I Drean A Dream TOO !!!

I DREAM A DREAM TOO……..

Let me say at the start, that this year I have tried to get an Across Australia trip
by Land Sailer off the ground. Due to problems of organization and co-operation with an Aboriginal Community, who say they control a fair amount of the interior of Australia. I have been denighed a permit to transit the community lands in question. On the grounds that they “ do not permit walkers or bike riders to transit their lands.” Land Sailers are vermin, don’t mention it.
I believe that I have been discriminated against and therefore I have taken my complaint of discrimination to the Discrimination Court of Australia. It is being looked at, at this time, and in due course will be decided upon.
The outcome that I would wish is for, The Community People concerned, change their outlook toward differently motivated people. Instead of being a Permit Issuing Authority a slight change to an Advisory of Aboriginal Lands and Customs would to me be more realistic.
Many people and businesses are suffering this discrimination, unless more people take them on then it will become the normal practice. ……..HOWEVER!!!!!

I dream a dream too,……… to my knowledge that is still allowable.

I dream of Land Sailing upon the bed of Lake Eyre.

It has been done before, although I can find no records of the trip, I believe the Motor Museum at Birdswood S.A. has the land yacht used.

So I am throwing this proposal out there for discussion amongst you lot, some of whom may be interested. This is all National Park Lands and a class permit will be sought to cover such a venture, as time goes by.

My proposal is to in 2011, maybe starting around the Easter weekend meet at Lake Eyre South [very close to the road] at Curdamulka about 100ks past Maree on what is called The Oodnadatta Track.

Have a couple of days play around here, then those who wish to partake head off N.E. for Pelican Point, about 35 km as the crow flys.

Then head N.N.E about 50ks thru the neck into the Magelian Gulf of Lake Eyre North. 28’ 58’ 54 S---137’44’18 E which has an access track [4x4] back to Maree where The Lake Eyre Sailing Club has its headquarters. This site is where the club nominally comes to sail their boats when water is available. Check out “google” their excellent Lake Eyre Sailing Club domain site, its just jam full of very informative material regarding the whole area, with some very sound advise.

Traverse N.N.W. for another 50 ks to Brooks Island nth and round the point.

Then travel S.W for 60ks to the access point from William Creek 28’ 45’ 49 S---
136’ 56’ 23 E. Also a camp area. 60-65 ks to William Creek which has all amenities
Though they are of some price.

It is relatively easy to have friends etc transport vehicles from Curdamulka to William Creek, a normal dirt road that differs day to day, week to month. About 100ks up the track. Just drive to ones ability, no rush.

For this trip, on site, I would count on about 7 days duration

Easter Saturday at Curdimulka camp area testing etc

Easter Sunday , a bit more of the same, with EGG’s

Easter Monday depart for Pelican Point if dry, if wet stay on west side of lake.

Tuesday up to the neck into Magellian Gulf ,if wet stay to west side of lake.

Wednesday up to Brooks Island or Artenia Point or Hambridge Point depending on conditions at the time.

Then the final leg which should be one day if dry across lake bed or two days if there is water sticking close to lake edge.

Then allow one day to get it all together and out to William creek. Much is available here including scenic flights for those who would want to.

As always it could go longer if one gets no wind or a lot of rain, I expect that this year will be the wet one and the cycle will return to more normal next year.

So just for a kick off, there is something to chew upon, or start saving, improving the condition of the body and the transport……….. START DREAMING !!!!!

This will be classed as an expedition and personal discipline will be called for from all participants. I see no reason to pre exclude anyone or type of cart and I think we are all men/woman enough to include the Kite Buggies people and the Land Yacht people together. The more the merrier, however a cap of 40 units will be in place for this first and learning event. 10 places will be reserved for overseas interests.

The point of vehicle description is that it should contain a seat in which the operator sits, and is wind powered only. Sail boards/skates are excluded. One must be able to carry sleeping gear and essential food and water, more on that expectation to come at a later date.

It will not be a commercial venture and if you wish to represent a commercial interest or club, then you should make it known from the outset of all discussions herein.

Interested party’s may approach with sponsor ship ideas they will be assessed, we [ as coordinators ] would be interested in discount opportunity’s that could assist participants. We will approach commercial dealer outlets that may be able to offer participants some discount help, more to come on that as things roll out.

PS if you are overseas and you may like to participate let it be known here soon, give us collectively time to work some things out. There may be some LY’s available for hire as long as you can demonstrate your ability to join in and enjoy.

All people must be responsible for themselves, this Expedition is for the people who can accept the responsibility for their own actions and a inclined to be of assistance to the mob that they are within.

This is not a race, this expedition is not a race, this is not a race.

Please do not post discussion here, first to post open new discussion post forum. Keep this forum clear for official business cleared by me.

I would like to ask Laurie and Seabreeze to allow this to run on their site.

My name will be on the block for most of this, I will make it known what I expect of any and all compatriots in this venture. Cheers for now…….. Joe

Thank you Landyacht... I have spent much time with the Lake Eyre Sailing Club

site, as you say is is very informative, I say it is excellent and should be read

and understood by anyone even thinking of out there. My readings state that

although water enters the system it is not often likely to produce anything

better than occasional relatively poor sailing conditions in mostly deeper holes

such as the interconnect canal Goyder canal where the club actually sails.

They say that for the majority of time the lake is too dry for sailing.

I am not saying that that makes the lake suitable for landyachting to your

standards. Areas will be able to be land sailed upon.

To add to the LESC documentation I would like to add the docco called

" Salt " shown recently on ABC1 By a photographer who lived out on the

salt over a period of six years for one month at a time. I suggest that all

could obtain a better understanding if they do the research. So look at this

site and even buy the DVD www.Saltdoco.com . There is much to be learnt

here about how to live out there and what i really like is his transportation.

I know that I could do what i have stated i have no doubts that it may not

be easy but if properly planned it is neither foolish or impossible.

I have the permission of Salt to use their link and have been in touch with

the LEYC people talking of things, will tell more later

thanks giz will get back to you on what you have asked, i have a post prepared off line which i will post here now as i will be away tomorrow

To prepare , even to discuss this proposed expedition, one has to do their own research and study. If they are truly interested they will not use some old school atlas, that they acquired in first year high school. I have seen this so many times in my travels, it is unbelievable.

Get some really good up to date maps, and learn to read them properly, to understand the terrain. Understand what a map provides.

Do start to improve your health, physically and mentally. A bit of walking is a good start, recommended at least 40 minutes a day, better 1 hour and go from there.

Do you know much about the lake how it is structurally, what affects it, wind, water, heat, National parks, culture, etc. Find out.

Have you ever been there? I have by road at least 6 times starting in the early 60’s. I have also flown over it twice, once when there was some water. I don’t know everything. But I do know that access roads have improved, motor vehicles have also improved. I also know that idiot drivers come to grief. Support services have improved. In general people’s attitude has improved. That doesn’t mean it’s a walkover or a shoe in. One would have to expect some intelligent input/effort.

Improve your mind, read about it and the LEYC details some very interesting reading on their web site, check it out via google.

Do you know anything of the Dalhunty’s? Retired from academia this wondrous couple lived out there for some years, or at least made numerous exploration trips. He was interested in the geology of the lake and together they surveyed much. Mary wrote quite a few books about their time’s out there, living in a galvanized rain water tank on the back of a Toyota Ute. The husband’s dedicated published papers are very valuable historic documents and will serve man for ever.

I am interested in this as a project that I would like to do, and here I am putting it to you people, maybe you would like to become involved, to join in with me. I cant do this one on my own as I would normally do, this needs at least three people for some sort of safety on the lake and a couple of others to monitor radios etc and move cars.

So if you are capable, normally healthy, male or female, colour don’t matter. You could be put to good use, there will be something for you to do even in support.
There is nothing underhanded, political going on here, it is just people who would like to have a go. If you just think you would like to get out there with a group of people and experience something you may never otherwise have the chance to do, well let me know, and have a go. You would have to accept camping a little rough or Ah La natural, A good cook would be an asset, camp oven competent,
Or I could give you the basics and unleash you. Makes for interesting camping.

I wish to put it all here on this forum, and if you want to say something, say it here too, criticism is taken onboard and given a lot of thought. A red flag to me here means nothing. A man/woman makes themselves known and all people should be willing to put their credentials up for all to see or otherwise their opinion carries little weight. Nothing is considered too funny, too odd to discuss. You will possibly get many opinions, some right , some wrong, some in between. This is discussion free to all who are interested. If you have no real input, please don’t post your junk here. I wish for all interested to see all that is said, make sure you read it all and keep up with it.

I realize that some events that normally take place at this time of year , like Easter at Lake Lefroy, and others that I am unaware of may be a bit compromised, for this I apologize, but as school holidays are on the boil at this time, it presents as an ideal time to have that go. This as far as I am concerned is to me a once in a lifetime event, even though I have started it, I hope that I am here to experience it with others.

My experiences with people in the outback have taught me that age doesn’t matter, attitude does. The oldest quite often [up to 80] can be the best member of the team, as long as they can carry their own weight. So age is not a barrier. If your health is under control even with medication, you know your limits, then that is also not a problem. All of us can drop dead at any time, that can only be dealt with if it happens. While we are alive we can all learn from others.

What does cause problems, know alls, people who have bad personal ablution problems, people who don’t wash, we all tend to smell a little rancid after a few days, but we do it collectively. Snorers can be problematical, but most people only complain. Smoking is best not practiced, I would not ban it outright but it tends to ostracize people. Quite often they are the only ones with matches, is that good or bad? Bad “ Banjo “ players are a problem. Loud personal music….yuck!!
Generators not needed in camping areas, this is camping, silent torches. Yep loud football broadcasts are abominable. Kicking a ball around is OK.

Problems tend to arise after about 20 days away from home, out of ones comfort zone. It can get to some people, we are all different, some things grate on others quicker. Different people, different water, different expectations, no contact with those at home.

Personal mobile phones tend to not work out there. None of the Yuppie ones do, they are useless outside the city’s, check with your system supplier. Demand to see a system footprint [map]. Don’t take any notice of the sales person. Get it in writing or be disappointed. For some, one has to climb 60 foot up a tree, there are no trees like that out there. No windmills either, no helpful mountains to climb.

Water has to be treated with respect , everyone is responsible for there own supply. They should ensure they have enough and not rely on being able to get some somewhere. I do not buy bottled water it is more expensive than fuel. We will go into water in some depth soon.

Personal ablutions, on the salt are not permitted, one has to lay their roses in a plastic bag and remove it from the scene to be disposed of in a suitable manner. All rubbish must be collected and removed from the Nat Park, what you take in you take out, so bags suitable for this purpose are essential for all people at all times. It is even nice to pick up someone else’s rubbish and remove that too.

Dispose of in an appropriate manner means, that you take all your rubbish with you, it is not left at some overfull roadside tin for crows and dingos to spread. It is taken to the nearest towns official rubbish dump and duly dealt with.

Everyone is responsible for their own monetary situation, you pay your own way, there may be a donation asked for some hire services we collectively need and some other costs . That will be worked out as we go along, I would expect nothing higher that $50 per head or the same cost for a family. Food will be discussed later in detail but basically all will supply their own.

SORRY NO PETS ALLOWED AT ALL !!! , doubly sorry for that.
DEFINITELY NO FIREARMS OF ANY SORT, NO EXPLOSIVE MATERIALS.

Camp fires. Now days gas is the go for cooking. Big campfires are not done in these times, it is deemed not appropriate to scrounge timber from the sites, to cut trees is a NO, NO. Chainsaws, not in my camps or with any people associated with me or this expedition. If one did want a campfire and there are designated ground fire places available, then this can be so with care. Start collecting your timber now at home and bring it with you instead of sending it to landfill.

Treated timber is not permitted to be burnt. Often camp fires are shared with other strange people. They may not be as well advised as you will be, then they may be great people too. One’s you would like to meet, interesting people.

Hey, you will never know to whom you are talking, one can be in the company of Bishops, Butchers, Bores, etc. Most people out here are switched off from their other life, it is best not to pry, but always be aware. The Bushys love to lead you up a tree, then cut it down, its their sport, why I do a bit of that myself.

Children are acceptable after all we all were one of them, eons ago, and there be the reason we are here. They don’t need to be yelled at all the time, they need to explore, learn. That’s a good thing and their parents deserve every encouragement, most others of us are tolerant and helpful but a few can be touchy for reasons we will never understand. I don’t believe children should be seen and not heard, as was in my own case. A child with a good outlook is the greatest thing we will ever come across. YA!!! Go the Kid’s

The bush is sorta sacred, and with most people they appreciate the noise’s of the place or should I say the silence of an intense experience. Share the moment. NORMAL CONVERSATIONAL VOICES ARE OK, as is laughing. Excessive partying is not a good thing, a few quite drinks, a yabba, that’s OK .

Why no firearms? I always make it a habit of including an accurate little .22 for any trips I do away just as a precaution.

Other than that the trip looks to be a great idea, not that I would be able to get enough time off uni to do it but very best of luck to any that might. Im starting small and picture doing a run from Balranald - Ivanhoe - Booligal (all NSW) would be a good first step when I get a bit better at sailing

From the thread Clemco started for Joe "Lake Eyre Expedition".

j murray said...


Locky.......I hear you man, sick, sick, sick. you got that pee shooter

licensed, them bush boys in blue will send you up the creek if its not

That's a big NO, NO. out there. That's the reason no firearms , just not

needed. The Coloured people are under control , ya have to have a chip

to plug a roo, and dingo scalps arnt worth what they were.

But Otherwise i love ya planned trip TALLYHOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!

Well I have an amendment to make, earlier on I said that I had visited LE south about 6 times and flown over it twice. I would now like to add one more visit in The Tardis, no not really, but definitely one on the Old Ghan Railway when the line passed within a few hundred yards of the shoreline near Curdimurka , where we will camp for the kickoff point, if it gets off the ground.

The Ghan rail service connects southern Australia to the north at Darwin via Alice Springs in the centre. Has now been moved a lot, lot further west, away from the original route to Alice. The problem was that the old alignment crossed so much low country thru which many rivers, usually dry disgorge their collective volumes after heavy weather events, dislocating the lifeline north and south.

The replacement alignment heads north thru lands that present a more hospitable engineering access from the Transcontinental [Sydney-Perth] line. Tarcoola was chosen as the take off junction point about 500-550 ks west and running almost parallel to the old Ghan. It still suffers debilitating rain events that only occasionally cause the line to close for a few days. That’s the uncertainty
of all of central or outback Australia, and will be always so, forever.

Now I have to reply to questions that Gizmo has posted earlier. Thanks Gizmo. You have asked, “ How far would you expect to travel each day? “
To this the political answer must be, how long is a piece of string? No not really, that’s a smart arse answer and serves no one any good.

According to my research, distance daily traveled can be only answered by the conditions of the lake on the day, relating to prevailing weather, just like any other sailing event. And here I would like to say that Young Jessica Watson , so close to fulfilling her ambition/dream is experiencing a fairly rough time crossing The Great Australian Bight, Stick to it Jess! You will make it.

My own expectations like any other event running to a time frame are worked out at distance that could be feasible, every timetable does this. But it may not be doable on the day for a myriad of reasons. However the distances that I have already posted in earlier posts range from about 30 k’s up to around 60’s. One could half that distance per day and still cover it in a week all going well.

As stated earlier it is not a race, it may not be a picnic, it may be a slog and it is certainly a challenge, an expidisatory challenge. Similar to one I had earlier, sailing a 14 foot Caper Cat from Mossman to Cook Town in 1981. We were heading for Thursday Island. Anyone tried that? That is a story for around the campfire. So Gizmo a definitive answer I cannot give, you have made your point.

Gizmo then asks, “ What happens if there is no wind when you are many k;s onto the lake, “
Short answer, like all sailing you sit around in irons, scratching yu posterior wondering why the bloody hell am I here. Read a book, have a cup of tea, face the west with a prayer mat and beg for breeze, or worse than that get on every ones else’s nerves. Someone always has a deck of cards, Procrastinate, or keep you mind on the challenge at hand, remain focused, reassess your game and plan the continuing strategy. Debrief your efforts so far and that of the team.

Some would say there is naught to do in this situation, I don’t. I say there is plenty, tweaking, maintenance, resting, cleaning, checking, string a tarp for shade the list goes on and on. It could be derigging as there is a thunderstorm about. One does what one must do to continue when conditions are more favorable. You may run a radio check or sked with the support crew or do some signal light flashing, an earlier form of communication still very effective.

Not unlike a sports coach thing need to be attended to, little things can grow so a watchful eye is always cast for problematic things

Next Question from Gizmo is “ What happens if an individual or the whole group gets bogged? ‘

This is not a sailboat problem but yes, it could be a scenario we could encounter, like most things access the situations and after the profanity has subsided ask for intelligent input. Reassess your route, is it as feasible as first thought, is there a better way, have we as like a bulk ore ship strayed off course. Establish quickly who is to blame and cricket them [sledge]

Usually when this situation arises everyone stops and helps the individual, then after being nice, castigate them. If all are bogged, then as in off road driving and on road driving choose the least bogged,. Help them out as a team effort and progressively work at it until you have conquered the problem.

Australia throws up many challenges and many times traveling on outback highways an extreme weather condition has caught many people out. I have been in situations where as many as 16 Tourist coaches were caught out in the open from Woomera after a five inch downpour. We were the only ones traveling north and after fighting the camber of the road for some miles I stopped and told everyone onboard, that tonight we will be sleeping on board.

What fun the Under 30’s on their way to Darwin said. Ha, Ha, the farting , fornicating and snoring was something to be experienced. The Onboard toilet soon filled and the aroma was well strong. Card games such as strip jack started happening. If only mummy could have seen there little darlings, animals. Personal air fresheners and exotic scents permeated the air.

One had to walk outside and walk at least 100 meters away from the coach to defecate. The ground was baby poo, stick to the blanket style and you would build up your shoes by about 100mm with clay before 1 heel would fall off and then you stumbled along.

The steps into the coach clogged up with mud and the front seats had mud up higher than the seat arms. Down the back near the toilet door the mud tapered out to about 100 mm thick, and that’s how we stayed all night.

Next day piccinny dawn there were hundreds of people walking toward us, all off busses and private motorists, abandoning their transport and walking some over 40 k’s to Pimba, we cooked our crowd breakfast as we were a camping tour, then set about with shovels cleaning out the coach before it all set rock hard.

As the crown of the road steadily dried out, some played games and others attended their ablutions. The road rescue team came out in very big 4x4 tractors and as we were the only coach traveling north we were told to sit tight until all the south bound traffic was cleared, most of which was bogged deep in the table drains because they continued to drive , skating all over the road until they ended up off of it.

I went to start my machine and the starter would not engage into the fly wheel so I had to slither under and remove the started then strip it and clean the mud about the consistency of premixed araldite before it goes off. The front wheels had sprayed water and clay material until it completely clogged up the operation of a heavy duty truck starter motor in a distance from Pimba of around 10 k’s

That wasn’t the last of it for that trip, much more was to come, which is also good campfire material. A mate of mine driving south on an accommodated trip put all his mob into a motel and his coach on a low loader and we stopped to talk with him trackside later in the day when we got moving, just before more rain started falling.

The Real answer Gizmo is to deal with it.!

Next question, “ What is the accident/ emergency plan ? Flying Doc/helicopters won’t land on salt lakes.”

Short, deal with it to the best of your/my ability, there will be emergency contact, sat phones, radio, smoke, eperbs all the best available equipment that is for hire, paid for from the levee mentioned earlier.

Much generals medical equipment will be in personal medical kits and some action will be taken with those partaking to distribute this and not over duplicates everything, that’s planning. We will be nearly as effective as a RFDF medicine kit.

I hope that people will take the lead up time to maybe renew their first aid certificate and likewise things. I am hoping our forum moderator may extend some input and advise those here in this forum what would be considered helpful. I believe he has some considerable experience here..

I have had many occasions when I have been first at the scene of an incident. So far I have not been the cause of death. I believe I am fairly competent and my own reaction to a situation seems to be more or less natural and helpful. I am always ready and indeed grateful to hand over to someone more senior at the scene than me, although that does not always happen as text books say.

Once in the very heart of Melbourne waiting to load my passengers and head off to northern Australia, for a few weks. A very serious motor prang occurred twenty meters away as someone, running late turned in front of someone else. For a few moments there was carnage and then silence as a few hundred people stopped and stared.

There was only one person who reacted, dressed to impress in the short sleeved safari jacket suit with matching shorts and long white socks raced over and helped the bewildered , blood streaming driver from his vehicle and applying pressure to a very bad head wound. After a minute or so a person came up and said “ I am a doctor, your doing fine, the ambulance is on its way, keep the pressure on….see ya !!”. well I won out there, my passengers or at least the single women were impressed as I found out later, nudge , nudge, wink, wink, say no more Bro.

Ever removed a tomahawk from the scull of an outdoors man on the side of an outback road, patched him up a bit and filled his water tin . Then watched as he took to the bush, least the udder blokes catch him with nutha mans woman agen.

Or being woken out of a deep sleep by tribal ladys with a sick kid . “Hey mida Joe me gottun slich bebe here, nedum elp qic mida Joe” Baby survived maybe I helped, they all wandered back to their own camp around daylight.

An emergency is attended to as millions of people have done from when time
Began. You do your best with what you have, if you don’t have it you improvise, as best you can and with the patient in mind, even his comfort but saying that, lots of diggers copped harsher treatment than they deserved. Such as our second last VC winner in Nam who is said to have rescued 40 of his mates single handed. Just do it was how he read it. Pulled them all off a hill overnight most wounded or at least suffering, single handed. Was that an emergency or what ?

I could go on and on here with my own reactions and exploits but I don’t want too. They are only examples, most people have them whether they wish to discuss then in an open forum is a for all to be their own judge. A question was asked, an answer was expected, that’s life, my life for which I am not sorry. Lots have not lived like me, they did not choose to do what I have done. Most people have no idea of what others have done , someone had to do it….. And Love It

The Second part of Gizmo’s questions concerned flying Doctors and Helicopters and I cannot talk on this subject without a bit of a ramble, to me, but to others who do not know much of this type of occurrence, and maybe following this very forum. I will have to provide some intelligent and factual back grounding. There will I am sure, be absolute experts out there who know more of the finer points than I. I am going to give the outback introduction to real eggbeater madness.
You probably have to have been involved with choppers on site to understand the truth is zanier than fiction. Helicopter pilots only lie when their lips are moving.

Giz...... its only me here, you will get all the information you want in good time
chew over what's there for now, more coming soon and your big important query will be dealt with. I have already done hour and hours of work here and will not be stampeded. It is very important what you are pointing out, and i will give you my initial thoughts and actions for you and others to criticize soon enough. I am man enough for that.

OK there has been some behind the scenes toing and froing. I see that Giz has

posted a big big caution and our moderator has placed his own concerns and

that of the site Seabreeze by Pm to me. At this point I should make it clear

that this is a discussion forum for something that may or may not be

feasable, All should read it in full and understand the implications that they

may or may not read into this. I prefer for all disscussion be out front , i

realise that behind the scenes disscusion is on the move. I cannot release

PM messages i recieve without the ok from the originator.

just received in the post , i should have been home earlier yesterday

From my favorite map shop and ex co worker owner [declared] up to the

minute maps of the lake and surrounds. Topographical maps, NOOLYEANA

sheet SG53-16 South Australia which deals with the top third of Lake Eyre.

2nd map...LAKE EYRE sheet SH53-04 South Australia the middle sheeet.

3rd map... CURDIMURKA sheet SH5308 South Australia the bottom sheet.

Along with the HEMA state general road and place map of South Australia.

Possibly the best available. If you have never even looked at the area

in this vein, then maybe you are at a loss of the suitability of your own

knowledge . Do not dream, unless you research hard fact

A foot note, my mate Garry when showing me round his and the boys property, where big numbers of fine looking merinos were chewing grass and waiting to drop their new lambs. Fat and in the peak health, as all pregnant females look. We spotted the first lamb to drop, so there may be a very watchful week ahead for Garry. Have you ever seen that? Add that to my CV.

At this very moment on ABC radio Sunday with Macca, who is talking with Mr John Laws an Australian radio announcer ledgend. Probably the finest moment in radio history is taking place now, this is live history. Sorry Giz, gotta get into you now

Let me start by saying that no matter where one is or what the circumstances are in an emergency you do what is necessary to help the final outcome. A lot can depend on ones own knowledge and abilities. When in territory unfamiliar to ones-self a bit of pre investigation seems to be a fair thing to be expected of any sane person. Most people perform fairly good under these pressures or circumstances depending on your term of language, some don’t.

Now I know that , that is not an acceptable answer for some people here. I haven’t allowed any fat to be placed in front of the multitude to be mutilated.
There will be some big statements coming and some may take indignant offence to what I may write, but unless they have had my experiences in the line in question, then I would make the prediction that you haven’t much practical experiences in life.

To kick off, in Australia you don’t even own your own body when you die, it is surrendered to the Government coroner until he is happy with the circumstances of the death. Until that point there is no death certificate issued. The coroner etc will do anything with the tax payers money to find and retrieve a body. It is happening all the time. So a fatality has no say, they become guests of the government, unwittingly, that can upset a few people.

Next time you fly, especially to or from remote, air strips watch carefully as the aircraft you are flying to fly in is loaded. Yep, there is a coffin going into the cargo bay, maybe, and they have deceased in them. You could be sitting on top of one as they take on their third last trip on this planet. Down to the coroner they go to have a thorough inspection and dissection before being air freighted back to partake in the final couple on ks journey out to the local cemetery.

So where bad things happen, the government take over as soon as they are advised of something that has occurred. Reporting agencies monitor everything that is said or done. The first report of an incident sets the wheels in motion, in a lot of cases, they arrive before you would think it able to be done.

Sometimes in the shape of a rescue type helicopter equipped with winch gear so it doesn’t have to land on salt etc if they don’t want to do so for what ever reason..

Here I must say that I have worked with helicopters for about one year in remote Australia. The company that employed me also hired the Helicopter company. If our company wanted to sample on a salt lake or where ever and the pilot didn’t want to oblige or was afraid to . Then he may be given a bus ticket back to wherever he came from and someone else would be flown in very quickly to pilot that machine special charter.

Other Helicopter companies hang around like hawks vying to land the contract.
The politics was interesting. None of your city amby pamby crap out there in the real world. Money is the only bargaining chip and if your aircraft don’t fly , then they don’t earn,

I have flown with Indian , Korean, Sth African, Lebanese, Egyptian, Australian, Americian, New Zealander and British, fixed wing and rotary wing pilots. A lot of them ex military trained, and the humble aussie bush pilot who probably never had any real training except sitting their license, male and female. But they fly their paddocks and land wherever. They tend to lend a hand when needed, sometimes to their own staff and loved ones. That is what Australia is about and how it behaves outside the confines of regulation. Stories I could tell, but not here, come join the camp fire, next year. Learn a thing or two.

Now a nasty incident has happened, first check your own safety, next access the situation. Pick out the hopeless cases, don’t waste a lot of time here, next the ones that need the most help and start your work here, the less injured will endure and possible recover slightly. Make your report by your back up systems and quickly get back to the causalities, delegate if there are others who have survived, radio monitors, landing strip finders and makers, comfort people, refreshment bringers, traffic controllers etc.

Check the breathing, find the tongue clear the airway, maybe the coma position control the bleeding…pressure , commence cpr 1.2.3.4.etc. comfort for shock, brush away the tears and flys. Be cheerful and reassuring.

If suitable remove client out of harms way, gently of course. When you get the time attend to them and listen to their story. Have someone make a cup o tea. Attend to the advise you are receiving over the rad phone of radio.

Set up a smoke signal if need be, anyone got the matches, there are no smokers here. Rub two sticks together vigorously. Better still get someone else to do that.
Get your signal mirror from your pocket to alert and assist approaching assistance aircraft. How am I going …huh, about the same as you I expect.

Has that bloke come back yet with a possible landing site selected, do we need any trees or bushes trimmed, could there be time to drag a strip with your motor and a tree tied to a rope or chain, maybe use your spare tyre as a drag. Set up a tempory wind soc or flag or toilet paper. Tins with petrol/oil soaked earth ?

By this time one should be understanding the possibility of bad injuries and maybe some form for dressings are being applied. Maybe shade needs to be found or erected over an immovable client. Throw detol on every one, or mercurochrome. Band aids, plaster, slings [bras].

Hey that bloke needs to be moved, maybe put he on a sail and carry that or pull it across the mud flat. First outside helpers are starting to turn up. The local ambulance, the back of a ute, volunteers their here in big mobs helping. That’s the Australia way as I would see it Giz. Basically just do it again ! hectic but affective, look to your own problems when everyone else is sorted.

So how did i do outa ten Giz, what did you score, your still OK

Phew it's been busy, i'm buggered two hours early , I think i'll have a cuppa

and watch some real, real tv.....Landline ABC of course

it's ok to have dreams, if people didn't dream we wouldn't have gone to the moon,,,however having said that for many years i was a member of the SES which is the state emergency service and i can recall many a time being called out to rescuse someone who had gone off un prepaired and under equiped for the journey that they were under taking,, depending on the time of year that you expect to be going you would need at least 10 lites of water per person per day even though you may not epect to be doing much you'll still sweat, water weight aprox 1 kilogram per liter,, there is a lot of weight just in water alone,,,, what happens when you get into trouble, and murphys law says you will,,, how do you contact help, i doubt that a mobile phone would work, a sat phone maybe but how would you keep it charged up for the amount of time needed,, a phone is just a brick if it doesn't work,,,then what about the one's that have to risk their safety to come and rescue you or a member of the party,,, don't get me wrong it good to dream, hell i do it all the time but without plenty of carefull planing the dream becomes a nightmare for everyone...
bb

Beachball
have an old trukin mate who thinks he knows you.
All of what you say is important, correct, cautious and I have taken that on board, this is a discussion, as one would around a table with a group. So it is here.

Our Table is the internet and we don’t sit shoulder to shoulder. We can be many, many moons apart, but in this modern day and age all are able to partake having a say. Some people may even be outside Australia, heaven forbid.

There is nothing to stop you having your say, doing an in depth post on water, for instance. You have bought up some points there. Put your knowledge out in front, lead. It won’t frazzle me, and would be considered fair comment and builds the factual knowledge base for all. If you have the time, or interest to do it.

I am trying to say things in an orderly manner, so that others can think about it all. Why in this very forum I have seen posts of The Lake, mainly misleading thru lack of real knowledge or research, back grounding. Just like your SES training, we do this subject, then that one, pass one then move on until we become the trainer. Then, “ We look as full of knowledge as a fourty acre college “

Also I am sorta forced to stand up to the Young Bulls, who simply may not have the discipline or way with all or knowledge to present.

The ones who would shout you down because your old, and they consider you/me to be past our use by date, Some who normally don’t post here, but are full of vindication and maybe other things. So in time all your points will be addressed


Wheelnut,
do you happen to be the person of that name who I had the misfortune of having to work with on some job. If not, you behave in the same manner. I think it is you who is raving/ranting. As they say, a man will lead, women scream.

Regular young bull/old bull, or father/son action going on here. Go away, check your spleen for rust.

i'm not saying that i have a problem with what joe wants to do i'm sure many people told Sir Edmund Hillary the same thing when he said he was going to climb mount everest, what i'm sying is form a rescure point of view, murphys law states that if it can go wrong it will, and well me personally i just don't think it's such a good idea, and also from an enviromental point of view the lake has such a fradgile eco system i wonder if you'd get permission to drive/sail on it anyway, water sailing doesn't have the same after effect all these things don't seem to be taken into account, it's all well and good to just go boldly where no one has gone before but you're gunna look pretty stupid if it all comes unstuck. that was just my thought, if you want an adventure why not sail across the nulllabor plains from end to end or something like that it's still an adventure,, joe, all this young bulls and old bull is just bull i don't think age has got anything to do with it, some people have the ability to explain themselves and some don't, i have read many of you posts and i mst admit have wondered on more than one occasion what they had to do with land sailing, but again maybe that was just me and the way i looked at it,, i have lived and worked in the bush on sheep and cattle stations and i think that some places are just not ment to be disturded by vehicles wind powered or otherwise.
bb

Well, Im realy glad some people are oposing my views, that is what it is all

about, discussion of the pros and cons of the idea. Informed input is great,

put in your knowledge then defend it amongst the forum. Nothing new, it

goes on on life every where, even truckies waffle on the UHP about all sorts

of things that effect them,, with lots of profanity sometimes. And maybe on

channel 40 , one may like to scream into the micro phone....GET OFF YA

MUG!! actually they may be good blokes to boot. AS with TV that you may

perceive as crap, you don't have to watch it. this disscussion is clearly labled.

If you dont like , then you, don't have to read it. If you don't like the way or

idiocy of how i write my posts then that is to bad, do better. I am different to

most other labeled land yachters, could i be called a specialist or a crank

with all your knowledge , you can work that out.

Now on with personal toys/appointments, A note pad and pencil/biro, a compass, and of course a pocket knife. A good quality so called, swiss mulit function one is great, realize at all times that what you purchase has a real price. Something ones are sold real cheap, seemingly bargains, although it may look the same as a pricy and good quality one, could be compromised by inferior steel, whatever.

A compass on the salt is needed, quite often you would not be able to see anything on the horizons and will need the assistance of a good compass. Once again a cheap orienteering compass would be not suitable. A quality dampening prismatic compass, new around $60 is what’s needed. Sometimes these can be picked up at garage sales, but be cautious. If the past owner had no respect for his, or no understanding, they can sustain damage, that could cause incorrect readings.

Get the little Printed flyer from a good map shop, which instructs on the usage of maps and how to read and intemperate them with the aide of compasses. Free!!
Read carefully and practice what is being said, don’t rely on mates knowledge.

If you have a cheap life then buy cheap gear, if you want to have the best chance of not landing in the headlines thru your own stupidity, then don’t buy crap.

A handheld GPS is a good tool to assist with your passage in these circumstances. A Tomtom etc is of little or no advantage. It is really a back to basics here, back it up with the purchase of topographic maps.

A personal Epirb or emergency beacon is a good thing, however one has to be level headed enough only to use it in dyer situations. Don’t panic. If in your pocket and it takes a knock or bump and is accidentally switched on. Then Australia has started putting into action rescue plans for the signal they are receiving. Panic !!

We will have the required radio and rad phone hired for the occasion. These will be our major contact channels. Every unit on the lake would have to have a UHF radio, hand held is ok but not easy to use at all times. Some battery charging will be available from solar panels thru cigarette lighter plug in sockets.

Out there as some have already said, You are in the no service available zone of Australia, to any mobile phone service. 80 percent of Australian people are contactable by mobiles. The 15 – 20 percent who live and work in the remote areas, 80 percent of landmass, the biggest area of Australia are not on the network. Yet . Nutha 10 + – years away. Unless of course a big mine is opened up close by, or you receive moneys from the government because you are an indigenous concern. That is fair.

My research tells me that there is what is referred to as a slush band on some area of the lake. Roma Dalhunty says that a pair of snow shoes can be of assistance on some occasions. Seems feasible to me, from the garage sales a couple of strong old tennis racquets could be a helpful purchase. Make a couple of boot straps, put a sheet of light plastic over the underside of the strings, with
Silocone then cut off the handles, may do the job. It’s very light too.

We will talk about all that later on, there is a lot to say and learn. So the next post will be on our or your perceived landyachts suitability or drawbacks.

joe
i honestly do not believe you are serious, tennis rackets for snow shoes or in this case mud shoes, i was perparied to defend your rite to do what ever the hell you want but you are just asking for trouble, and now i must think to myself that you're having a lend of everyone,,, if you ever do go ahead and go on this now crazy adventure PLEASE let me know so that i can tell my friends in the SES in the north of our state to get out of town, because sure as **** they'll be going to rescue your butt from the world of trouble you're gunna get yourself into..
somethings are do'able some are not i'd say this is like setting sail for america in a bath tub, do'able but not a wise move i would have thought still it takes all sorts i guess,
bb

youre right giz but you know the story you can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink,,,,,,,,,,,,,ive said all i'm gunna say on the matter anyway
bb