Starting from the scratch - hints needed

Hi everybody,

In my country - in Slovakia - there are virtually no people doing landsailing. Land kiting (mainly snowkiting) is gaining popularity and windsurfing has been popular for years. I'm planing to build a landyacht as a DIY project and the idea is to provide some entertainment to my (preschool) kids as well. I want to build something small, manouverable, forgiving and not necessarily too fast (at least not for now :-) ). I would like you guys to give me hints for the questions below:

The frame and the seat:
I want to make Blokart like frame a frame based on the project of landyacht: www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Land-Yacht-Sailing/Construction/Build-a-Landyacht-Lake-Lefroy-Mini-Yacht/
I want to ride in a sitting position more like on the Blokart however.
What I want to add is a possibility for the kid to steer the landyacht while riding with me. I imagine the kid sitting in front of me between my legs but this way my feet must be some 60cm apart which makes steering less comfortable. I plan to make an extension of the steering for the kid either for legs or add a tube with a steering bar accessible for both riders. The feet of the kid will be somewhere before or at the level of the mast, I like the steering bar idea better at the moment. However it seems difficult to position the bar so that it would be accessible for me and not too close to the kids face. Any suggestions?
The frame must be small, preferably it should fit into an Opel Astra Hatchback trunk but most likely it will be transported on a roof rack. We don't have large venues here, I will mostly ride on agricultural airstrips and parking lots so the maneuverability is an issue. Unfortunately, also our large lakes do not freeze sufficiently in winter .

The mast and the Sail:
Regarding the sail and mast I am limited to use sailboard equipment. I would like to ask you which option of the two here is better:







Neil Pryde 4.5m sail comes with an 55% two piece carbon mast 430cm. The old HiFly 5m sail comes with a glassfiber mast and it is much cheaper. I want to recutt to some 3.5 -4m and rig it with a new boom. Which one is more suitable? Also, I have red the thread: www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Land-Yacht-Sailing/Sail-making/How-I-recut-sailboard-sails-to-suit-landyachts/?SearchTerms=luff,curve.
But: I don't know what fibre do I use to sew it together - there are no sailmakers around here. How do I add batting?

Wheels
There are wheels similar to Fallshaw wheels for sale here: http://www.kolieska.sk/page.php?sekcia=produkty&idProdukt=6046
These are equipped with industrial ball bearings and carry the load of 250kg. What do you think of them? A friend of mine used these but smaller for a land kiting buggy.

Well - that's it for now . I'm looking forward to your responses.

Hey Newcomer,

Let me first say welcome to the forum! I'm only a bit of a novice myself so don't take what I say as gospel, I'm sure the more experienced guys will comment soon.

Mast and Sail:
That HiFly sail looks like it's got way too much belly in it, even with alterations I doubt you'd get it flat enough. My first sail was of similar vintage (a bit newer I think), and I spent a lot of my time on two wheels, which if you want to have your kids on it is not a good thing. The only advantage I see is that it's easier to alter because it doesn't have microfilm.

The Neil Pryde, would be a much better option. Yeah it costs more but I think it would be much safer as the newer sailboard sails are much better at bleeding off excess power. I'd hazard a guess if you're using the sailboard mast that comes with it, and add a fair amount of downhaul you'd get it flat enough to without altering it (at least to start with, to get you going).

Thread & Sail Alterations:
As far as thread is concerned, you need a good quality polyester thread (Cotton is weak and rots). If you are sewing it with a domestic sewing machine, then your choice of thread is pretty limited as the machine will not have the power to penetrate with the commercial grade thread that the sailmakers use. If alterations are required, and you do need to do the work yourself then I'd suggest to get a few different grades of poly thread to try as the thicker the thread and the thicker the material means the harder it is to penetrate. You can always run more seams to get a stronger bond with a lighter thread, better that than your machine not penetrating at all. Also, make sure you are using "SHARPS" needles, not multipurpose or ball points.

You'll also need to get some sailmakers double sided cloth tape as well, I'm chasing some of that myself at the moment, so if I find out any more details I'll let you know.

You don't necessarily need a sailmaker though, any business with an industrial sewing machine should be able to run the seams for you. Maybe you could try tent manufacturers or repairers?

Cheers,

Adam.

As you are sailing mainly on grass airstrips, and carparks and not chasing high speed (yet) you might not need to worry about modifying your sail.
The standard sail is better for grass surfaces and lower speeds- later when you are more confident and the kids ure used to it- you can worry about recutting sails for real high speed use.

a 2 piece mast is much easier to transport than a single piece mast too!

stephen.

I found the biggest problem with my little one (4 1/2) with her on my lap was keeping her untangled from the sheet line. I am currently looking at a side car arrangement as well.

Hi Newcomer,
Keep in mind that you are pretty much on your own where you live, we can only fly you by remote control[}:)]. You should also keep in mind that you need to learn to crawl before you get up and start running. I tend to agree with the Neil Pride thing, 4.5sq m isn't a big sail and due to the purpose of its design you won't travel terribly fast with it. Build your Chassis to what ever design you see fit and have some fun with it until you build your confidence then you can start cutting and shaping. When that time comes you will find enough under sail making to get you a great re-cut shape. Leave the Speed Records for awhile.
Ron

Sure thing :-).
Also, there are not many venues around where I live to try. There are some asphalted agricultural airfields but these are invariably oriented along the prevailing wind direction (NNE 50% of time).

Hi there, and welcome to the forum If you can get a cheap 'wishbone' or windsurfer boom, You also have the option of using the entire windsurfer setup. The picture here is my old setup, and the sail is a 4.5m also. The rig works very well, but not as well as the boom below the sail setup.

The yacht itself is a LLM, per the plans only with an ali seat.

I also agree that having a sidepod type seat for the passenger is a good idea.

Yhe main thing is to have fun, and be safe!!

You are right but that is the object of re-cutting a sail, to flatten out the belly and put a fair amount of tension on it.. Land Yachts have way lower rolling resistance than a Sail Board or Yacht there fore requiring less motive power but what is lost in low end Power is added too when it comes to top speed. This is why you will see Tall Narrow Sails about, they are looking for FAST Go Fast[}:)]. Stick with the uncut until you get the Hang Of It and give the kids a thrill BUT they do not need to be hurt..
Ron

I like it - would you please upload a picture of the whole yacht for inspiration?

Take a look here for some pics. www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Land-Yacht-Sailing/Construction/fast-on-grass/ Good luck

Hello,

a stupid question - how does the inside of the mast step look like? I mean, the mast rotates in the step, how is it protected from wear?. I assume there is no bearing inside step. I've seen the thread www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Land-Yacht-Sailing/Construction/mast-and-mast-step/?SearchTerms=mast,step about protecting the wall of the mast. What about the bottom of the mast? Do you put some cap on it?

Otherwise.......

As he said Sorry forgot to mention that

I have a small(6" long) wooden plug siliconed in the bottom of my 30% carbon 2 piece mast, with pvc tape wrapped around the base where it fits snugly into the mast step. The wood stops the bottom of the mast crushing and the tape stops the mast from being scratche and scored by the end of the mast step, which has been belled(rounded) with a ball pein hammer to give a radius for the mast to bend against and no the mast does not rotate.
I use silicon spray some times on the mast to help the sail rotate.
I have been using this mast for over 4 years with no damage even after slamming the mast on the salt numerous times when tipping over

I used a piece of 1.5" chromoly tubing that went almost to the top of the windsurfer mast base. The mast step welded to the chassis is big enough to slide the 1.5 into, and still have a tight fit. the mast mast base swivels around the tube easily, keeping the downhaul lines straight.... Sory, I don't have any close up pics

Hiko, I've seen your mini with skis used for the rear axle. Could you please tell me how well does it work? We have plenty of old skis around and they may be great for suspension I guess?