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Redbull STRATOS

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Created by SeanAUS120 > 9 months ago, 15 Oct 2012
SeanAUS120
QLD, 753 posts
15 Oct 2012 5:29AM
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I think everyone might have been asleep for this. But if you were up... it was pretty freaking amazing.

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swoosh
QLD, 1927 posts
15 Oct 2012 8:59AM
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So did they do any science? Or was it just a marketing exercise / publicity stunt?

Maybe I'm a bit cynical, but this was cool when they did it back in the day, because it was cutting edge stuff, nobody knew what would happen, and they were doing research for the space program.

I just can't get excited about this, when it's all in the name of chasing a record and selling more energy drink... And the risk is nowhere near the same as when Kittinger did it.

jusavina
QLD, 1463 posts
15 Oct 2012 4:54PM
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swoosh said...
So did they do any science? Or was it just a marketing exercise / publicity stunt?

Maybe I'm a bit cynical, but this was cool when they did it back in the day, because it was cutting edge stuff, nobody knew what would happen, and they were doing research for the space program.

I just can't get excited about this, when it's all in the name of chasing a record and selling more energy drink... And the risk is nowhere near the same as when Kittinger did it.



I reckon drinking redbull is far more dangerous that what Kittinger or Felix did...

jusavina
QLD, 1463 posts
15 Oct 2012 4:55PM
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And yes apparently they did some scientific tests and measurements...

CJW
NSW, 1718 posts
15 Oct 2012 6:56PM
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I'm of the same opinion as swoosh, can't really see the point to it. We all knew it could be done, easily, given the right conditions. Now if we're talking rockets, space stations, space telescopes, going to the moon/mars etc that's a different story because actually doing any of that **** is insanely difficult. Strapping yourself to a helium balloon and then jumping out at 1xx,xxx ft, not so much

Pretty impressed that it was semi-live on national tv though, it's good to have this sort of thing around to inspire the younger generation, might keep them off facetwit for 5 minutes.

That all said, props must go to Redbull because like them or not they spend significant amounts of cash on things for no other reason than 'because they can'. Sure marketing plays a part but I think it's less significant in things like this than say their F1 team and without companies like Redbull the world would be a more boring place to exist.

mineral1
WA, 4564 posts
15 Oct 2012 4:12PM
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swoosh said...
So did they do any science? Or was it just a marketing exercise / publicity stunt?

Maybe I'm a bit cynical, but this was cool when they did it back in the day, because it was cutting edge stuff, nobody knew what would happen, and they were doing research for the space program.

I just can't get excited about this, when it's all in the name of chasing a record and selling more energy drink... And the risk is nowhere near the same as when Kittinger did it.


Yep NASA and associated teams watched with close interest on this experiment, and drew down a great amount of invaluable data

aus301
QLD, 2039 posts
15 Oct 2012 6:34PM
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Why have land speed records? why try to break 50 knots on a windsurfer? why try to eat more pizza than your mates at pizza hut??? Cause you can. People still climb to the top of Everest, and in my books that is still an amazing feat.

Props to anyone that has the desire to do something higher, faster, longer or what ever. These guys inspire others to reach for dreams and go beyond what was once thought possible. And based on the amount of time I saw the footage on morning TV he succeeded in captivating a decent audience.

And props to Red Bull for being a company that is willing to back an individuals desire to exceed. I sat there this morning wondering what was in it for Red Bull, I too can't see they would have much to gain directly out of being involved apart from being see as that company that does... I assume that in itself is enough for them, would be great if there were more out there with the same ethos.

I watched, and was in awe of the fact Felix set out to achieve something, and did.

swoosh
QLD, 1927 posts
15 Oct 2012 7:23PM
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aus301 said...
I sat there this morning wondering what was in it for Red Bull, I too can't see they would have much to gain directly out of being involved apart from being see as that company that does... I assume that in itself is enough for them, would be great if there were more out there with the same ethos.


Big hint, starts with M, ends in arketing...

aus301 said...
And based on the amount of time I saw the footage on morning TV he succeeded in captivating a decent audience.


You've answered your own question really, the amount of coverage they got is pure marketing gold.

To be fair, I think it's great that Redbull get behind stuff like this, there are many more companies who spend their money on things much less meaningful. It's cool that they did it, I just think that this particular stunt, is way overblown and overhyped for what it actually is. And all in the name of selling a product which is basically cancer in can... (okay maybe exaggerating a little), taking it to the extreme how would you feel about the stunt if it was sponsored by Marlboro? I do find it silly that they have their promo girls hanging out near the local jogging track handing out redbull like it's a sports hydration drink...

mineral1 said...
Yep NASA and associated teams watched with close interest on this experiment, and drew down a great amount of invaluable data


Source? I had a look this morning and found very little to link the two.

SeanAUS120
QLD, 753 posts
15 Oct 2012 7:31PM
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+1 aus301 !!

They were researching high altitude flight safety proceedures.

www.redbull.com/int-en/projects/red-bull-stratos

Or something.

You guys are quite cynical! The guy who made the jump 50 years ago wasn't; he was part of the team.

Z1291
208 posts
15 Oct 2012 6:27PM
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mineral1 said...
swoosh said...
So did they do any science? Or was it just a marketing exercise / publicity stunt?

Maybe I'm a bit cynical, but this was cool when they did it back in the day, because it was cutting edge stuff, nobody knew what would happen, and they were doing research for the space program.

I just can't get excited about this, when it's all in the name of chasing a record and selling more energy drink... And the risk is nowhere near the same as when Kittinger did it.


Yep NASA and associated teams watched with close interest on this experiment, and drew down a great amount of invaluable data


Yes, NASA were quite interested in observing the suit he was wearing and how well it held up as they are considering using it on space missions or something like that.

SeanAUS120
QLD, 753 posts
15 Oct 2012 8:41PM
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On wikipedia it says a NASA certified space suit sets you back about $12M.

Considering the project took 5 years in the making... I wonder just how much Redbull actually spent?

r2908
NSW, 214 posts
15 Oct 2012 9:51PM
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Have skydived a few times .. found it quite boring really ..

eyeMhardcore
WA, 81 posts
15 Oct 2012 7:03PM
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Who cares about nasa etc. I need that suit incase I fall when doing my huge backloops.

AUS666
89 posts
15 Oct 2012 7:31PM
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+1 aus301, I would have though there would be more support of someone pushing the very limits.

I have to say every I watch him drop off I get a twang of acrophobia.

Considering that suit it was a nice landing.

SeanAUS120
QLD, 753 posts
15 Oct 2012 9:35PM
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I'm bored...

Should we get in to a heavy discussion about all the science behind the jump?

I'll start:

1) Did Felix make get the sonic boom as he passed the speed of sound?

2) Is the way they are measuring his pass of Mach 1 correct if the measure of mach differs at different altitudes?

My understanding is he wouldn't have got the boom because when he passed through his own sound shockwave, it would have been a pretty small force because of his size (in comparison to a plane) and because the air is so thin up there...so maybe no boom?

DISCUSS!


Reevesy
QLD, 139 posts
15 Oct 2012 9:47PM
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Well lets look at the speed of sound:1246kph @ 20degrees C at sea level air pressure.

So technically he probably did not break the sound barrier as the air wound have been much thinner and colder when he reach the "speed of sound" during the dive.

SeanAUS120
QLD, 753 posts
15 Oct 2012 11:16PM
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This suggests he might have..



It's a comparison of the US Standard Atmosphere.

Mark _australia
WA, 22423 posts
15 Oct 2012 9:21PM
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^^^ Sean all that showed me is that there are further levels after menopause.
Now I am scared.....

AUS666
89 posts
15 Oct 2012 10:03PM
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As you get higher and the air gets gets colder then the speed of sound gets lower (en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=File:Comparison_US_standard_atmosphere_1962.svg&page=1 and NASA calculator www.grc.nasa.gov/WWW/k-12/airplane/sound.html). So I'm saying yes there would be a sonic boom, but due to the low air density it pretty quiet boom.

What I like to know why did'nt he burn up on re-entry?

Plus what were the toilet facilities like? Felix was strapped in the suit for an long time so as the descent was head first did it become a literal dive and hold his breath under wee?

SeanAUS120
QLD, 753 posts
16 Oct 2012 12:36AM
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AUS666 said...
Plus what were the toilet facilities like? Felix was strapped in the suit for an long time so as the descent was head first did it become a literal dive and hold his breath under wee?


TRUE! I remember Joe Kittinger saying through the radio for Felix to keep hydrating...KEEP HYDRATING. I was thinking: 'my gawd, this can't end well in a space suit!'. haha



AUS666
89 posts
15 Oct 2012 10:52PM
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And the lego version;

pweedas
WA, 4642 posts
15 Oct 2012 11:22PM
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SeanAUS120 said...
I'm bored...

Should we get in to a heavy discussion about all the science behind the jump?

I'll start:

1) Did Felix make get the sonic boom as he passed the speed of sound?

2) Is the way they are measuring his pass of Mach 1 correct if the measure of mach differs at different altitudes?

My understanding is he wouldn't have got the boom because when he passed through his own sound shockwave, it would have been a pretty small force because of his size (in comparison to a plane) and because the air is so thin up there...so maybe no boom?

DISCUSS!





Ok,.. discussing.
There would have been only a very small sonic boom due to the fact that the engery available to generate the boom was minimal compared with a jet aircraft engine.
The only energy available to generate the sonic boom was his potential energy being converted into kinetic energy. Since he wasn't all that heavy there was not a lot of energy to make a loud boom,.. just a little pop maybe.

A jet aircraft makes a big boom because there is a bloody great jet engine pumping out the equivalent of 5o thousand horsepower or more which has the capacity to push up a huge wall of compressed air in front of it.

Re. speed of sound at altitude.
The speed of sound varies in a fluid medium proportional to the square root of its density, so for a density of half, speed is divided by root 2.
At high altitude the density is less and the speed of sound is slower than at sea level.
Even commercial aircraft at 35000 feet can travel quite close to the speed of sound due to less dense air. It's a bit strange really because at their service ceiling, due to the less dense air they are also closer to their stalling speed. i.e they can be close to the speed of sound and still close to stall speed.

I would think because they showed a continual readout of the airspeed and altitude, they wouldn't have fudged this one because they would know they would get busted on it.

pweedas
WA, 4642 posts
15 Oct 2012 11:32PM
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AUS666 said...
What I like to know why did'nt he burn up on re-entry?

Plus what were the toilet facilities like? Felix was strapped in the suit for an long time so as the descent was head first did it become a literal dive and hold his breath under wee?


Re-entry velocity is up normally around 17000 miles per hour plus. If he had jumped from an altitude of 5000km he would have had that problem but from 39km he only had enough altitude to get to about 700 miles per hour.
That's enough to warm his bum but not much else.

I don't know about the wizz facilities.
Maybe he wore a nappy.
Maybe he was smart enough not to drink coughee before the flight.

SeanAUS120
QLD, 753 posts
16 Oct 2012 6:33PM
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pweedas said...
Re. speed of sound at altitude.
The speed of sound varies in a fluid medium proportional to the square root of its density, so for a density of half, speed is divided by root 2.
At high altitude the density is less and the speed of sound is slower than at sea level.



That sounds pretty legit.

So when they say a Space Shuttle is orbiting the planet at Mach 25. It's just a lazy way of saying they're doing +27000km/h or so, right?

boardboy
QLD, 554 posts
16 Oct 2012 6:46PM
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Select to expand quote


Maybe he was smart enough not to drink coughee before the flight.


drink what? coughee? whats in that?

AUS02
TAS, 1993 posts
16 Oct 2012 8:35PM
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Awesome!!

deejay8204
QLD, 557 posts
16 Oct 2012 7:46PM
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They said people on the ground heard two booms, whether or not this is true it is still pretty cool. I would try it if I had the spare millions of $$ to throw around.

pweedas
WA, 4642 posts
16 Oct 2012 11:03PM
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SeanAUS120 said...
So when they say a Space Shuttle is orbiting the planet at Mach 25. It's just a lazy way of saying they're doing +27000km/h or so, right?



I think when they quote a mach speed for space shuttles it's usually taken in reference to the speed of sound at sea level and standard temp and pressure, which makes it around 760 miles per hour. (or 340 metres per second)
So mach 25 would be 19,000 miles per hour.
The re-entry velocity varies according to the altitude the spacecraft was orbiting at. Anything in earth orbit will have a re-entry velocity of something less than 25,000 miles per hour because anything faster than that is in excess of the earths escape velocity. In other words, if they were going faster than 25,000 miles an hour they would have simply left earth and kept going out.

The formulae which govern all that stuff are surprisingly simple and are mostly the same ones Mr Newton came up with a few hundred years ago regarding swinging a rock around in a sock. f = mv^2 / r , and for a stable orbit, the centrifical force f also has to exactly equal the force of gravity at that altitude, keeping in mind that gravity decreases as radius "r" increases. i.e. as altitude increases.

Most people think that a space shuttle in stable earth orbit has escaped earths gravity.
It has not.
If they put on the handbrake and stopped they would do exactly what Felix Watsizname did and tumble straight back to earth,. at 19,000 miles an hour.
It would be very spectacular,. for a short while.

pweedas
WA, 4642 posts
16 Oct 2012 11:23PM
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Regarding something I said earlier about a falling Felix not generating the power output to make much of a sonic boom, I might have to modify that view.
Some rough calculations,..
power = force x velocity
say velocity was 700 miles per hour and falling Felix in his space suit and wet nappy was around 180 pounds. (about 80kg)
given that;
5280 feet in a mile,
3600 seconds in an hour,
550 foot pounds per second is one horsepower.

hp = 700 x 5280 x180 / (3600 x 550) = 336 horsepower.

That's probably sufficient power to make a small but noticeable boom.

jp747
1553 posts
24 Oct 2012 2:56PM
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SeanAUS120 said...
pweedas said...
Re. speed of sound at altitude.
The speed of sound varies in a fluid medium proportional to the square root of its density, so for a density of half, speed is divided by root 2.
At high altitude the density is less and the speed of sound is slower than at sea level.



That sounds pretty legit.

So when they say a Space Shuttle is orbiting the planet at Mach 25. It's just a lazy way of saying they're doing +27000km/h or so, right?



gotta quote you on this one never thought it this way

Macroscien
QLD, 6806 posts
24 Oct 2012 5:23PM
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pweedas said...
Regarding something I said earlier about a falling Felix not generating the power output to make much of a sonic boom, I might have to modify that view.
Some rough calculations,..
power = force x velocity
say velocity was 700 miles per hour and falling Felix in his space suit and wet nappy was around 180 pounds. (about 80kg)
given that;
5280 feet in a mile,
3600 seconds in an hour,
550 foot pounds per second is one horsepower.

hp = 700 x 5280 x180 / (3600 x 550) = 336 horsepower.

That's probably sufficient power to make a small but noticeable boom.

Elaborate calculations.
Tell me then what would happen if you drop the same Felix from the balloon on the Moon ??
What will be "his power" to brake sound barrier ??
Should we rename Redbull from Energy to Power Drink ?
since also improve analytical thinking so maybe rather THINK DRINK
so question is How many THINK DRINKs did you use to come to this conclusion?



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"Redbull STRATOS" started by SeanAUS120