Forums > Kitesurfing General

To knot or not to knot

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Created by DEECEE > 9 months ago, 23 Feb 2016
Loftywinds
QLD, 2060 posts
29 Feb 2016 12:16PM
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KPSS Used said..

loftywinds2 said..


KPSS Used said..



loftywinds2 said..




KIT33R said..
A simple Google search found these

everything2.com:443/title/How+knots+weaken+rope

davidschmidtwriting.com/busted.htm

www.bethandevans.com/pdf/8_strength.pdf

Consensus - Yes, knots weaken a rope.






I agree, but one knot on relatively new (less than 4 years) lines, is ok by me. They still hold at least 150kg psi





That is absolutely terrible advice.





And you suggest? Oh let me guess... come into our store and get brand new lines. Safe as houses!




Take knots out of lines STRAIGHT AWAY.

Replace lines when worn, we see some people going through a lineset in a season. 4 years is far from "relatively new".

Most certainly safer than "don't worry about knots in your lines as long as they are less than 4 years old"


Of course take the knot out, but my point was a knot is not going to suddenly pop a line, unless it's been used and abused.

Untie the knot and keep using the lines.

If the lines are starting to fray and show bits of rope splitting, then by all means - get a new set.

Is that bad advice still?

Gorgo
VIC, 4982 posts
29 Feb 2016 2:05PM
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Is it bad advice? Yes. It's so easy to get a knot out of a line. Why would you not do it? I've unknotted lines for a mate on the beach before a session. The knotted line probably won't break, but it might.

Your math is sound, sort of. Kite lines are generally 300kg breaking strain and can be up to 500kg so it's reasonable to assume 150 kg remaining strength with a knot. But a powered up 80kg rider could conceivably do a 2g load and pop. That's 160kg right there.

Gorgo
VIC, 4982 posts
29 Feb 2016 2:08PM
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Select to expand quote
DEECEE said..
....
Interesting point from mark50 about manufacturers only using specific knots in their line setups. ...


Pigtail lines are usually 3mm Dyneema. That's at least 700 kg breaking strain. You can get similar stuff with 1100 kg breaking strain. Even cheap stuff with a knot in it is going to be stronger than your kite lines.

If you make your own leaders and stuff you can double splice them so there's no strength lost at all.

KIT33R
NSW, 1714 posts
29 Feb 2016 3:37PM
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DEECEE
NSW, 45 posts
29 Feb 2016 8:03PM
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BRILLIANT KIT33R!!!

I think you have captured the whole concept of the knot / not issue perfectly

KIT33R
NSW, 1714 posts
29 Feb 2016 9:51PM
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I rest my case.

Mark50
NSW, 166 posts
29 Feb 2016 11:19PM
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But after all that who is on first...

DEECEE
NSW, 45 posts
1 Mar 2016 8:57AM
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What's on second?



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"To knot or not to knot" started by DEECEE