Forums > Stand Up Paddle General

Non swimmers SUP'ing without a PFD.

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Created by DavidJohn > 9 months ago, 17 Jun 2013
DavidJohn
VIC, 17461 posts
17 Jun 2013 2:56PM
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Sad lesson learned again in the US.

Let's hope it doesn't happen here.

DJ

An Orlando man died after falling into Lake Minnehaha while paddle boarding.

Joy Hill of the Florida Wildlife Commission said Ronald Sikorski, 29, of Orlando was pronounced dead at South Lake Hospital.

Lake County Sheriff's deputies found the man around 8:40 p.m. Saturday after he had gone missing while paddle boarding on Lake Minnehaha.

The Lake County Sheriff's Office responded to the area at approximately 6:15 p.m. in response to the report of an adult male who fell off a paddle board and had not resurfaced.

One witness said the man had been out on the water with friends when he suddenly fell off the paddle board, yelled for helped, but then slipped under the water.

Search efforts immediately began with a helicopter, a dive team, Marine Patrol and fire and EMS units.

The man was not wearing a life jacket.

missymoo
NSW, 24 posts
18 Jun 2013 9:49AM
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If you can't swim - why wouldn't you just stick to land sports??

Jradedmondo
NSW, 635 posts
18 Jun 2013 1:10PM
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missymoo said..

If you can't swim - why wouldn't you just stick to land sports??


i ask myself this when i work as a lifeguard at rowing, canoeing, dragon boating events

Jarryd

beerssup
NSW, 513 posts
18 Jun 2013 2:32PM
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Shame there's no pfd for stupidity.

billboard
QLD, 2816 posts
18 Jun 2013 4:35PM
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I know MANY surfers who can't swim ! Doesnt make it stupid, just a bit risky in my opinion - each to their own though.

Piros
QLD, 6996 posts
18 Jun 2013 7:09PM
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billboard said..

I know MANY surfers who can't swim ! Doesnt make it stupid, just a bit risky in my opinion - each to their own though.


If someone can deal with waves why can't they learn to swim , I can't understand that. IMHO

billboard
QLD, 2816 posts
18 Jun 2013 8:12PM
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Piros said...
billboard said..

I know MANY surfers who can't swim ! Doesnt make it stupid, just a bit risky in my opinion - each to their own though.


If someone can deal with waves why can't they learn to swim , I can't understand that. IMHO


Im not asking you to understand it - just stating a fact.

beerssup
NSW, 513 posts
18 Jun 2013 8:27PM
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billboard said...
I know MANY surfers who can't swim ! Doesnt make it stupid, just a bit risky in my opinion - each to their own though.


You cannot be serious Bill if you can't swim you have no business in any body of water let alone the surf if you do you are stupid and no matter how long it takes eventually something will happen.show no respect for the ocean and you will lose.

Bolero
NSW, 57 posts
18 Jun 2013 8:47PM
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Totally agree,due to the odd hours i work i usually sup alone either in the surf or on the flat,although i can swim i always respect the water and conditions on offer.I have been thinking of purchasing a pfd vest any ideas or recommendations of what would be the best for SUP would be appreciated !

teatrea
QLD, 4177 posts
18 Jun 2013 8:47PM
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Far out , you dont need to learn how to swim , you need to learn how not to pannick!Any animal knows how to tread water , its the pannick that gets emI guess that comes back to learning to swim

billboard
QLD, 2816 posts
18 Jun 2013 9:06PM
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Im not saying its ideal being a non swimmer in the surf BUT I know many surfers who cant swim ( as I said earlier)
Being the best swimmer in the world aint gunna mean shlt if your board - - or someone elses knocks you out cold.

beerssup
NSW, 513 posts
18 Jun 2013 9:47PM
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billboard said...
Im not saying its ideal being a non swimmer in the surf BUT I know many surfers who cant swim ( as I said earlier)
Being the best swimmer in the world aint gunna mean shlt if your board - - or someone elses knocks you out
cold.


Where does it say anything about being knocked out. Boards and legropes are always being snapped then what no legrope no board no swim good luck,oh well fish have to eat too.

SUPFIN
VIC, 31 posts
25 Aug 2013 11:41PM
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Has anybody got the facts of the situation this young fella has tragically passed away from ????

robdog
VIC, 611 posts
26 Aug 2013 6:28AM
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Being in Florida the water is probably not going to be that cold, but my recollection of an event quite a few years ago may relate to how this man died.

Some Japanese exchange students were playing soccer beside the Aire River in winter. The ball went into the river and two students jumped in to retrieve it. Both apparently went straight under and drowned. The water in this case was very cold, say 10 degrees.

"... In humans, cold shock response is perhaps the most common cause of death from immersion in very cold water, such as by falling through thin ice. The cold water can cause heart attack (as cold blood from the extremities reaches the heart) and inhalation of water (and thus drowning) from hyperventilation...... "

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold_shock_response

Whether you can swim or not, this is something to be aware of, especially if teaching non-surfers to SUP in cold water.

JasonProsser
NSW, 268 posts
26 Aug 2013 8:07AM
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Worth a watch if you are unlucky enough to paddle in cold water.

micksmith
VIC, 1686 posts
26 Aug 2013 8:31AM
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Gator?

PTWoody
VIC, 3982 posts
26 Aug 2013 10:45AM
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This one seems weird - she was struggling to stay upright and so she abandoned the board to swim back but didn't make it.

rockmagnet
QLD, 1458 posts
26 Aug 2013 12:19PM
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Leg ropes for any board on the water should be law. Sup's clubby's kayaks anything. If the young 17 year old clubby had been attached to his board who drowned recently in a Gold Coast canal he might have survived. Even Sup's out on flat water should have them because if you do go in at least you are still attached to your board making it easy to find you.

Sailhack
VIC, 5000 posts
26 Aug 2013 12:33PM
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billboard said..

Im not saying its ideal being a non swimmer in the surf BUT I know many surfers who cant swim ( as I said earlier)
Being the best swimmer in the world aint gunna mean shlt if your board - - or someone elses knocks you out cold.


True, but by learning to swim you also learn to respect the water - and as many here confess (including myself), that respect can save you from getting knocked out, or at least having the sense to not go out alone if you are in doubt.

My kids are doing nippers and will continue to do so until I'm satisfied that they have learned the basics. They can swim, but swimming alone won't help you in the ocean. Cold Shock Response can affect anyone, especially if you're tired or your immune system is low. I've windsurfed during cold Vic winters to the point of exhaustion (couldn't seem to walk away when the wind was still good), but knowing what I've learned over the years - I now know when to call it quits...normally when the roof of my mouth starts to get cold - sounds bizarre, but that's my warning sign.

foamballer
NSW, 406 posts
26 Aug 2013 2:08PM
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rockmagnet said..Leg ropes for any board on the water should be law.


Please no !
Sure there are some freak occurrences where it would help (like the poor guy up on the gold coast recently), but law enforcement for leg ropes ? No - the cops have got better things to do than chase down bare-ankled suppers. I always wear my leggie, BTW - I'm just not a fan of regulation.

In most cases it's just Darwin's theory at work anyway. If you SUP/surf but can't swim, I reckon that's the equivalent of jumping off a building without a parachute. Eventually it's not going to end well.


rockmagnet
QLD, 1458 posts
27 Aug 2013 9:02AM
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Sorry I did not mean legislative law for leg ropes or some form of attachment but a common sense law that responsible people should abide by. All too often people are cleaned up by irresponsible riders especially clubby boards who never have a leggy and who should know better although I did see a Supp swimming after his board last week. Just a bit of common sense needed.
I know I feel more comfortable wearing one even paddling up the creek but I notice that I'm the only one wearing one. I think the older we get self preservation kicks in and we realise that we are no longer bullet proof. (as if we ever were)

DavidJohn
VIC, 17461 posts
30 Aug 2013 3:32AM
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and yet another..

Here.. http://www.kcra.com/man-drowns-at-tahoe-after-falling-off-paddleboard/-/11798090/21694772/-/68uifd/-/index.html?fb_action_ids=10201694861002969&fb_action_types=og.recommends&fb_source=other_multiline&action_object_map=%7B%2210201694861002969%22%3A423549327765520%7D&action_type_map=%7B%2210201694861002969%22%3A%22og.recommends%22%7D&action_ref_map=%5B%5D

DJ

INCLINE VILLAGE, Nev. Authorities say a 42-year-old California man drowned at Lake Tahoe after falling off a paddleboard.

Kenneth Campo of San Mateo was 200 to 300 yards offshore at Sand Harbor State Park when he fell in the water Friday afternoon.

Nevada Department of Wildlife spokesman Edwin Lyngar says the paddleboard was equipped with a life jacket and foot leash, but Campo wore neither.

Lyngar tells the Nevada Appeal that an employee from a rental company retrieved Campo from about 20 feet underwater.

Emergency responders were unsuccessful in trying to resuscitate him. Campo was taken to a hospital where he was pronounced dead.


faito anto
VIC, 181 posts
30 Aug 2013 10:01AM
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I reckon if you can't swim at all, then you really shouldn't be engaging in outdoor water-sports.

First, learn to swim. It's never too late to learn. My grandmother learnt to swim well into middle age and became a regular lap swimmer.

JasonProsser
NSW, 268 posts
31 Aug 2013 12:31AM
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Just seen the Tahoe incident on another page myself, and having paddled on Tahoe at that same location, I'm puzzled as to how someone can drown at such a safe haven. If the paddler were nervous or concerned about falling in, I'm pretty sure they would have worn the pfd and leash provided, and how far away from your board do you normally fall on flat water - such that you could not grab it and use it as flotation.
I sometimes wonder if some pr-existing medical condition is to balme in some of these "drowning" cases. Sad none the less that someone lost their life in such a beautiful place, taking part in such an anazing activity.

rockmagnet
QLD, 1458 posts
31 Aug 2013 8:15AM
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My thoughts on the issue are that wether you have a pre existing medical condition or not, if you have a stroke or seizure or simply pass out you'll end up on the bottom and no one can find you. Wear a leg rope and you are easily found especially older or inexperienced paddlers but it really should apply to all.

PTWoody
VIC, 3982 posts
31 Aug 2013 9:38AM
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JasonProsser said..

Just seen the Tahoe incident on another page myself, and having paddled on Tahoe at that same location, I'm puzzled as to how someone can drown at such a safe haven. If the paddler were nervous or concerned about falling in, I'm pretty sure they would have worn the pfd and leash provided, and how far away from your board do you normally fall on flat water - such that you could not grab it and use it as flotation.
I sometimes wonder if some pr-existing medical condition is to balme in some of these "drowning" cases. Sad none the less that someone lost their life in such a beautiful place, taking part in such an anazing activity.


A board can get away from you very easily. If you fall backwards, your motion is likely to project the board forwards. I was paddling on glass once but on a very tippy board and an unexpected boat wake caused me to fall. The board ended up about 10 metres away and the residual boat wake swept it away faster than I could swim to catch it. Ended up being a longer swim than I might have liked, especially in cold water. Remember, hypothermia only takes about 15 minutes to kick in.

HumanCartoon
VIC, 2098 posts
31 Aug 2013 11:49AM
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PTWoody said..

A board can get away from you very easily. If you fall backwards, your motion is likely to project the board forwards. I was paddling on glass once but on a very tippy board and an unexpected boat wake caused me to fall. The board ended up about 10 metres away and the residual boat wake swept it away faster than I could swim to catch it. Ended up being a longer swim than I might have liked, especially in cold water. Remember, hypothermia only takes about 15 minutes to kick in.


Almost always I've got a leggie on, even in glass. I fell off so frequently in my first session I cracked the sh1ts with swimming after the board and decided I wasn't going to do that again.

DavidJohn
VIC, 17461 posts
15 Sep 2013 5:38PM
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Not another sup death.. Good ending on this one..

DJ

Beachgoers pulled a surfer from the ocean and administered CPR after the unidentified man apparently suffered a serious injury.

The victim was pulled from the ocean at the borough's Neptune Place beach by a Good Samaritan who witnessed the accident at about 2:20 p.m.

Eric Hoblitzell was riding a stand up paddle board when he said he saw the victim wipe out head-first into the break.

"I heard a snap. It was a sickening sound," Hoblitzel, 33, a former Belmar lifeguard said.

"I ditched my board and rushed over to him, he was face down in the water. I screamed for someone to call 911 and began CPR right away," he said.

Sea Girt Police Capt. Kevin Davenport confirmed that a male paddle boarder and a woman on the beach administered CPR to the man before lifeguards, who were not on the beach, and a doctor arrived and took over first aid.

The man's vital signs stabilized and he was transported to Jersey Shore Medical Center. The surfer's condition was not immediately known, according to police.

flyingsteen
NSW, 14 posts
15 Sep 2013 7:41PM
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No excuses for not being able to swim. Understanding the ocean and how it works is vital. Working as a surfing instructor it was the first question your ask tourists - can you swim? If not then they didn't go past their waist or with out an instructor close by.
I'm not saying you have to have perfect freestyle or backstroke but being able to keep yourself a float for a period of time to get to your board or to land is pretty essential

Bindi81
1 posts
18 Sep 2013 8:23PM
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First SUP lesson was with 1 guide, myself and 2 others that were both from somewhere in India and did not really learn to swim- one lives over here now however they both were unconfident swimmers.
While we did have the type of PFD that you had to manually blow up, none of us had them up, mainly was used so other water users can see us, one guy fell in and panicked straight away and although his board was just behind him he decided to head to the guide that was about 3mtrs away.

I believe that everyone deserves the right to enjoy the water but accidents do happen (even to fantastic swimmers) and you should learn to do your own risk assessment however not everyone knows or understands how to do these or how easily things can change.
After thinking about this it easy to say that the guide should not have been put in this predicament (not by the clients) and again hindsight is mostly 20/20. I am just glad that our teaching standards are good although it can be easy to take things for granted.



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"Non swimmers SUP'ing without a PFD." started by DavidJohn