Harness lines - how long?

You and I are about the same height, booms about the same, if anything my boom is a little higher, we even use the same lines.... I on the other hand use a seat harness so my hook is lower.

When it's howling I have my lines at shortest - 20 inch , when it's not windy marginal planning I have my lines about 25inches towards longest.

It always looks like the lines are a long way from hook, don't worry to much when you are powered up and heaving back on the boom you will be surprised how close they actually gets, certainly if you are new to harness have those lines as long as possible, maybe even move them closer together , this makes them a little longer. As the wind picks up and you talent improves make them shorter inch or two at a time.

Who's doing it all wrong? DrJ or me? Either way, do have any suggestions for me? Bear in mind that I'm a complete novice - not been planing yet However, I'm getting to the point where I need to relieve the pressure off my hands and arms.

Thanx
Dinsdale

Barn has very strong fixed opinions about harness line length, so interpret what he says in that light. He's also young, so is still seeing the world in black and white. Those of us with more grey hair see everything with more grey.
DrJ clearly does what works for him.

The old way to select your harness line length was simple and effective.
When attached to the boom, you should be just able to tuck you elbow into the loop with your wrist on the boom.
I tried some longer lines on the weekend, 28", and while they worked, and I could use them, I found it a constant uncomfortable stretch to the boom, and I had to put the boom up to an uncomfortable level to make them work. I'm going back to 24" lines. I'm 170cm, so unless you have gorilla arms, you won't need anything much longer.

I'm also a fully qualified windsurf instructor who has spent way to much time helping people get the most out of their sailing.. But whatever.

Let him buy 20 harness lines and he can fight with them until it ruins his stance so much he can't use anything else..


Dinsdale, 26 is considered the shortest you would use (amongst circles in the know). When teaching people to get in the harness we normally go with the longest setting, normally 28.. But it sounds like your either upright and not committing your body weight to your sail (not time to hook in yet, this might because the is no wind).. Or if you can't hook in when you are fully powered you might be hanging your body to low, low is good for control, its stable and fast but you will have to raise your hips to get in the harness, longer lines will keep you further away from the sail and in more control, with freedom to adjust your body weight to keep in control..

History lesson, in the 90's people decided short lines were good, they were wrong..





A practice rig like this is a good way to go thru the motions

I think ken's reaction is typical of many people who dismiss longer lines without ever giving them a proper shot. Going to longer lines in my opinion won't be an instant revelation, it's something that you stick with for a few weeks and then when you somehow end up on short lines again you wonder how on earth you ever sailed in such a cramp position with such short lines.

I was using 22-24" lines for 2 years when I started sailing (i'm 172cm, average build), and when I moved to 26" lines I thought no way these are way too long, but after using them for about a month they just felt natural, plus they have a lot of benefits, biggest one for me was improved early planning, and it really helps get weight in your harness. Now I sail on 30” lines, 28”s are okay but 26” is too short.

I went to WA with a mate over summer, he broke his boom and so I lent him my spare boom with 28” lines, he didn't like it at first but after being forced to use it a few sessions he was sold.

And when you think of it the difference between 26" and 30" lines is not that much. The line hangs in a loop so the apex is not four inches further down, It's only a maximum of two. And the attachment points are some distance apart (just a few inches for some but six - eight for others) this also reduces the drop of the apex point. It's probably only a little over a single inch difference.

Oh and you'd have to measure your lines to find out the actual length. The manufacturers don't really know themselves.

Funny how everything in windsurfing is metric except harness lines.

A heap of good constructive info, and plenty, I'm sure, to get me going. Barn, I've copied and saved your diagrams for future reference. Many thanx one and all.

Dinsdale

Did I say to go ultra-short ?

If I had taken every piece of advice about ski boots given to me by fully-qualified boot fitters, then I would have thrown every pair of boots I've bought in the bin instead of just the first pair. The guy that sold me those now moderates his fitting, I'm told. He cost me 2 good seasons of ski-ing while I persevered with fitting adjustments that cost me twice as much as the boots did.
After that, I took into account my own personal needs, in conjunction with their professional advice. As recently as this year, after ski-ing for over 15 years, my wife had a boot-fitter basically throw her out of the shop because she rejected a boot she could not actually even get her foot into.
So, what you may learn after a few more years of teaching, is to learn to temper your knowledge with individual needs.
Or maybe not..............

Yes they are.

Very good explanation. I agree with Barn.

Dinsdale go with young Barnsy, in my opinion he is 100% right

Me, I'm a worn out old bugger, 6'1", seat haness with 28" lines but going to try 30"s, I have my lines 3 fingers apart. I only sail up wind down wind in the ocean with the occasional half *rse chop hop.

I know people who sail short lines and go alright but I believe they should go longer. As for me I got talked into going from 26 to 22 once, all it did was give me golfers elbow as my elbows were always bent, went straight to 28's and my elbow slowly came good and my sailing improved.

Barnsy I don't think Ken meant to sound dismissive but agree with you, I can't see the relevance your age has to do with it. I have a young mate whose advise I always take, sometimes with a little friendly argument, but since he was 19 he has always been right

You must be as old as me Bob, I can remember those days also. Less than 20 was cool, but I didn't go that far. It can take a while to adjust, after years on 26s I borrowed a boom with 28s - found it almost impossible! (5'10")

When moving up in length go one boom arm at a time. Easier to tolerate and after a while you prefer the longer side. I now have one 30 amongst a bunch of 28s. I've got too many booms.

(same goes for the seat/waist harness issue)

There you go, I'm still learning from the young fellas, I'll go back foot next time, well actually not sure which foot I use

And Barnsy, if not trying to be funny give Ken a break, it's just not worth it for anyone

Now off to work

Don't listen to this tosser, he does not know what he us taking about, for a start he uses 22-28 vario race lines. Maxed to 28 when not much wind, between 22-24 when it's howling.

My attitude, bucko, is one of open-minded inclusiveness and listening to people.
Your opinions are nearly always very polarised, which I kindly attribute to our age.
If I was being unkind, I might attribute it to other causes.
It took me a long time to grow out of the black/white tendency of youth.
I have often voiced my pro-instruction attitude in many posts here. I often pay for instruction when I can get it, and make the most of my money by listening to the instructor, so painting me as a know-it-all ignoramus might be a little off base.
Good instructors listen to their students and modify their approach according to the visual and verbal feedback they get, acceoting that there will always be some individual variation.
Poor ones are like the boot fitter that threw my wife out for not being able to force her foot into the boot he insisted on for her, as he was blinded by his pre-conceptions to the evidence before his eyes.
But whatever, I'm sure you are right. No-one should ever use a harness line shorter than 30". I'm surprised they are even allowed to sell them.