Search for a Location
  Clear Recents
Metro
South West
Central West
North West
  Surf Cameras
  Safety Bay Camera
Metro
North
Mid North
Illawarra
South Coast
Metro
West Coast
East Coast
Brisbane
Far North
Central Coast
Sunshine Coast
Gold Coast
Hobart
West Coast
North Coast
East Coast
Recent
Western Australia
New South Wales
Victoria
South Australia
Queensland
Northern Territory
Tasmania
  My Favourites
  Reverse Arrows
General
Gps & Speed Sailing
Wave Sailing
Foiling
Gear Reviews
Lost & Found
Windsurfing WA
Windsurfing NSW
Windsurfing QLD
Windsurfing Victoria
Windsurfing SA
Windsurfing Tasmania
General
Gear Reviews
Foiling
Newbies / Tips & Tricks
Lost & Found
Western Australia
New South Wales
Queensland
Victoria
South Australia
Tasmania
General
Foiling
Board Talk & Reviews
Wing Foiling
All
Windsurfing
Kitesurfing
Surfing
Longboarding
Stand Up Paddle
Wing Foiling
Sailing
  Active Topics
  Subscribed Topics
  Rules & Guidelines
Login
Lost My Details!
Join! (Its Free)
  Search for a Location
  Clear Recents
Metro
South West
Central West
North West
Surf Cameras
Safety Bay Camera
Metro
North
Mid North
Illawarra
South Coast
Metro
West Coast
East Coast
Brisbane
Far North
Central Coast
Sunshine Coast
Gold Coast
Hobart
West Coast
North Coast
East Coast
Recent
Western Australia
New South Wales
Victoria
South Australia
Queensland
Northern Territory
Tasmania
  My Favourites
  Reverse Arrows
All
Windsurfing
Kitesurfing
Surfing
Longboarding
Stand Up Paddle
Wing Foiling
Sailing
Active Topics
Subscribed Topics
Forum Rules
Login
Lost My Details!
Join! (Its Free)

Forums > Windsurfing   New South Wales

botany bay Sunday

Reply
Created by razzmatazz > 9 months ago, 4 Sep 2011
razzmatazz
NSW, 184 posts
4 Sep 2011 3:19PM
Thumbs Up

Hi there.
Anyone been to Kyeemagh today?
How was the wind? I checked the graphs and it was just a little confusing. Kurnell had 12 to 15 kts and airport had 5kts. I decided to not take the long drive down from the mountains but wondered whether I just have taken the Kurnell graph as a guide or the airport one?!!

Waiting4wind
NSW, 1871 posts
4 Sep 2011 9:10PM
Thumbs Up

The wind started around 2pm, light and It was around 12-18 knots. I was on a 7.8m so planing about 80% of the time.

razzmatazz
NSW, 184 posts
4 Sep 2011 9:44PM
Thumbs Up

Cheers. Didn't miss to much then. Where would be a good spot on the harbour?The graph there looked pretty solid.

tomp
NSW, 688 posts
4 Sep 2011 10:56PM
Thumbs Up

Raz,

I'm a bit suspicious of that Syd harbour graph and I reckon it over-reads a few knots in NE. I've been at Balmoral and was checking the live readings last summer & it's not as windy as the readings say. Balmoral usually is better for NE than Manly for example as the NE has a slight funneling effect there.

I think the harbour graph is on one of the towers off Bradley's Head and when the wind is NNE (often later in the arvo) then it could be accurate.

Good spots to launch would be Rose Bay or Bradley's Head (although parking is metered & busy on w'ends).

I have sailed from Balmoral to Camp Cove in a good NE and Balmoral is a good f/w spot but the parking on w'ends makes it a pain.

Roar
NSW, 471 posts
5 Sep 2011 9:38AM
Thumbs Up

razzmatazz said...

Hi there.
Anyone been to Kyeemagh today?
How was the wind? I checked the graphs and it was just a little confusing. Kurnell had 12 to 15 kts and airport had 5kts. I decided to not take the long drive down from the mountains but wondered whether I just have taken the Kurnell graph as a guide or the airport one?!!


Kurnell is always about 5 knots stronger than kyeemagh in a NNE but also tends to be a bit rougher since its not as sheltered like it is behind the runway.


Wineman
NSW, 1412 posts
5 Sep 2011 11:00AM
Thumbs Up


To find out exactly what everyone did yesterday on Botany, have a look
at the GPS Team Challenge page.
Lots of reports there.

gpsteamchallenge.com.au/sailor_session/show?date=2011-09-04&team=5

Brett Morris
NSW, 1200 posts
5 Sep 2011 11:30AM
Thumbs Up

Kyeemagh was perfect, flat water and 15-18knots. Car parking and avoiding BBQ's at the south end was the biggest issue!

Wineman
NSW, 1412 posts
5 Sep 2011 12:00PM
Thumbs Up

Brett Morris said...

Kyeemagh was perfect, flat water and 15-18knots. Car parking and avoiding BBQ's at the south end was the biggest issue!


That's why we should take over the northern car park for windsurfers, before the others discover it!

BenKirk
NSW, 600 posts
5 Sep 2011 1:46PM
Thumbs Up

tomp said...

Raz,

I'm a bit suspicious of that Syd harbour graph and I reckon it over-reads a few knots in NE. I've been at Balmoral and was checking the live readings last summer & it's not as windy as the readings say. Balmoral usually is better for NE than Manly for example as the NE has a slight funneling effect there.

I think the harbour graph is on one of the towers off Bradley's Head and when the wind is NNE (often later in the arvo) then it could be accurate.

Good spots to launch would be Rose Bay or Bradley's Head (although parking is metered & busy on w'ends).

I have sailed from Balmoral to Camp Cove in a good NE and Balmoral is a good f/w spot but the parking on w'ends makes it a pain.




tomp,

When on the jetcat heading home after another missed NE'r, I can asure you that the wind is much stronger in the harbour than at Balmoral or Manly. All I can assume is that the wind funnels all the way down from Manly to Rose Bay and accelerates.

Cheers

Ian K
WA, 4115 posts
5 Sep 2011 1:40PM
Thumbs Up

BenKirk said...

tomp said...

Raz,

I'm a bit suspicious of that Syd harbour graph and I reckon it over-reads a few knots in NE. I've been at Balmoral and was checking the live readings last summer & it's not as windy as the readings say. Balmoral usually is better for NE than Manly for example as the NE has a slight funneling effect there.

I think the harbour graph is on one of the towers off Bradley's Head and when the wind is NNE (often later in the arvo) then it could be accurate.

Good spots to launch would be Rose Bay or Bradley's Head (although parking is metered & busy on w'ends).

I have sailed from Balmoral to Camp Cove in a good NE and Balmoral is a good f/w spot but the parking on w'ends makes it a pain.




tomp,

When on the jetcat heading home after another missed NE'r, I can asure you that the wind is much stronger in the harbour than at Balmoral or Manly. All I can assume is that the wind funnels all the way down from Manly to Rose Bay and accelerates.

Cheers


It seems to be the case that slightly inland water ways can get a stronger version of the Noreaster than the beach side. I've heard people say that Botany Bay can be stronger than Wanda. The west side of Lake Illawarra is often windier than Bellambi. Famously windy Gerroa could be thought of as an "inland lake" from the perspective of a Noreaster.

Wineman
NSW, 1412 posts
5 Sep 2011 4:03PM
Thumbs Up

BenKirk said...

tomp said...

Raz,

I'm a bit suspicious of that Syd harbour graph ......


tomp,

When on the jetcat heading home after another missed NE'r, I can asure you that the wind is much stronger in the harbour than at Balmoral or Manly. All I can assume is that the wind funnels all the way down from Manly to Rose Bay and accelerates.

Cheers



I remember from Twilight races (yachts) on the harbour, there was a definite lift and stronger breeze in a N/E'ster along the line from Bradleys Head to Georges Head (& prob Middle head).
So yes, I reckon there is a funnel effect giving a higher reading (don't know by how much, though)

Brett Morris
NSW, 1200 posts
5 Sep 2011 4:28PM
Thumbs Up

I always thought that Kyeemagh was windier in a NE because the wind accelerates across the airport runways?

stehsegler
WA, 3479 posts
5 Sep 2011 2:47PM
Thumbs Up

Brett Morris said...

I always thought that Kyeemagh was windier in a NE because the wind accelerates across the airport runways?


yup... having sailed across the entire bay from Kyeemagh to Kurnell and back in both a Southerly and NorthEaster I would say the wind is strongest along the runway in both Southerlies and North Easters.

I think the surrounding topography has a lot to answer for.

Roar
NSW, 471 posts
5 Sep 2011 4:48PM
Thumbs Up

When you sail across from kurnel to the runway there is always a noticible drop when you get in the shadow of the port itself (channel thru center of the bay) then it picks up again once you get in behind the runway.

The green area is wher the wind is usualty stronger and the red is where the wind tends to have bigger holes in it.

sick_em_rex
NSW, 1600 posts
5 Sep 2011 4:52PM
Thumbs Up

You don't think maybe it just 'feels' stronger behind the runway cause the water is flatter? I'm not at all saying I disagree, I'm just hypothesising....

makesurf
NSW, 242 posts
5 Sep 2011 5:27PM
Thumbs Up

tomp said...
I'm a bit suspicious of that Syd harbour graph and I reckon it over-reads a few knots in NE.


I think that it is getting the local wind OK although probably not on the water, up the hill a bit. I know that the NE funnels down there (see map)
www.seabreeze.com.au/maps/nsw.asp
This makes the information relevant to yachties but not much use for windsurfing.
You would need to jump in off the rocks somewhere along Chowder Bay Road to get out there.

The yachties often put their race courses out there so it can get crowded.

makesurf
NSW, 242 posts
5 Sep 2011 5:38PM
Thumbs Up

Ian K said...
Famously windy Gerroa could be thought of as an "inland lake" from the perspective of a Noreaster.


Many of the things you are describing are "lens effect". The hills bend the winds and the "lens" occurs when they recombine.





vosadrian
NSW, 403 posts
5 Sep 2011 5:54PM
Thumbs Up

sick_em_rex said...

You don't think maybe it just 'feels' stronger behind the runway cause the water is flatter? I'm not at all saying I disagree, I'm just hypothesising....


I have also sailed over to Kurnell a couple of times. I have found that the swell/chop is much larger in the centre, and this combines with the lightest wind, so it is generally not as good for sailing in the middle. When you get closer to Kurnell, the wind picks up and chop drops off (though not like in the runway corner!!). The first time I did it with a large sail, I thought the wind was picking up and was starting to get overpowered over at Kurnell, and was wondering if I would make it back, but on the way back it eased off again in the middle, and I was fine. If making the run across, you are better off with gear with good wind range to avoid slogging in the middle. The wind seems to drop off badly a few hundred metres past the end of the runway when going Kyeemak->Kurnell. A big shadow there, and then picks up a little a few hundred metres later.

Ads72
NSW, 362 posts
5 Sep 2011 5:57PM
Thumbs Up

Just when you thought you knew everything, something gets posted on a Seabreeze forum!.......How cool is wind?....Wind rocks & Botany Bay rocks big time!

Ian K
WA, 4115 posts
5 Sep 2011 4:08PM
Thumbs Up

The roughness of the water will also be having an effect. There's a thing called "roughness length" which I gather is pretty hard to determine, but it goes in the logarithmic profile equation (I also gather it's more of an approximation than an equation). The rougher the surface the more the logarithmic profile is stretched vertically. Inland waters with less fetch and chop allow the wind aloft to get down closer to the surface. Once you're clear of other obstacles of course.

Waiting4wind
NSW, 1871 posts
5 Sep 2011 8:08PM
Thumbs Up

I just rig a sail size bigger than the forecast suggests, that usualy solves the problem and makes it exciting in the gusts.

Enceladus
NSW, 66 posts
5 Sep 2011 9:12PM
Thumbs Up

Waiting4wind said...

I just rig a sail size bigger than the forecast suggests, that usualy solves the problem and makes it exciting in the gusts.


That sounds like what I have been doing for a long time

tomp
NSW, 688 posts
5 Sep 2011 9:37PM
Thumbs Up

Ian K,

love the science stuff.

As long as the harbour gets windy in a NE/NNE, we just have to get out there!

174
NSW, 190 posts
6 Sep 2011 7:44AM
Thumbs Up

Ian K said...
I've heard people say that Botany Bay can be stronger than Wanda.


I think that's often the case. Quite a few times I've had a marginal sail at Wanda but seen it much more solid at Kyeemagh on the way home - and have had the occasional quick second session to confirm it.. Kyeemagh doesn't have waves though!

Boydist
NSW, 11 posts
5 Oct 2011 5:56PM
Thumbs Up

I was there on Sunday at Dolls Point. It's my 3rd time there and I find the graph has been fairly accurate. Though I reckon on Sunday and the other couple of days it was a few knts stronger (at times) than the graph stated.

I'll be taking a wind meter next time to check my hunch.



Subscribe
Reply

Forums > Windsurfing   New South Wales


"botany bay Sunday" started by razzmatazz