Just wondering if any one has down winded on either lake Weyba or Cootharaba, near noosa?
For those unfamiliar with them weyba is 3km long x about 1.5km wide and cootharaba about 10km x 4.5km.
Being new to downwinding I am looking for easy places to learn the skills. I did my first ocean DW'er on the weekend, and really struggled.
Does it work in lakes generally speaking?
Thanks,
Ken.
I was reading a thread on 'zero fetch downwinders' on the standup zone forum which was interesting reading.
I was mucking about in the river with less than 1km fetch in 25 knot gusts and it was 'almost' producing small runs on my 14 footer.
How would you get access to upwind/downwind ends? boat?
Cootharaba would be fun in a northerly for sure, but not sure the access to each end would be suitable..
Select to expand quotefoamballer said..
I was reading a thread on 'zero fetch downwinders' on the standup zone forum which was interesting reading.
I was mucking about in the river with less than 1km fetch in 25 knot gusts and it was 'almost' producing small runs on my 14 footer.
How would you get access to upwind/downwind ends? boat?
Some by road, some simply paddle into the wind across the lake then DW back?
I guess it will depend on the wind direction and what road and track there are around the lakes. I would have to go on a recon mission at first if there is hope for some reasonable conditions to DW in these places. There is usually plenty of catamarans at Cootharaba so could maybe get a tow across?
What do mean by "fetch"?
Ken
Select to expand quoteskebstebamal said..
Cootharaba would be fun in a northerly for sure, but not sure the access to each end would be suitable..
Hi Mate, I have seen the cats there on a sou easter, they get going across there. But whether or not that will suit a 14' board catching runners or not I don't know? May just go there one day and try anyhow?
Cheers,
Ken.
Ive kited there in a SE and its pretty crappy. When DI is hitting 30Knts NNE the lake would be cool fun. the sweel by mid lake would be well rideable.
Select to expand quoteKennyK said..
What do mean by "fetch"?
Ken
The fetch is the distance the wind travels over the surface of the water before reaching a certain location. The longer the fetch, the more contact the wind has with the water surface, the bigger the bumps you get to ride.
So if you went to the upwind end of the lake, even when its super windy, the water surface would be almost flat, whilst at the downwind end there would probably be plenty of white caps and small wind waves breaking on the shoreline.
You also need to consider how much protection the upwind end of the lake has from the wind. If the ground surface upwind of the lake is low-lying and flat, then the fetch will start at the start of the lake. If the upwind end of the lake is on the leeward side of a mountain, hill or even dense tree cover, this will protect it from the wind - so depending on the height of the obstruction, the wind may not actually be blowing across the lake surface at its upstream end, and effectively, the fetch might not start until anywhere from 100m up to a few km (or more) downwind.
If there's not a lot of wind protection around the lake, then 10km should be plenty of distance to create some fun downwind conditions in the second half of the run (or sooner), and downwinding without any ground swell (which usually doesn't exactly line up with the wind) can actually be a lot better than big winds and big swells combined.
Depending on the strength of the wind, you might start getting little runs that will push you along a bit within 100-200m (of where the fetch starts) and gradually improve the further downwind you get. I'd say it would take at least a km or two past his point for it to get good enough to start linking the runs together.
You'll also find that shallower water will produce organised rideable waves sooner than deep water.
what sort of board r u downwinding on and what are your board specs and your hgt & weight . Only real way to get used to downwinding is to persist in the ocean. It is hard at first and then it just clicks and the fun begins !! but it will depend on if the board is suitable to learn / start . If too narrow you will struggle for a lot longer and be limited in some conditions as well.
Select to expand quoteAli Cat said..KennyK said..
What do mean by "fetch"?
Ken
The fetch is the distance the wind travels over the surface of the water before reaching a certain location. The longer the fetch, the more contact the wind has with the water surface, the bigger the bumps you get to ride.
So if you went to the upwind end of the lake, even when its super windy, the water surface would be almost flat, whilst at the downwind end there would probably be plenty of white caps and small wind waves breaking on the shoreline.
You also need to consider how much protection the upwind end of the lake has from the wind. If the ground surface upwind of the lake is low-lying and flat, then the fetch will start at the start of the lake. If the upwind end of the lake is on the leeward side of a mountain, hill or even dense tree cover, this will protect it from the wind - so depending on the height of the obstruction, the wind may not actually be blowing across the lake surface at its upstream end, and effectively, the fetch might not start until anywhere from 100m up to a few km (or more) downwind.
If there's not a lot of wind protection around the lake, then 10km should be plenty of distance to create some fun downwind conditions in the second half of the run (or sooner), and downwinding without any ground swell (which usually doesn't exactly line up with the wind) can actually be a lot better than big winds and big swells combined.
Depending on the strength of the wind, you might start getting little runs that will push you along a bit within 100-200m (of where the fetch starts) and gradually improve the further downwind you get. I'd say it would take at least a km or two past his point for it to get good enough to start linking the runs together.
You'll also find that shallower water will produce organised rideable waves sooner than deep water.
Thanks Ali Cat, that was very informative, great stuff!
Ken.
Select to expand quotescotty100 said..
what sort of board r u downwinding on and what are your board specs and your hgt & weight . Only real way to get used to downwinding is to persist in the ocean. It is hard at first and then it just clicks and the fun begins !! but it will depend on if the board is suitable to learn / start . If too narrow you will struggle for a lot longer and be limited in some conditions as well.
I have a 2011 Hobie 14 elite, at 14' x 28" x 6&5/8", vol 286lt.
I am 5'10.5", and weigh 88kg.
Cheers,
Ken.
Kenny,
There is a group of people, with various board types, who downwind from the souhern end of Weyba rD back to Quamby Place,
They genearlly take a car down to near the airstrip and leave one at Quamby.
I havent seen them all winter but see them regulalrly in summer.
Re Lake Cootharaba, I often paddle with my wife and two friends up to Harrys Hut from Elanda Point. They are in Sea Kayaks and I am on a 12'6" Fanatic.
We mostly do this in summer so that we get the North Easter on the way back. They have small sails on the kayaks and I generally get back before them. I am no guru at it at all but it is fun. i am buying a 14' er soon and think this will be much better.
Cheers.
ET.
hey kennyk, I started with some DW river runs at Cotton Tree (twin waters to the cod hole). Have taken friends on this paddle now with no ocean experience. Fun little run, just make sure the tide and wind are from the same direction.Here is a clip of that run.
and this one on my friends first ocean DW (mooloolaba to Alex) had to paddle out a bit to get the wind and swell on our backs. Hope this helps.
Select to expand quoteKennyK said..
Just wondering if any one has down winded on either lake Weyba or Cootharaba, near noosa?
For those unfamiliar with them weyba is 3km long x about 1.5km wide and cootharaba about 10km x 4.5km.
Being new to downwinding I am looking for easy places to learn the skills. I did my first ocean DW'er on the weekend, and really struggled.
Does it work in lakes generally speaking?
Thanks,
Ken.
Kenny, dont be worried about your first being a struggle. It was fairly challenging. I would suggest you start with easier ones, like the bay crossing mooloolaba to Maroochy river, 11.5km straight up is a baptism of fire : )
Select to expand quoteE T said..
Kenny,
There is a group of people, with various board types, who downwind from the souhern end of Weyba rD back to Quamby Place,
They genearlly take a car down to near the airstrip and leave one at Quamby.
I havent seen them all winter but see them regulalrly in summer.
Re Lake Cootharaba, I often paddle with my wife and two friends up to Harrys Hut from Elanda Point. They are in Sea Kayaks and I am on a 12'6" Fanatic.
We mostly do this in summer so that we get the North Easter on the way back. They have small sails on the kayaks and I generally get back before them. I am no guru at it at all but it is fun. i am buying a 14' er soon and think this will be much better.
Cheers.
ET.
I think I will have to suck it and see? Be nice to hook up with someone else who would like to share the adventure?
Thanks,
ET.
Select to expand quoteskebstebamal said..KennyK said..
Just wondering if any one has down winded on either lake Weyba or Cootharaba, near noosa?
For those unfamiliar with them weyba is 3km long x about 1.5km wide and cootharaba about 10km x 4.5km.
Being new to downwinding I am looking for easy places to learn the skills. I did my first ocean DW'er on the weekend, and really struggled.
Does it work in lakes generally speaking?
Thanks,
Ken.
Kenny, dont be worried about your first being a struggle. It was fairly challenging. I would suggest you start with easier ones, like the bay crossing mooloolaba to Maroochy river, 11.5km straight up is a baptism of fire : )
Yeah, Marcel I will, I will also try the lakes and river, just work on the skills and fitness and work up to the more challenging runs.
At the same time will also try and work out whether I need a better board? Time will tell?
Any time you want to do mooloolaba to maroochy and want another person to go with I'd be keen!
Just contact me, I will PM you my contact details.
Cheers,
Ken.
Select to expand quotewadeo said..
hey kennyk, I started with some DW river runs at Cotton Tree (twin waters to the cod hole). Have taken friends on this paddle now with no ocean experience. Fun little run, just make sure the tide and wind are from the same direction.Here is a clip of that run. ?rel=0 and this one on my friends first ocean DW (mooloolaba to Alex) had to paddle out a bit to get the wind and swell on our backs. ?rel=0 Hope this helps.
Thanks Wadeo,
I'll try that when conditions suit. Always interesting to see DW video's. One thing I noticed though and am wondering about, is you seem to pretty much always be paddling. My imagination of DW'ing was maybe paddling 25 to 50% of the time, and surfing the bumps the rest of the time. Do I have the wrong idea? 
Does it ever happen like I imagined, or am I just dreaming? I know my first DW'er was 99.9% paddling, disappointingly.
BTW: What do you think of the bullet?
Cheers,
Ken.
Select to expand quoteDavidJohn said..
Great vid wadeo.. This was our Fathers day downwinder.
DJ
DJ your downwind conditions make me sik!! : ) you may as well throw your paddle away after the first stroke 
Select to expand quoteKennyK said..
Thanks Wadeo,
I'll try that when conditions suit. Always interesting to see DW video's. One thing I noticed though and am wondering about, is you seem to pretty much always be paddling. My imagination of DW'ing was maybe paddling 25 to 50% of the time, and surfing the bumps the rest of the time. Do I have the wrong idea? Does it ever happen like I imagined, or am I just dreaming? I know my first DW'er was 99.9% paddling, disappointingly.
BTW: What do you think of the bullet?
Cheers,
Ken.
The no paddling thing will come in time.. It's not just about the conditions.. Even on my downwinders most of my friends are constantly paddling.. I sometimes yell out "stop paddling.. You've got it" and sometimes people are so focused on the nose of their board and the water just in front and once they catch a runner they just keep paddling to try and get over and onto the one in front.. Maybe that's just what some people like to do... I like to paddle as little as possible.. Not being lazy I just think that's where it's at.. Our Port Phillip Bay is like a big lake.. I'd love to see more of your vids when the wind gets a little stronger.. I found to catch long no paddling runners you need to line them up from a fair way away.. I'm used to doing it windsurfing and looking for jumps.. You don't just sail in a straight line and hope to get something.. When I'm DW'ing I'm looking about half way between the nose of my board and the horizon.. Always.. When I see waves ahead they are usually moving left or right so I line myself up so we meet.. Sometimes when we meet they have faded.. Sometimes they are bigger.. They are often in a group (or set) of about three.. Don't catch the first one.. Let them move ahead and the idea is to get behind the last (and usually the biggest) and it's the hole left behind the wave that you're surfing into.. Most people find it hard to understand that you actually catch up to the waves ahead like they are a standing wave in a river and you are drifting down the river towards them.. They don't come up from behind like in the surf.... Anyway.. I'm rambling on.
DJ
To understand more about what I'm on about.. Watch skebstebamal's DW vid that he posted today ''2014 Fanatic Falcon DW vid' and skip to the 5.05 mark and stop it.. You will see a wave almost breaking way up ahead.. Keep watching it and it seems to come back to you.. It's not till about the 5.35 mark that he's on it.. I'm thinking he should have headed a little more to the right to line it up better.. Shame he fell at that point... I often do the same [fall] because you go to take a big stroke to catch it and pull yourself off balance and fall.. Anyway.. At that 5.05 mark that's about the distance ahead that I'm always looking.. Never back.. (Unless I'm looking to see where others are). Never right in front.. (Unless I'm about to pearl)..
DJ
Select to expand quoteDavidJohn said..KennyK said..
Thanks Wadeo,
I'll try that when conditions suit. Always interesting to see DW video's. One thing I noticed though and am wondering about, is you seem to pretty much always be paddling. My imagination of DW'ing was maybe paddling 25 to 50% of the time, and surfing the bumps the rest of the time. Do I have the wrong idea? Does it ever happen like I imagined, or am I just dreaming? I know my first DW'er was 99.9% paddling, disappointingly.
BTW: What do you think of the bullet?
Cheers,
Ken.
The no paddling thing will come in time.. It's not just about the conditions.. Even on my downwinders most of my friends are constantly paddling.. I sometimes yell out "stop paddling.. You've got it" and sometimes people are so focused on the nose of their board and the water just in front and once they catch a runner they just keep paddling to try and get over and onto the one in front.. Maybe that's just what some people like to do... I like to paddle as little as possible.. Not being lazy I just think that's where it's at.. Our Port Phillip Bay is like a big lake.. I'd love to see more of your vids when the wind gets a little stronger.. I found to catch long no paddling runners you need to line them up from a fair way away.. I'm used to doing it windsurfing and looking for jumps.. You don't just sail in a straight line and hope to get something.. When I'm DW'ing I'm looking about half way between the nose of my board and the horizon.. Always.. When I see waves ahead they are usually moving left or right so I line myself up so we meet.. Sometimes when we meet they have faded.. Sometimes they are bigger.. They are often in a group (or set) of about three.. Don't catch the first one.. Let them move ahead and the idea is to get behind the last (and usually the biggest) and it's the hole left behind the wave that you're surfing into.. Most people find it hard to understand that you actually catch up to the waves ahead like they are a standing wave in a river and you are drifting down the river towards them.. They don't come up from behind like in the surf.... Anyway.. I'm rambling on.
DJ
Thanks DJ, That's exactly the main thing that I was doing wrong! I was looking behind as per surfing, looking for the bigger swells to catch and ride, however they simply passed beneath me. I was told afterwards by Ryan, that I need to be looking forward. I also watched an instructional video on you tube which the dude said everything happens in front of you, you see the swell in front and look to be in the trough. It just all seems a bit topsy turvy to what I am used to with surfing. I believe I am beginning to understand it though. Just a matter of application hopefully?
Ken.
Select to expand quoteDavidJohn said..
Great vid wadeo.. This was our Fathers day downwinder.
DJ
Yeah Baby, that's more like what I imagined it to be, not a lot of paddling going on there, I like it!
You look to be standing way back on your board DJ is that always the best position? or do you need to be much further forward to catch some of the runners or does it all happen from back there?
Ken.
Select to expand quoteKennyK said..DavidJohn said..
Great vid wadeo.. This was our Fathers day downwinder.
DJ
Yeah Baby, that's more like what I imagined it to be, not a lot of paddling going on there, I like it!
You look to be standing way back on your board DJ is that always the best position? or do you need to be much further forward to catch some of the runners or does it all happen from back there?
Ken.
It's very important to be well forward to catch a runner.. Just like the way you step way forward to catch an unbroken wave in the surf.. You want the nose to drop.. Once it's dropped you are best to stay forward unless you are going to pearl... You learn to anticipate pearling and move back before it happens.. I think I'm further back in my vids than normal because of the weight of my camera rig.. and also if the nose pearls ever so slightly and water goes over the deck the water catches the legs of my camera mount and it feels like someone pulling on the front brake while riding a bicycle because of the drag.. How far back also depends on the board and your weight.. It's very easy to bog the board down and drop off the plane if you're too far back.. Staying forward seems to keep the glide going longer.. I have to move an inch or two forward and back to keep the glide going.. Sometimes a wide surf stance helps and you just put your weight forward on your front foot or back on your back foot so there's no need to even move your feet.
DJ
Yeah, ok DJ that's good to know, I think I was probably staying too far back last weekend.
But the nose on my board doesn't have lift like the naish glide or the new falcon does, so it just seem a bit daunting.
Cheers,
Ken.
Select to expand quotewadeo said..
hey kennyk, I started with some DW river runs at Cotton Tree (twin waters to the cod hole). Have taken friends on this paddle now with no ocean experience. Fun little run, just make sure the tide and wind are from the same direction.Here is a clip of that run.
?rel=0and this one on my friends first ocean DW (mooloolaba to Alex) had to paddle out a bit to get the wind and swell on our backs.
?rel=0Hope this helps.
Thanks for that Wade 2 things i need to remember when paddling with someone with a GoPro. 1) paddle wider than the camera angle & 2) help them edit out the awkward falls so they don't make the final cut
