Rider: 65 kg, intermediate/advanced
Style: Surf/ Wake, Freestyle
Weather: 15-32 knots
Build Quality: ?/10
Satisfaction: 8/10
I bought the board few months ago and used only twice before having the nose broken in a funny way. No special crash and not evidence of significant impact. The paint cracked at the tip of the nose and along the two rails for about 10 cm. No sign of fiberglass being extremely bended (not crack on the top and bottom of the board). I think the cause of these cracks is delamination between the layers. I would like to know what to do. The north guys are happy to repair it at their cost but apparently not to change the board (still waiting for their email); my concern is that if this is a problem of manufacture it could propagate trough out the board regardless. Suggestion/ recommendation are welcome.
North boards are great, sure they have their issues but in my experience they have always honoured their warranty. If it's def a construction fault - I'd be looking to have that board replaced or a refund.
I had the exact same type of split on an underground surfboard a while back. I had ridden it for a couple of years before it happened. In my case, I wiped out but the board got carried by the wave straight to the shore and got dumped on the beach nose first. I guess when it hit the shore and the white water is still pushing, there must be a fair bit of force applied on the board.
I see you are in WA, if you ride the usual Perth mush, this is a classic scenario when riding shorebreaks. I am not a big fan of production boards but I think the North are not too bad. A few of my mates ride them rather hard and they seem to be strong enough.
Hard to see on the pic but it does not really look like a delamination to me. Is the foam core split as well?
Having had some experience with chasing warranty for North gear it is my understanding that the people who in reality determine the extent of the warranty is the retailer. I think a worthwhile retailer who sold you a $1000 board that fell apart after 2 sessions would gladly replace the board and put pressure on the supplier to pony up the cost -that is providing that it is clearly a manufacturing fault. It is not North that honour the warranty though, it is the retailer.
You may however get the old "North dont do that" (and neither does this retailer)
Select to expand quotesnalberski said..
Having had some experience with chasing warranty for North gear it is my understanding that the people who in reality determine the extent of the warranty is the retailer. I think a worthwhile retailer who sold you a $1000 board that fell apart after 2 sessions would gladly replace the board and put pressure on the supplier to pony up the cost -that is providing that it is clearly a manufacturing fault. It is not North that honour the warranty though, it is the retailer.
You may however get the old "North dont do that" (and neither does this retailer)
You are right, the First point of contact and initial diagnoses is from the retailer, who then if they think there is genuine case, sends pics/details to the aussie distributor to make a final call (of course he may confer with north head office a bit).
I have never had an issue with north at all if there has been a genuine warranty case. May have taken 'a while' sometimes, but always eventually received replacement goods.
Select to expand quoteloftywinds2 said..
Yeah good luck with the after sales service too.
LOL
You know it's true
Hi Aleamodio,
As a North retailer myself I can shed a little light on this and about North Warranty process in general.
For starters, warranty is usually on the workmanship and materials of the product. If the defect comes from the failing of the materials or the workmanship, then North have the option to fix or replace the product at their discretion.
Most surf products do not come with any sort of warranty due to the forces exerted on the product under the conditions of normal usage. If you buy a brand new custom surfboard and it is broken on your first wave due to a wave crashing on it, that is usually hard luck. Some shapers will give you a discount on the next board and some may repair at cost but no one is going to give you a refund or a new board.
North warrant their products in the surf but not against breakage. Due to the forces of water and shallow beach breaks where most damage like this occurs, it is difficult to determine whether the split was due to workmanship or materials failure. The force of water pushing the board into the sand can be incredible, and at times it is not possible to guarantee no damage to a product that is light and fun to use.
Take it in to see your local retailer where you bought the board and let them have a look and take piccies. They then send the pics to North Australia who also send the pics to North in Germany/Portugal for assessment. The turnaround time can be as quick as overnight, or as long as a week. North are VERY good with warranty in my experience.
It is very difficult from the pics you posted to see any real detail. It may have been dropped on it's nose, hit whilst in transport or on reef, or whacked on a post in the wind on the beach access path or anything really...
The repair is an easy one and should cost around $100 if done properly. The retailer will likely get a credit with North and will pay the repairer if it was deemed to be from workmanship or materials failure.
Best of luck,
DM
I must say that so far I have been lucky. The dealer seems understanding and he already passed the case to the north crew, I keep my finger crossed.
Hi Darren,
Thanks for your clarification regarding the North warranty process. I understand that the warranty can cover only defects from the failing of the materials or the workmanship; however I don't think that North should have always the option to fix or replace the product at their discretion, because sometimes defects cannot be correct with repair. For example, if there is a problem on the connection between the foam and the wood or the foam and the fiberglass (as I suspect I have) at any particular part of the board is likely that you have similar problem elsewhere. For this case I think North should only replace the item.
Now, regarding the forces exerted on the product under the conditions of normal usage. Once again I agree that they can be extreme, I also agree that if you break your board on your first wave, it is likely only hard luck, however you should always analyze how the board broke before deciding if it should be cover by the warranty or not.
By observing a broken board you can have an idea of what happened. The surf boards are a composition of different materials with different properties (i.e. wood, foam and fiberglass); the fiberglass, which is the resistant part is laid on the top and the bottom to provide a better resistance when the board bends.
When the board bends, one of the two layers of fiberglass (i.e. top or bottom) reacts in compression (generally the layer at the top face of the board) and the other in tension; until one of the two layers reach its capacity (generally the layer in compression because of buckling). The inner materials (foam and wood) transfer only the shear between the two layers. Hence, if the layers which form the core are not properly glued together they can't transfer shear and the board can fail under a small load. To give you an example try to imagine the resistance in bending of a board of plywood without having the few layers of wood glued together.
Generally, when the board works properly and fails due to bending, a crack is evident on the top or the bottom face of the board which indicates that the fiberglass reached its limit. You may say that its limit was too low maybe because was not enough fiberglass or the board was too thin, but if you see that crack the board worked as it should. Please note that the crack doesn't have to be on the rail of the board (as it is shown on my photos) but on the body.
When the board doesn't show any sign or crack on the fiberglass and the core is split in two... to me is a bed sign and it is properly due to defect on the core of the board.
Now going back to your point: if you buy a custom board and you break it after the first session.... You go to talk to the shaper, who should know what we are talking about, and if the board shows a failure mechanism which is not appropriate he should be able to change your board.
I think that my dealer understood the problem, I sent him the photos and currently I'm waiting for the replay from the North crew (I don't know from where...North Australia of Europe). After all, I have few mates with the same board and nobody had similar problems, so I still believe that this will be properly sorted. Hopefully soon though, because the season has started.
Cheers
Ale
Select to expand quotealeamodio said..
When the board doesn't show any sign or crack on the fiberglass and the core is split in two... to me is a bed sign and it is properly due to defect on the core of the board.
If the core is split as mentioned above, I can't see why it would be a defect.... Not the description of delamination as suggested before.
You'll be a lucky man if they cover that under the warranty.
Ok Livit it may not being called delamination. Could u please explain what is the principle why a board should break in this way then?
"Most surf products do not come with any sort of warranty"
Actually consumer law in Australia states that a product sold has to be fit for the purpose it is designed for and to last a reasonable amount of time. That is for new and secondhand goods. I did once have a new board break on the first wave I rode on it in average 3 foot surf, took it back to the shop and they said hard luck.. I made an inquiry to consumer affairs and they told me it is not at the discretion of the shop to modify Australian consumer law just because it is a surfboard. There is no special category for surfboards as much as shapers and surf shops would like you tell you. I rang the shop again and explained this and they replaced the board as they were required to under law. I also realised later after looking at the manufacturers site that the board was glassed with the wrong weight of glass for its size so I had been sold some sort of pro board that I had not asked for. The shop told me the glass weight sticker was wrong and not the glass. Cant imagine how they would know that.
BTW that rail crack looks like one that appeared on my 2012 Wam not long after I bought it. Pretty sure it was a sand through of the glass on the rail which was a manufacturing fault. I had some epoxy and glass in the shed so I just sucked it up and fixed it myself.
Select to expand quotealeamodio said..
Ok Livit it may not being called delamination. Could u please explain what is the principle why a board should break in this way then?
Just like DM said : "Due to the forces of water and shallow beach breaks where most damage like this occurs, it is difficult to determine whether the split was due to workmanship or materials failure".
This is what happened to me after 2 years of use on my UDG surfboard. If it was a defect it would have happened way before.
It is frustrating to end up with a cracked board after spending $1500, but people need to acknowledge that a surfboard is not a twin tip and snapping a nose or ripping a fin box is not uncommon even after just one session.
Select to expand quotepintofpale said...
"Most surf products do not come with any sort of warranty"
Actually consumer law in Australia states that a product sold has to be fit for the purpose it is designed for and to last a reasonable amount of time. That is for new and secondhand goods. I did once have a new board break on the first wave I rode on it in average 3 foot surf, took it back to the shop and they said hard luck.. I made an inquiry to consumer affairs and they told me it is not at the discretion of the shop to modify Australian consumer law just because it is a surfboard. There is no special category for surfboards as much as shapers and surf shops would like you tell you. I rang the shop again and explained this and they replaced the board as they were required to under law. I also realised later after looking at the manufacturers site that the board was glassed with the wrong weight of glass for its size so I had been sold some sort of pro board that I had not asked for. The shop told me the glass weight sticker was wrong and not the glass. Cant imagine how they would know that.
BTW that rail crack looks like one that appeared on my 2012 Wam not long after I bought it. Pretty sure it was a sand through of the glass on the rail which was a manufacturing fault. I had some epoxy and glass in the shed so I just sucked it up and fixed it myself.
What would constitute an appropriate amount of time then? Sounds pretty vague.
Livit, I'm sorry but once again I don't agree. It is not sufficient to say that the wave can generate strong loads to justify a board which breaks. Especially if it breaks without showing evidence of typical failure that can be somehow justified with the mechanic of the board. This is even more suspecious if it happens during the first session. Too easy, mate.
So you're only interested in suggestions that you agree with?
Take it to katana in ossie park. He was fixing what looked like half a dozen north boards a week a couple of years ago for very similar or the same.
Whether it is a sand through and therefore a manufacturing fault as poster above said, work out whether it is worth the time and stress to continually chase it and discuss on seabreeze forums. I'd just get it repaired, take some better photos of before and after, ask north for the costs of that and hope i get lucky, and get on with riding it.
Maybe get a custom katana while there as back up too 
"What would constitute an appropriate amount of time then? Sounds pretty vague."
Yep thats what I thought at the time too - but seeing my board only lasted one wave it was pretty clear cut. I guess thats a question for consumer affairs.
BTW the board I broke was not a North board... another well known brand and was a regular surfboard while paddle surfing....not a kite-board. I ride North Kites and Boards for kitesurfing and the quality is great..No manufacturer can guarantee 100% or their products will be perfect all of the time though. What is important is how the retailer and the manufacturer deal with problems if they arise.
Select to expand quotepintofpale said...
"What would constitute an appropriate amount of time then? Sounds pretty vague."
Yep thats what I thought at the time too - but seeing my board only lasted one wave it was pretty clear cut. I guess thats a question for consumer affairs.
BTW the board I broke was not a North board... another well known brand and was a regular surfboard while paddle surfing....not a kite-board. I ride North Kites and Boards for kitesurfing and the quality is great..No manufacturer can guarantee 100% or their products will be perfect all of the time though. What is important is how the retailer and the manufacturer deal with problems if they arise.
I can only agree with this. No one can produce 100% perfect board. What they don't understand is that if they don't admit the defect is worst for them. The only think I can understand from my experience so far (and from the post of same of the people in this forum) is that if my board is without defect I can't buy a north board anymore, because I kite in perth and this board can't support perth conditions. Who is going to buy a 1000 dollar board knowing that there are high chance that in normal condition will break it? This is the value of writing in this forum. Understand what is the advantage and disadvantage of the equipment. I really like the wam, I tried the board several time before buying it but I can't afford to buy or even repair a board a week.
Select to expand quotemazdon said...
So you're only interested in suggestions that you agree with?
Take it to katana in ossie park. He was fixing what looked like half a dozen north boards a week a couple of years ago for very similar or the same.
Whether it is a sand through and therefore a manufacturing fault as poster above said, work out whether it is worth the time and stress to continually chase it and discuss on seabreeze forums. I'd just get it repaired, take some better photos of before and after, ask north for the costs of that and hope i get lucky, and get on with riding it.
Maybe get a custom katana while there as back up too
Mate, I'm just interested in understanding what is going on and trying not to repeat errors
Select to expand quotealeamodio said..
I can only agree with this. No one can produce 100% perfect board. What they don't understand is that if they don't admit the defect is worst for them. The only think I can understand from my experience so far (and from the post of same of the people in this forum) is that if my board is without defect I can't buy a north board anymore, because I kite in perth and this board can't support perth conditions. Who is going to buy a 1000 dollar board knowing that there are high chance that in normal condition will break it? This is the value of writing in this forum. Understand what is the advantage and disadvantage of the equipment. I really like the wam, I tried the board several time before buying it but I can't afford to buy or even repair a board a week.
North or any other boards will be the same if they get beaten up in the shorebreak. Once again, it is hard luck mate. **** happen.
You said you ride in Perth so I am guessing you do the casual downwinders. You must know that on some patches the shorebreak sucks pretty much all the water so if your board happens to get caught up in one of those wave and shoot nose first into the sand, this is heaps of force exerted to it. Unlike a TT, a surfboard has a foam core so don't expect it to be bullet proof when it weights only 3.5kg. Surely you can find stronger boards but say good bye to the light weight.
The other option is to not spend $1000 and get a superseded or used ones for half that price.
Select to expand quoteLivit said...aleamodio said..
I can only agree with this. No one can produce 100% perfect board. What they don't understand is that if they don't admit the defect is worst for them. The only think I can understand from my experience so far (and from the post of same of the people in this forum) is that if my board is without defect I can't buy a north board anymore, because I kite in perth and this board can't support perth conditions. Who is going to buy a 1000 dollar board knowing that there are high chance that in normal condition will break it? This is the value of writing in this forum. Understand what is the advantage and disadvantage of the equipment. I really like the wam, I tried the board several time before buying it but I can't afford to buy or even repair a board a week.
North or any other boards will be the same if they get beaten up in the shorebreak. Once again, it is hard luck mate. **** happen.
You said you ride in Perth so I am guessing you do the casual downwinders. You must know that on some patches the shorebreak sucks pretty much all the water so if your board happens to get caught up in one of those wave and shoot nose first into the sand, this is heaps of force exerted to it. Unlike a TT, a surfboard has a foam core so don't expect it to be bullet proof when it weights only 3.5kg. Surely you can find stronger boards but say good bye to the light weight.
The other option is to not spend $1000 and get a superseded or used ones for half that price.
Well, this is not the first year I spend kiting here in perth and I have changed different boards. I hit the nose several times, repare small and slightly bigger screeches and cracks... but nothing like that before. This is not what it should be, believe me.
Select to expand quotealeamodio said..
Well, this is not the first year I spend kiting here in perth and I have changed different boards. I hit the nose several times, repare small and slightly bigger screeches and cracks... but nothing like that before. This is not what it should be, believe me.
Since you are a manufacturing expert, it shouldn't be too hard to get it replaced under the warranty then.....
so from your expert opinion smarty pants what would cause a $1200 bomb proof kite board to fall apart like that, other than poor construction.
ARALDITE THE HELL OUT OF IT
i use to send my boards back but after waiting for months with no board for a new one its just easier to araldite them and be useing them again within a few days
Select to expand quotealeamodio said..mazdon said...
So you're only interested in suggestions that you agree with?
Take it to katana in ossie park. He was fixing what looked like half a dozen north boards a week a couple of years ago for very similar or the same.
Whether it is a sand through and therefore a manufacturing fault as poster above said, work out whether it is worth the time and stress to continually chase it and discuss on seabreeze forums. I'd just get it repaired, take some better photos of before and after, ask north for the costs of that and hope i get lucky, and get on with riding it.
Maybe get a custom katana while there as back up too
Mate, I'm just interested in understanding what is going on and trying not to repeat errors
can you post some clearer pictures then?
please show deck around area of "delam", bottom around area of "delam", and clearer photos of the rails in the nose area. i am genuinely interested as well, but can't tell diddly from your photos. also, have you done anything to clear or scrape away material from the rails where it is all white, but other parts are patchy and look flakey with the green tint?
Select to expand quotePRAWNDOG said..
so from your expert opinion smarty pants what would cause a $1200 bomb proof kite board to fall apart like that, other than poor construction.
Just digging the nose in a shorebreak, no rocket science there only basic mechanical principles. Not saying that this is what happened but it is a classic when riding shorebreaks, regardless how much you spend in your brand new flashy toy.
North should just come clean and admit a batch of WAM boards is likely to be faulty around the nose. I had a skillit cabrinha for 2 years riding the same downwinders in Perth. Quite a beginner myself with several 'landings' on the beach. Board nose still amazingly intact with all the paint. So definitely a faulty board is my conclusion and I will stay away from north boards. Enjoying my Neo 2016 6m though!!! Launch into this summer season boys!!!!
If North is the equivalent of Apple in designing and manufacturing quality products then they need to live up to expectations and provide the best costumer care to buyers of their products. Expensive quality = no complaints = win-win situation
Thanks eppo.
All I'll say is, our national base of north dealers are not only great at finding the best suited gear for the customer but working with us to supply after sales service.
Spend the time telling the story to your dealer of purchase and we will help fix the problem.
