Very interesting point that OG SUP raises here - with a limited pool of money available, should we be overly concerned that 8 of the elite sponsored athletes are not receiving funding to go to world titles? Or could the currently limited funds be better spent growing the sport at grass roots level so that an eventual broad based appeal of the sport translates to lifestyle brands, banks and fast food chains clamouring to attach themselves to the sport, which then provides excessive amounts of filthy lucre for the elites to bathe in Evian water if they so choose.
You don't build a skyscraper from the top down. You need solid foundations.
Hi PT,
We have to sustainably grow the base.
But if if the SUP Community believe its important that these elite guys represent us and I do because they busted their backsides and earned it, then we as a SUP Community need to find a way to help them get there, its up to all of us.
I guess the other point is that no matter what Brand / Faction they represent they are the AUSTRALIA TEAM and we should get behind them.
On the Breeze we must have some marketing guys that could pull some strings with seriously big business to fund 8 people to go.
We could raise an account for donations, do some raffles run some races where all the funds go to the cause.
What ever it takes we as a community get behind them because they are the Aussie Team.
AU SUP could coordinate it in each state.
Its about time we took it into our own hands and simply get sh!t
done not wait for others to throw us crumbs
In return we need these elite guys and gals to come to club days mingle invest time and help the sport grow from the bottom up.
Select to expand quoteOG SUP said...
I'm putting in my 2 cents for open discussion, what I have written here is only my point of view, add subtract, flame it out do what you like but planning and learning from the past is the only way forward. I guess the point is do you want to bitch and carry on and take you bat and ball home or do you want to make a difference and change the future?
1) SA's core business is short board surfing and SUP surfing can be seen to be in direct conflict with its core business. In many ways it would be in SA's best commercial interest for SUP Surfing to reach an early demise.
2) SA's interest in SUP is the possibility that some point in the future SUP Racing will go to the Olympics and thats why they are investing in the sport. SUP racing is also a low time / infrastructure investment for a relatively high return if the numbers are high enough. You don't need judges and days of peoples time you only need a few hours for a much higher bottom line. Again remember SA is a business not a charity they are there to be profitable.
3) Until the equipment cost is at a relatively affordable level that allows SUP to become mainstream (unlikely due to volume in Australia) you can all but forget inclusion on a broad scale. $100-250- 400 deepening on your wallet for a second hand prone long / short surfboard and bare minimum $600- 900 for a second hand sup. Mum and dad most likely won't or simply cant fund it for the kids to even have a go.
4) Fastest growing water sport in the world? It may be, however in the scheme of things in Australia it would be lucky to be the pimple on the ass of an elephant compared to short boarding. Just on the West Coast of Vic at my local beach there are circa 3 x 30 kids x 2 session a day on the weekend going through Vegimite Surf Groms training x how many beaches just on the West Coast of Vicco? In Qld I imagine the numbers would be staggering.
5) Up until recently when there was a 180 deg turn around, the suggested age of a junior in the sport was 25+ go figure on that one. With little support for any type of junior program to that point, you get what you sow. If you don't get the juniors involved you don't have a future.
6) With the focus changed to Elite racing in the last few years and the perceived demise of the fun aspect of the club sport the numbers in Vicco (not talking about any other state) dropped significantly. Joe blogs doesn't jump out of his car walk up and say yea sure I want to jump on a board and slog paddle 12km-20km. SUP Vic addressed this at the GMP and there turn around was pretty staggering. Fun and inclusivity 1st will broaden your base, $$$ and clout.
7) The removal of the unlimited board and the farce that was the 12'6, 14 class also had a large effect including confusing the retailers on what to even stock and it affected who would even come to an event down here, combine that with the arms race and need for a quiver of 3 - 5 boards flat water downwind inflatable etc etc etc and your average joe was totally left behind. The confusion of what to buy combined with the cash to fund even 1 competitive board was beyond the average punter. Make it simple and fun and they will return in time.
8) The SUP Sport here in Australia has its focus on the 50- 200 at the top end when for the sport to grow it needs to broaden its base and build its numbers at the punters end to the 1000s and get back the froth and fun that it had 6-7 years ago. The shops make max bottom line with broad based numbers and when the shop / sponsors have money rolling in from the numbers they are happy to pony it up for events /travel etc thats really a no brainer. Build the base and you will get your funding for ISA and many other things.
9) SUP needs its own Governing Body with people dedicated to the long term future of the sport and a 5 - 10 year plan that looks not only at the elite aspects of the sport but growth and sustainability not a fast return now attitude.
Flame it up as much as you like as I said above its about getting a group together with an interest in the sport to guide and nurture all aspects and disciplines moving forward "said in best Julia Gillard voice"
fantastic post. 
O.G you where reading my mindinflatables I think are going to make the sport accessible to the masses , and shorter races. If I was in an organization that was hell bent on growing the sport I would be buying a heap of inflatables , possibly wouldn't even need to buy them. Manufacturers may donate them and set up a fun race series , get it to the schools and create some interest. More than likely some Government money may also be forthcoming , child hood obesity is a big problem in this country. The sport could actually have a relatively low cost barrier to entry in this way. You only have to look at AFL as an example especially in Rugby League dominated QLD , they have been working the schools for years and its paid massively for them. I was helping spread the Gospel in schools 20 years ago in central QLD.I realize AFL is our National code , but its just an example of what can be done. Could you imagine getting young guys like Jake , Lincon , Kai , Keahi to go to schools and talk about the amazing places they get to go and compete. Show some vids. Id bet my bottom dollar the kiddies would be stoked out of their brains , going home and saying Mum I want a sup board for XMAS
I think they are putting a press release out today from what i hear and also heard both Terrene and Ang have been Selected!!
Select to expand quotechrispy said..OG SUP said...
6) With the focus changed to Elite racing in the last few years and the perceived demise of the fun aspect of the club sport the numbers in Vicco (not talking about any other state) dropped significantly. Joe blogs doesn't jump out of his car walk up and say yea sure I want to jump on a board and slog paddle 12km-20km. SUP Vic addressed this at the GMP and there turn around was pretty staggering. Fun and inclusivity 1st will broaden your base, $$$ and clout.
fantastic post.
Can't agree more.
Select to expand quoteangie pangi said..
I think they are putting a press release out today from what i hear and also heard both Terrene and Ang have been Selected!!
Presumably Karla can't go and so they have offered the spots to second place in each race. Either that or they've expanded the numbers for each country.
Select to expand quoteteatrea said..
Have surfing Aus tried to introduce a junior program or have plans to do so?
I thought there was a junior sup program getting younger blokes into the sport - the 55+ division?
Select to expand quoteOG SUP said..
I'm putting in my 2 cents for open discussion, what I have written here is only my point of view, add subtract, flame it out do what you like but planning and learning from the past is the only way forward. I guess the point is do you want to bitch and carry on and take you bat and ball home or do you want to make a difference and change the future?
1) SA's core business is short board surfing and SUP surfing can be seen to be in direct conflict with its core business. In many ways it would be in SA's best commercial interest for SUP Surfing to reach an early demise.
2) SA's interest in SUP is the possibility that some point in the future SUP Racing will go to the Olympics and thats why they are investing in the sport. SUP racing is also a low time / infrastructure investment for a relatively high return if the numbers are high enough. You don't need judges and days of peoples time you only need a few hours for a much higher bottom line. Again remember SA is a business not a charity they are there to be profitable.
3) Until the equipment cost is at a relatively affordable level that allows SUP to become mainstream (unlikely due to volume in Australia) you can all but forget inclusion on a broad scale. $100-250- 400 deepening on your wallet for a second hand prone long / short surfboard and bare minimum $600- 900 for a second hand sup. Mum and dad most likely won't or simply cant fund it for the kids to even have a go.
4) Fastest growing water sport in the world? It may be, however in the scheme of things in Australia it would be lucky to be the pimple on the ass of an elephant compared to short boarding. Just on the West Coast of Vic at my local beach there are circa 3 x 30 kids x 2 session a day on the weekend going through Vegimite Surf Groms training x how many beaches just on the West Coast of Vicco? In Qld I imagine the numbers would be staggering.
5) Up until recently when there was a 180 deg turn around, the suggested age of a junior in the sport was 25+ go figure on that one. With little support for any type of junior program to that point, you get what you sow. If you don't get the juniors involved you don't have a future.
6) With the focus changed to Elite racing in the last few years and the perceived demise of the fun aspect of the club sport the numbers in Vicco (not talking about any other state) dropped significantly. Joe blogs doesn't jump out of his car walk up and say yea sure I want to jump on a board and slog paddle 12km-20km. SUP Vic addressed this at the GMP and there turn around was pretty staggering. Fun and inclusivity 1st will broaden your base, $$$ and clout.
7) The removal of the unlimited board and the farce that was the 12'6, 14 class also had a large effect including confusing the retailers on what to even stock and it affected who would even come to an event down here, combine that with the arms race and need for a quiver of 3 - 5 boards flat water downwind inflatable etc etc etc and your average joe was totally left behind. The confusion of what to buy combined with the cash to fund even 1 competitive board was beyond the average punter. Make it simple and fun and they will return in time.
8) The SUP Sport here in Australia has its focus on the 50- 200 at the top end when for the sport to grow it needs to broaden its base and build its numbers at the punters end to the 1000s and get back the froth and fun that it had 6-7 years ago. The shops make max bottom line with broad based numbers and when the shop / sponsors have money rolling in from the numbers they are happy to pony it up for events /travel etc thats really a no brainer. Build the base and you will get your funding for ISA and many other things.
9) SUP needs its own Governing Body with people dedicated to the long term future of the sport and a 5 - 10 year plan that looks not only at the elite aspects of the sport but growth and sustainability not a fast return now attitude.
Flame it up as much as you like as I said above its about getting a group together with an interest in the sport to guide and nurture all aspects and disciplines moving forward "said in best Julia Gillard voice"
Wowser that was well said Phil!!
Select to expand quotePTWoody said..angie pangi said..
I think they are putting a press release out today from what i hear and also heard both Terrene and Ang have been Selected!!
Presumably Karla can't go and so they have offered the spots to second place in each race. Either that or they've expanded the numbers for each country.
If Karla has decided not to attend is the reason other commitments or is it strictly financial, if it was strictly financial would Karla re explore the opportunity if independent funding was found?
The other question is what is the estimate for a person and thier board / boards to get to the location and incidental costs as a whole?
Has anyone done the numbers yet or have an idea based on previous experience $6500, $8000?
Select to expand quotePTWoody said..
Very interesting point that OG SUP raises here - with a limited pool of money available, should we be overly concerned that 8 of the elite sponsored athletes are not receiving funding to go to world titles? Or could the currently limited funds be better spent growing the sport at grass roots level so that an eventual broad based appeal of the sport translates to lifestyle brands, banks and fast food chains clamouring to attach themselves to the sport, which then provides excessive amounts of filthy lucre for the elites to bathe in Evian water if they so choose.
You don't build a skyscraper from the top down. You need solid foundations.
I'm really interested to hear peoples thoughts on this post of Woody's?
We have exactly the same discussion here in South Africa.....Phil's suggestions are currently being heeded to some degree but we are still battling with numbers.
- We rarely do races over 10km, simply because perhaps only 2-3 elite guys are interested, instead we do 2-3km novice races in conjunction with our races - it does pull the moms, kids and reluctant dads in to some extent.
- We've firmly settled on the 14ft class
- Cost of equipment is our single biggest obstacle to growth. We just don't have 2-400$ boards and no one is going to donate 10 or 20 boards to use in school programmes when 99% of the kids (or parents) reached wouldn't be able to afford a board anyways.
ISA is also doing themselves no favours by sticking their events in impossible to get to places - we still have no idea if our team will be able to make it financially, we want to send our best team, but they will all be self-sponsored and just getting a board to Nicaragua is retarded. It would be a shame if the event fizzles out with 3rd or 4th choice athletes simply because the best can not afford to go....
Wrt bottom up effect - I do think its a bit of both, sport has to be accessible (costwise) for the broader base to develop - but you do need the attention of the media on the elite guys (or events) making the sport aspirational.
I must compliment you guys on the input you give to the sport via your open forum - we have been unable to get any debates going via our main local forum, so all views are expressed in local meetings, agms which are rarely attended by high numbers.
Hey Peter,
Not everyone relishes the open discussion on this forum I assure you, it is often seen as being confrontational
instead of positive and transparent and thats a shame.
Its interesting to hear your experiencing similar issues in SA, when we were in the States this year yet again similar feedback, move to 14ft to be inclusive and significantly more engagement at the junior level.
There was also significant discussion about drugs and supplements and the effect in SUP racing hence the crack down at BOP this year.
The surf SUPS in the US can be similarly priced to high priced longboards and due to volume there are more on the secondhand market which helps even more. Carbon race boards were still excy, comes with the material.
It may simply come down to the cost effectiveness of running in those countries and thats the only way they can make it work financially.
I guess the point is if its that remote and if no one goes you don't have an event.
Its good to discuss this stuff constructively without silly snipers taking pot shotsIts always helpfull i feel to try and look at something from anothers point of view
Not only is relatively high cost of equipent a barrier , but so is our fixation with ocean and wave races.Which are great buy the way , but think about it from a parents or young kids perspective. Being in the ocean is dam scary for a lot of people , particulary those that dont have a surf background. Expecially when shark week has promos like Great White Serial Killerect ect. If you look at the big growth overseas its flat water , nice quick fun races , not 20 or 30K slogfests , they have their place no doubt.But they arent an entry level thing.The other side to the coin is do we want more numbers
Select to expand quoteteatrea said..
Its good to discuss this stuff constructively without silly snipers taking pot shotsIts always helpfull i feel to try and look at something from anothers point of viewNot only is relatively high cost of equipent a barrier , but so is our fixation with ocean and wave races.Which are great buy the way , but think about it from a parents or young kids perspective. Being in the ocean is dam scary for a lot of people , particulary those that dont have a surf background. Expecially when shark week has promos like Great White Serial Killerect ect. If you look at the big growth overseas its flat water , nice quick fun races , not 20 or 30K slogfests , they have their place no doubt.But they arent an entry level thing.The other side to the coin is do we want more numbers
More numbers are always welcome... in flat water.
Select to expand quoteteatrea said...
. If you look at the big growth overseas its flat water , nice quick fun races , not 20 or 30K slogfests , they have their place no doubt.But they arent an entry level thing.The other side to the coin is do we want more numbers
So your saying we should be having more sprint races TT, short course stuff 400m, 1k
I like the thought of sprint stuff but in a straight line on tv I think people would change the Chanel I do watching the rowing at the Olympics. Short sprints would be great but course stuff bouy turns are exciting and can change the lead so easily.
Didn't think this topic I started would take off like this.. Good discussions going on!
PeterP, please tell us more on your ways of "pulling mums"???.Im always keen to "pull mums" some of them are bloody hot and with about a 50% fake breast population here on the GC you cant go wrong
This is a very interesting post.Being a competitor on both the wave and race nationals here in Portugal and one of Peniche's Surf Club direction members I spend a lot of time thinking on how to get the sport growing - not just on a local level but on a national level.SUP is still pretty recent here and it is, without a doubt, some kind of an elite sport. Boards are freaking expensive, paddles as well and you can't just paddle all year around without (at least) one wetsuit.
2013 saw the first competitive year for SUP here in Portugal and we had plenty of events. The sport's awareness is growing by the day and I really think there is something really good coming in the future. The problem I see is that even if it is an appealing sport for kids (not as cool as surfing for many of them) it's waaayyyy more expensive and the second hand market is still very limited.
Since our club organizes one of the stages in the nationals, I think I'll suggest having some kind of division for kids. Maybe something like for U-12 or U-14. Imagine something like a 400m technical race by heats, in flat water.
As for the Australian National team subject, i feel it's shocking that Surfing Australia is not paying for the national teams expenses. No matter which sport we're talking about. From what i know, surfing in Australia it's like soccer in my country and I can imagine that the athletes riding shortboards would get all the expenses paid for.
Here in Portugal, no matter if it's Surfing, Bodyboarding or Longboarding (hopefully with SUP will be the same), the Portuguese surfing federation will pay for all the expenses of athletes, national team's coaches, physiotherapists, doctors and judges (judges are not paid though, just their traveling and accomoddation expenses).
Hope the future of our sport gets a bit brighter!!!
Johnny
Select to expand quotehusq2100 said..
PeterP, please tell us more on your ways of "pulling mums"???.Im always keen to "pull mums" some of them are bloody hot and with about a 50% fake breast population here on the GC you cant go wrong
Yes indeed - we have various methods...the topic of shaft stiffness and what it does for your pelvic area during the rotation of the stroke has been a popular one. It normally results in multiple requests for repeat demonstrations....
I could go on but my wife just told me to get off the computer....
