Forums > Land Yacht Sailing General

The lathe thread

Reply
Created by hills > 9 months ago, 20 Jul 2008
hills
SA, 1622 posts
20 Jul 2008 11:18AM
Thumbs Up

Ok Iand and Kody's build threads are making me even more interested in getting a metal lathe and I thought rather than hi-jacking their threads I'd start a new one.

A quick look on ebay shows there is a huge variation in prices. All I would want would be a fairly small lathe to turn wheel stubs and steering components plus numerous other more intricate jobs that don't relate to landyachts. I would really like to be able to cut threads as well which I assume would require some sort of gearing to move the lathe tool at the correct rate(?) or should I just stick to the tap & dies for this?

Can any of the lathe savvy landyacht pilots advise what would be the price range or even better still what make and model would achieve this at the lowest price and what else will I want, but just don't know that I want it yet? For the amount of work I'd be doing I think Cisco's cooling system would suffice.

Gizmo
SA, 2865 posts
20 Jul 2008 2:17PM
Thumbs Up

A lathe similar to a computer the question is often asked "what size"
it comes down to how much $$$$ do you want to spend?
What size work will it be used for?
How much room do you have?
How much work do you have for it?
Does it have a single or 3 phase motor?
Most lathes offer thread cutting and power feeds.
I was fortunate that my lathe was bought for only one job which payed for it,
and have used it a lot since for various other projects.
Mine has a 150mm swing and 300m between centres and with an overhead mill (and in realistic terms a small lathe)
I have only had 2 occasions where i couldnt do what i wanted to do, i needed a MUCH bigger lathe anyway. On those occasions I found other engineers that could do the work for me.
I know this may not answer your questions directly but should start you thinking.


Kody
QLD, 190 posts
20 Jul 2008 4:00PM
Thumbs Up

Hi Hillsie,
Its wonderful to see your interest in lathes. There are lots of do's and dont's to wade through but you are on the right track to start here with your post.
Firstly, you certainly get what you pay for when buying a lathe. Be very wary of the cheap Asian stuff coming into the country, some is real cheap and nasty. Have a long hard think about what you want to do and then think what you would really love to do in maybe a couple of years time. Build land yachts now and perhaps venture out into the world of live steam loco's later on or maybe a turbine or IC engine, a single or multi cylinder? What you decide to do (buy) now will affect what you can build some years down the track.
The following will help out in the short term.
Dont buy (NEVER) any tungsten carbide tool sets for a small lathe. Dont even buy the offered HSS (High Speed Steel) sets either. Carbide tools need heaps of horsepower and very rigid machines to use the stuff successfully. You're far better off buying HSS as a "stick" when you need it.
I find it is very economical to buy 3/16 sq. ($7.00 per 3" length) HSS. Sure. it is small but you can take a 3/16" deep cut in steel when you have to, albeit, not at high rpms.
It's not hard to make a custom tool holder for this size tool steel and it would make a great project for later when you become proficient with the lathe.
Always buy top quality HSS for machining.
A lathe with a "V" bed is probably the best for long life and long term accuracy. The "flat" bed is best as you can use it like a surface plate, ie, measure from a fixed surface and heaps of other things.
Most of all, you want a bed that is hardened. My Myford is flat bed and soft. After 40 years plus, it is showing some wear but not critical for most jobs.
Being an "Imperial" person, I would make sure that you can get an Imperial kit to add to the lathe. This kit consists of an 8 TPI leadscrew plus the various gears to set it up. It is far easier to cut Imperial threads on an Imperial lathe set-up than metric threads on a metric lathe.
A long Cross Slide and long C/S travel is worth your last drop of blood, especialy if the slide top surface comes with "T" slots.
There are lots of accessories that make lathe operation so much easier and happier. Most of these can also be made by you and the $ savings are huge. I have lots of drawings for accessories from a book I produced in the USA that will give you all the details and design. These were drawn for beginners in machining when I worked as an instructor at a college.
Dont buy a small cheap Chinese chuck for a lathe. Many of these cheap chucks have a "thread" on the jaws that is very thin and weak. The "threads" snap off and the chuck is destroyed. Save up, (rob your wife or husband, no! dont do that ) and buy a high quality English chuck like a Burnard (Burnerd ?). You will never regret spending the extra money. I have a 4 inch 3 jaw and a 6 inch 4 jaw.
Keep in mind that a "7 inch" lathe will only alow you to machine the extreme ends of a 7" diameter round job. A 7" lathe can only swing a 4" dia. job over the cross slide and alow you to work on the middle section of the job.
A lathe that will accomodate 18" between centers will certainly do all your general needs and is much cheaper than a longer model.
Trying to produce threads with taps and dies is for the most part, difficult to do with accuracy, very frustrating and can be expensive to buy. When you have a thread cutting lathe, you will almost never use a die.

users.tpg.com.au/users/p8king/tl4000.htm
http://www.myfordmachinetools.com.au/

Gizmo
SA, 2865 posts
20 Jul 2008 5:10PM
Thumbs Up

Something to do on a wet cold Sunday afternoon ... machine some class 5 hubs to suit scaffold tube.....

Nas
VIC, 45 posts
20 Jul 2008 7:09PM
Thumbs Up

Theres a few different types of lathes..

Centre, capstan and turret...

You prolly want a centre lathe for what you want to do.

A 4 jaw chuck and dial indicator are worthwile accessories with any lathe.

If theres any wear in the bed, a 4 jaw chuck will help offset this and keep acuracy between centres as the tailstock may not be dead centre.

Check the carraige for any evidence of collisions if you go second hand.

A set of dead centres is crucial also as live centres tend to wobble over time.

English lathes are the best.

hills
SA, 1622 posts
20 Jul 2008 7:22PM
Thumbs Up

Excellent thanks Giz, Kody, Arjay and Nas. That's exactly the type of info I'm after. I'm thinking I'll look for a secondhand English model rather than a new Chinese type.

Funny you should mention steam engines Joe, that's something that really interests me. My father was a member of the Australian Railways Hysterical Historical Society (AKA a train spotter), so I grew up around them and would love to build one, I just don't think my boiler making skills are quite up to it as yet but thanks to this forum I'm learning a lot every day

cisco
QLD, 12326 posts
21 Jul 2008 3:20AM
Thumbs Up

To own your own metal lathe is a magical thing. If you wish to do that, consultation with your female counterpart prior to taking that step is well advised.

If that one objects to your having a mistress the step is ill advised.

I completed my apprenticeship on a Nuttall. I believe they were Australian made. If you want to have a new lathe I think there is no choice but to buy Chinese or Taiwanese as it appears everyone else has lost the plot. Mind you they are churning out some pretty good machines these days. Check out "Hare and Forbes" at www.machineryhouse.com.au. For around $1300 they will sell you a machine similar to but probably better than Gizmo's Lathe/ mill/drill.

For $3,000 they will sell you a 300mm swing, 910mm hardened ground precision gap (450mm) V bed lathe with cam lock spindle, 75-1400 rpm, 38mm bore, auto long and cross feed, imperial lead screw, quick change gears for metric, 3 & 4 jaw chucks, face plate, thread chaser, fixed and travelling steadies, dead centre, spanners, toolbox stand and instruction booklet etc, etc, etc.

Second hand lathes can be a bargain though. Look at Kody's. He has had it for 40 years but does admit it is showing signs of wear. But Kody is a toolmaker/gunsmith and he knows how to compensate and also how to look after a lathe. What's it really worth Kody. You wouldn't sell it anyway would you mate?

Hang on "Farmer Brown" down the road wants to sell his lathe sitting in his open farm shed. Only $1200, that's not bad but I'll have to take that 3 phase motor off and put a single phase on. Oh, it's missing a few of the gears but I only use it for turning up bushes for the tractor implements. Does that real good. Yeah it got a bit rusty when it got rained on but I cleaned that off the bed with a bit of emery tape. I got some more bits for it in the back of the shed here but I never used them. Dunno what that's for.

Caveat emptor. Let the buyer beware. A last thought. If you are going to buy a lathe, make sure it is of heirloom quality because you might not get enough use out of it before your heir looms up. Adios Amigos.

iand
QLD, 243 posts
21 Jul 2008 8:01AM
Thumbs Up

In my opinion regards thread cutting DON'T throw out your tap and die, use them in conjunction with the lathe. If the job is still in the lathe put the drill attachment in the tail stock and use it to square up the die. Turning a thread is easy like most things once you know how- setup of gears, shape of tool, depth of cut, and depending on the job and lathe setup if run the lathe or turn it over by hand.
I suddenly realized while typing that an explanation of what a 3 and 4 jaw chuck are, may be needed- A 3 jaw is self centering like your drill (but not accurate for mounting/remounting), a 4 jaw you adjust the jaws one at a time, so you will need a dial indicator to use it affectively.
Center to center turning- can be an alternative to using a 4 jaw chuck and dial indicator on some jobs, but I tend to use the 4 jaw and dial indicator over the 3 jaw or center to center most of the time.
Offset turning- will allow you to turn long tapers



Subscribe
Reply

Forums > Land Yacht Sailing General


"The lathe thread" started by hills