I designed this a while ago with 3D CAD. It's an 85 Litre I guess Bump and Jump board designed for farting around in Melbourne Seabreezes. 235 X 59.5X 85 litres. Fast rocker line with nice tucked rails and wide but thin tail . Lots of V up forward to smooth the chop and a touch of concave running out between the straps.
It,s aimed at being quick enough for the occasional drag race but still loose enough to mess around in the Bay swell. An allrounder for just having fun.
I used it last Sunday for the first time and although the conditions were crap when up and running it felt great, smooth as silk. Seemed pretty fast but was quite loose and held great speed through the Gybes.It appears to do just what I wanted it too.
Mark has done a fabulous job building it from full size prints off the computer. As well as being finished beautifully and looking great, the shape is really smooth and fair. His unique construction also gives the board a really soft ride , perfect for the harsh chop in Port Phillip Bay.
I,m very happy.
Beautiful looking board.
So you designed the board and it was built for you? Thats very creative. If someone else wanted the same or similar designed board do they need your permission?
No, I assume Stoney still has all the measurements/templates so he could do another one,no probs . His designs are awesome as well, some of the best wave boards you can buy,it's just I wanted something different and I am a designer so couldn't help myself.
If you wantd something specific designed I would be happy to help. It's great fun , love doing it.
Regards Martin
Looks nice Mr Love. A similar description to my old Naish Supacross which lives on lord Howe Island.
A bit shorter and bit wider in the tail, and much better looking of course. I need something like that for the mainland.
But you've raised an interesting point. You obviously believe you can combine the known characteristics of each handling parameter, blend them smoothly using a computer and have a board that works.
Some manufacturers push the line that there's something magical in the combination and it takes numerous prototypes and late nights with the router and hack saw to fine tune the basic shape.
Have a look at starboards - the routed bits are painted red and see it through to production. Looks a bit random, but they do go well apparently.
Sometimes you hear that certain sizes in a scaled line go better than others.
So by fast rocker line you mean pretty straight behind the front footstraps? SSD is the manufacturer in Geraldton that mainly does wave boards?
Hi Ian , I think by trying to design an "allrounder" you are obviously going to compromise in certain areas. This board is not going to be as snappy as a pure wave board as it doesn't have alot of tail rocker, but also won't be as fast as a true slalom board as it has more. What I was trying to do was combine the elements that I like in a board to give me the allround performance that I was looking for.
I had quite alot of data as a starting point. I have measured alot of the boards I have ridden over the last few years so have a pretty good idea of what characteristic or combination of give a certain ride. I new what I wanted so it was really a matter of choosing the shape characteristics, the rocker,V,outline figures that were going to give me that. The advantage of doing it on CAD was that once I had my base design modeled it was easy to modify and finese it . The evaluation tools also really enable very fair curves and accurate surface.
The thing I found I had tweak the most was the thickness to acheive the desired volume . Without a computer I am not sure how designers accurately predict the volume outcome of a board, I guess just experience , but I do suspect there are alot of boards about that could be as much as 10% different to their stated volume.
Most of all I just had fun with it. It,s very satisfying sailing something you have designed and seeing if it perfoms the way you expected. I have a speed baord to do next.
By fast rocker line I mean it is fairly straight from about 750 to the tail . It has 5mm of tail rocker and no true flat but is still quite straight compared to a pure wave board.
Mark Stone is based in Geralton and makes mainly Wave and Surf boards. His boards are highly regarded by Wave sailors. I was really happy he agreed to build this board as was a pleasure to deal with.
Regards Martin
Do you know how SSD produced the board from your design? I'm not involved with design but with IT at a school and have to support a CAD application called Catia. Its quite fun to work with. School students design a model F1 car to race down a track. A router is used to make the car body out of balsa wood.
Can you judge how accurately the finished product reflects your design?
Hi Moby, I supplied Mark with full size sections every 200mm, centreline, and plan view showing overall outline and rail to bottom intersection . Mast track, fin box and strap locations. Mark did say he could not guarantee 100% accuracy but would do his best. I have not gone over the board with a fine tooth comb but in essence it is the board I designed and very happy with the outcome. There are some surfboard builders that have NC cutting facilities but so far I have not found one that could use my file, system incompatability issues.
Yes I know Catia but have never used it. This was done on Alias which is widely used in Car design. I can export in Iges which Catia will read.
It,s fun designing them and I have about six boards modelled now , A Formula ,this one , a 100 and 120 litre Slalom and 2 speed boards. The small speed board is next to get built but that will exhaust the fun tickets I am afraid. I would also love to do the smaller slalom but it will have to wait.
If you are thinking about modeling some boards definitely go for it. You will learn heaps.
Regards Martin
The Magic carpet .........................
This board is so balanced volume wise ,planes early OUT of gybes, is light and strong and so easy / soft to ride. It gouges and carve and slides on Q every time WITH extra drive, the whole wave face open up for you , it digs 2-10 foot.
The board also flys up wind. This one floats me out in 10knots ts with a 5.5 and at 105 kgs will fang through the lulls,and when your on a swell ........the board dose all the work ........you just slot in for the magic carpet ride.
And the finish ..... UNREAL .............your onto it Stoney
what does your board weigh with straps
I did a similar thing with a surfboard, where I designed it in Catia, and sent it to a mate to shape for me.
If I did it again, I'd use something like BoardCAD (boardcad.org)
Mr Love, what software did you use, and did you think about getting the blank CNC shaped?
Keef, 7.5 with straps.
DL, I did, but I didn't have the time or skill to do the rest of it ( actually the shaping is the bit I could do) so I would then have had to ship he blank to Mark. I contacted a few surfboard CNC cutters but we had issues with file types. Most of those machines are geared towards a specific software called SurfCAD ( I think)
I used Alias, which is the system most of the major car manufactures use in the design studio's. Even converting to Iges or UG Part files they could not read my files, even got the French guy who developed the software to try but it all got too hard, so printing templates was the way to go.
Hi Martin,
Your Windsurf design work is of interest as I'm heading in that direction.
Short Background:
With the large downturn in general business & No wind for a long time over here in Auckland I've resumed building my expensive CNC mill [2.8m x 1.3m] that's been in the garage for a few years. With the machine build near completion looking at designing some boards (Speed & Slalom), the missing ingredients being Actual CAD Design files & CAM software.
Design Software that I may use:
For CAD I have "Rhino 3dm" & looking at "BoardCAD".
For CAM software not too sure what to use? Some CAM packages are too basic while others are horrendously expensive.
"Shape3d" software for boards would be easy way but restrictive to boards only, doubt it can be used for foils.
Martin with your experience in Design can you help with the following?
1/ With Rhino 3dm ~ to keep the 3D curve flowing smoothly over the Windsurf board, what Spine Distances should I use for width & length of the board?
2/ Can you recommend any CAM package that could be of use for boards & foils?
regards, Michael
Hi Martin,
Came across this thread & your Windsurf design work is of interest.
Short Background:
With the large downturn in Sales & No wind for a long time over here in Auckland I've resumed building my expensive CNC mill [2.8m x 1.3m] that's been in the garage 90% complete for a few years. With the machine build near completion looking at designing some boards (Speed & Slalom), the missing ingredients being Actual CAD Design files & CAM software.
Design Software that I may use:
For CAD I have "Rhino 3dm" & looking at "BoardCAD".
For CAM software not too sure what to use? Some CAM packages are too basic while others are horrendously expensive.
"Shape3d" software for boards would be easy way but too restrictive as I think it can not be used for foils.
Martin with your experience in Design can you help with the following?
1/ With Rhino 3dm ~ to keep the 3D curve flowing smoothly over the Windsurf board, what Spine Distances should I use for width & length of the board?
2/ Can you recommend any CAM package that could be of use for boards & foils?
regards, Michael
Hi Micheal, I have had a bit of a play with Rhino , it looks the goods but I am not familiar enough with it to give you advice.
When I model on Alias I try to keep the model as simple as possible and only add sections if I need them for accuracy.
If you like I can send you an Igs of one of my boards so you can see how I have constructed it. It may help?
Sorry CAM is not my feild , I am a Designer. I have looked at the SurfCAD program and yes it does look very restricted , really only suited to modelling boards.
Does Rhino have a CAM add on ?
Regards Martin
srry mate I forgot to add. Andrew McDougall, KA owner and Cheif designer has a CAM program for Foils called McFoil. I know nothing about it but can suss him out if you wish. It may also be OK for boards ?
Seeya again.
Hi Martin,
Not too sure what's happening with the double post? System rejected 1st
post so posted again with the same rejection, but both posts appear?
Have imported a few KA Koncepts into N.Z & very happy with the performance.
Andrew was over here last summer for a holiday & briefly called in at my place and
had a quick view of the machine. If you could suss out the McFoil that would be great, think Rhino Cam plugin is expensive & may use "Cut3D" CAM.
"Alias" software is professional expensive software out of my budget, as a learner
will stick to Rhino as it cost effective & easy to use. With my novice experience
importing & converting other file formats require rescaling in Rhino while other nested levels are retained as per the original format..
Be much appreciated if you could fire thru an IGS file to see how an IGS translates into Rhino, maybe able to cut a board for you if all goes well.
regards, Michael
Almost had some wind today at the lynfield speed run, low tide was too early & not low enough with the wind being too broad.
No Worries Michael, If you can PM me your email address I will send through an Igs of this board for you. It opens in Rhino fine done it a number of times.Yep Alias is totally out of the question price wise.
Andrew is down at Geelong for the Moth Championships this week. When he gets back I will talk to him about Mc Foil for you as I know nothing about it.
Seeya Martin
