is therefore adjustable.

The mast crane option eliminates the turban and the sail is shackled directly to the crane.

The alleged benefit of the crane is that it makes the rotation of the sail on the mast easier. Theoretically I would agree but it is a little hard to measure.

I think the main benefit is that it positively fixes the height of the sail on the mast.

For yachts other than blokarts, a mast crane allows fitting of a shorter sail lower down on a full length mast if there is an eyeleted wire strop fitted between the top of the sail and the crane.

Doing this though might have the effect of tending to snap the top of the mast off. That could be counteracted by ties around the mast at the top of the sail and say halfway along the strop.

aus230
WA, 1660 posts
9 Aug 2012 4:55PM
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Finished a couple more mods including 4,5m storm sail. Got to stop this building.



Nikrum
TAS, 1972 posts
9 Aug 2012 8:46PM
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Nah!Keep building aus.. That looks like a real Desert Flyer/Salt Pan Slider If you ever get tired of it just ship it across here..
Ron

frogy
42 posts
10 Aug 2012 12:27AM
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So proud a french sail reached down under.

landyacht
WA, 5921 posts
10 Aug 2012 9:13PM
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I suspect it will be smoking fast out on lefroy when the wind gets up, just when I was thinking I didnt have to get my ** together for september, now I have to make new wheels and a new sail!!!!!!

aus230
WA, 1660 posts
11 Aug 2012 11:15AM
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Paul
Did you see any new ideas or modifications at the worlds.?any pics
cheers
vic

landyacht
WA, 5921 posts
11 Aug 2012 7:37PM
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interesting question Vic.
heres a quick summary.
minis
should have taken nappy rush ,circa2009 model and sail. add 6.5m mast. should have paid attention to the fact that airtrack was offering a 6.5m sail as an option on thier lovely minis.
lesson learnt
class 5
the way they are rigged for the surfaces they sail on is so completely unlike what we sail on that i suspect you couldnt set up the yacht on lefroy /walyungup and then race competitively on the beach in france.
the conditions were awful, but the Europeans just tweeked thier yachts for the conditions and just got on with it.
you have to be impressed when they can sail a class 5 in light winds over a surface that a 4WD quadbike get s bogged on
sailshape and cut was completely different, mast bends and the effects of sheeting completely different, weight distribution absolutely at the other end of the spectrum to what we sail.
when the yacht get home , I will glass some ballast holdersonto the seat ,thenI plan to rig as per what was neccesary in France and see if the yacht is even sailable on salt. I plan to repeat the experiment on a little 75km beach that chook is researching as well to see if we can at least have somewhere to trial all thees new lessons

Chook2
WA, 1246 posts
11 Aug 2012 8:48PM
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Hopefully we can use the whole 103 kms of it Paul, if the wind gods are nice to us.
Then a return trip with the next tide. 200kms whooo hoo!!!!



I have arranged to catch up with a mate that has just returned from there, so should know the conditions.




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"Modifications and experimentation." started by aus230