Hi all, First of all I have to apologise for 'crashing' your forum, I do not sail at all, the reason i have signed in is because i need your help to Identify a 'Mystery rope'. Why am i asking, well i am a Caver....and i have been 'given' a new rope which was identified to me as a Tendon Static rope,[or mammut rope] i was going to use it for cave access, but when i inspected the rope it did not fit the usual braid size weave etc for abseil rope. After exhaustive 'asking around' the general consensus is that it is a sailing 'rope' [sorry for any incorrect terminology etc]. Can anyone positively indentify this rope?
The sheath is White with 2 Red squares separated by 1 white square, size is 10.0 or 10.5mm, there are 6x'S' strands and 7x 'Z' strands, the rope does not have any external ID marks on the ends. Inside the rope is a Black thread and a twisted Red/Blue thread indentifier. [see pic]. An internal ID Tape is not present. We thought it was maybe Tendon or Mammut [Performance Static 10 mm].
Tendon have said it is not one of theirs. Mammut have not answered, [yet] the remaining manufacturers that i have found with this colour rope have stated on their web pages that they use an Internal Tape Id, so I have not bothered to ask. Obviously safety is paramount, so before we go putting people on the rope we would like to be sure of its original and suitability. If you are able to assist with the ID that would be great.
I look forward to your ideas, many thanks Ric.
The only " rope " on a boat is the anchor rope .
It isn't an anchor rope .
The other long tangly things are called sheets and halyards and braces .
Sorry that is as far as my smart arse / ass comments can go .
I know nothing , nuuuuuuuuthhhhhhhhingggggg.
Definitely a double braid rope. A staple on most mid-range yachts but I'm not sure of it's suitability for climbing. I'm guessing you guys have different requirements as far as stretch and shock absorbance are concerned.
The brand Sampson comes to mind. Marlow is another one.
Strictly speaking, it's not double braid - the inner part is half a dozen separate twisted sections, not a braid. I have several older ropes with similar construction on my boat, probably put there when she was commissioned about 10 years ago. But any braided ropes I've bought from marine suppliers in recent years have all been true double braids.
I've never seen the internal coloured marker twines in a marine rope. Are you sure that's not what the climbing rope suppliers are talking about when they mention an internal tape ID?
And to me, it's always rope when you buy it, and stays that way until it is put to a specific use - then it becomes a halyard, sheet, uphaul, brace, line, etc - or even anchor rope.
It does look like a sail sheet! You could try contacting the Sydney heritage Fleet ask for Morrin or Lesley Grigg they run the TOM MORT ROPE AND RIGGING COURSE and thay have a exceptional knownledge of rope, knots, spicing and rigging, I'm sure they could help.
Morrin Grigg, Course Convener, 9871 7919
Keithw
I have been selling and splicing yachting ropes for 10 years and it is nothing like anything I have seen in Oz.
My guess is it not a sailing rope or if it is it is of a cheaper quality as sailing ropes are made to splice (usually) and splicing this would be terrible!!
I would say a climbing rope as it looks to me like it might have quite a bit of stretch in itas all the layers compact together.
Try Whittams Ropes in Melbourne for more info. Ray has been making ropes for years.
FWIW, I am a lead rock climber, and a canyoner. I have dabbled in caving; read overalls over a wetsuit and multiple headtorches - ugh! (Have also crewed a few blue-water classics).
Most caving chat I've noticed seems to be on the (Yahoo) OzCanyons site - and that is limited. You could try adventurepro - but that site does not have very much traffic at all. The main Australian rock-climbing forum is Chockstone. Dribs and drabs of info in these old threads;
www.chockstone.org/Forum/Forum.asp?Action=Display&ForumID=6&MessageID=9461&Replies=6
www.chockstone.org/Forum/Forum.asp?Action=Display&ForumID=6&MessageID=15535&Replies=16
"...i have been 'given' a new rope which was identified to me as a Tendon Static rope,[or mammut rope] i was going to use it for cave access"
Mammut are a brand of rock and mountaineering climbing rope. I thought Tendon would be a model of Mammut rope, but google shows no model of Mammut rope called 'Tendon'.
Mammut rock and mountaineering ropes are made in Switzerlandhttp://www.mammut.ch/en/productOverview/products_ropes_static_ropes_international/Static-Ropes.html
Tendon ropes are manufactured in the Czech Republic www.tendonropes.com.au/
"Obviously safety is paramount, so before we go putting people on the rope we would like to be sure of its original and suitability."
I have asked questions about some of my many carabiners and rappel racks in the past, only to be told, if you are worried about any of your gear in the slightest, stop using it....
I used to do a fair bit of rock-climbing when I was younger. The main thing is to only use "life-support" rope that was designed for that purpose, additionally you need to know the history of every life support rope you have or intend to use. A mate got home one day & his flat-mates where using his climbing rope to tow one of their car up the hill!! He had to retire the rope.
Climbing ropes (as do all life support ropes) have a limited life-span, & need to be retired. Amongst other things....dirt works its way into the rope & wears it from the inside.
Not worth the risk of using an unknown rope & its history, even if it were just for your exclusive use....but definitely putting other people onto it is a no-no.
Caving & canyoning ropes have a hard life.
cheers
Here are a few methods of mast climbing for appraisal and opinion sharing. Sorry for completing the hijacking of the thread but it has already gone in this direction.
Does anybody here have experience with any of them or know of any failures with any of them??
www.atninc.com/atn-mastclimber-sailing-equipment.shtml
I am not fussed on this "Mastmate". Looks very dangerous to me.
mastmate.com/
This one looks good using the same principle as the mast climber but has a cam cleat type gripper for the halliard. I would suggest a line between the grippers to limit the distance between them just in case the grippers get too far apart for your reach.
www.topclimber.us/
There are mast steps, fixed and folding but I have never liked them. Apart from fouling halliards etc they also reduce sailing efficiency with their windage and increase weight aloft.
I once hoisted a friend up a mast which had a Lewmar "self tailing" winch on it which turned out to be a "self Jamming " winch. The top jaw of the tailer, the line stripper and the retaining nut of the winch were one and the same cast component. As the line was gripped by the jaws it tightened the top of the winch onto the drum and jammed it solid. Mate's bosun's chair was a sling type with no base board so his cods got a good old squeezing for the hour it took to get him down.
That was a very simple and basic design fault which for me has blown all credibility for Lewmar products.
A few safety rules I suggest for mast climbing:-
1. NEVER do it alone. ALWAYS have an assistant on deck who understands how to lower you down with the halliard clipped to your bosun's chair at one end and with two or more turns around the halliard winch at the other.
2. ALWAYS use a bosun's chair with a base board in it. If you are stuck aloft in a sling type chair, it will cause physical stress which in time may cause you to lose consciousness.
3. Take a plastic bottle of water aloft with you.
4. As possible have all tools secured to the chair with lanyards to avoid dropping them on your assistant on deck.
5. NEVER go up the mast of a yacht on hard stand.
This is a good article that covers different methods of mast climbing and reiterates the need for safety back up.
www.goodoldboat.com/reader_services/articles/upthemast.php
Here is a home grown article on the subject from Freemantle Sailing Club in pdf that you can save to your HDD.
www.fsc.com.au
Hi Guys
Ok first of all I'm a crap speller and as I have't been able to find a spell check on this this thing you will just have to deal with my spelling.
First of all a climbing rope is constructed to strech so that when a leader falls the rope act like a rubber band absorbing the engery from the distance that the climber has fallen, thus not stopping him with a hard jolt, causing injury. The construction of a clinbing rope is a bunch of single fine fillaments running the full length of the rope incased in a sheeth, these ropes are known as DYNAMIC ropes. Absailing, Caving and Sailing ropes are known as static ropes, as the last thing you would want is for these ropes to strech in these activities. Construction is usualy plated or braided rope inside a sheath. This sheeth is known the kermantal ( if my spelling is correct) on both type of ropes, it's purpose is to protect the construction of the rope where the real strength is. Two different types of rope for two different types of uses, But both look the same from the out side.
Dear ricweb Ring Donaghys and speek to one of their rep's. They sell Ropes for All activites and can best advise you.
You have to think about getting down too!,
I use the "Prussik Knot" see example via link at the end of presentation in cisco's link. Prussik knot is main climbing knot pro tree climbers use.
Its very cheap, easy to get down again (simply twist the knot gently), no need to disconnect from the rope.
Only disadvantage is you cant get above the mast head, but you could make a strop or something to attach to the masthead to allow that.
cheers
