I love everything about my current Carver at 5'10"x20" at 85l. 20 sessions or so into it I have now ruined my ability to ride my other boards. I found it nearly unbearable to ride my "backup" old board on a recent trip. So, I'm looking at picking up another board but am struggling a bit on the decision at the moment.
Current board:
Carver 5'10"x20" at 85l 4.89kg
Aspect Ratio: 3.5
Guild Factor: .971
BAR*GF= 3.42
BAR+GF= 4.48
Contenders are:
Carver 6'2"x20" at 95l (potential weight 5.1kg)
Aspect Ratio: 3.7
Guild Factor: 1.09
BAR*GF= 4.04
BAR+GF= 4.79
Aviator DW 18 6'6" at 90l (potential weight 5.05kg)
Aspect Ratio: 4.33
Guild Factor: 1.037
BAR*GF= 4.49
BAR+GF= 5.37
The board I can't stand to ride any longer:
5'3"x22" at 83l 5.22kg
Aspect Ratio: 2.86
Guild Factor: .954
BAR*GF= 2.73
BAR+GF= 3.814
Weight matters to me but it would be hard to argue that a .05kg difference is the deciding point.
Efficiency matters to me. In this sense the Aviator DW 18 looks to clearly win and should be a large step in the right direction for keeping takeoffs easy. I also wonder if the pintail shape would allow me to stand farther forward on the board, eliminating a bit more of the added length.
Resale. This matters less, but I will say that I would wholeheartedly expect the Carver market to be much larger than the DW 18 market if I got it and didn't like it.
Turning matters to me. This is where I'm stuck. The Carver at 20" turns like a dream. I am nervous about losing this. The Aviator being 18" wide gives me pause. I'm sure I can ride it, no worries there. However, in watching reviews/commentary about the ultra narrow gear coming out I know I've heard a few grumbles about how hard it is to leverage a board in the 16"-17" range and I know James Casey has commented that turning his 20" is more enjoyable than the 18".
So, does anyone have significant experience riding both 20" and 18" wide boards that can comment on how different the turning feels? The span on my foils is 93.34cm or smaller 99% of the time.
My 5'5x19x65l amos sultan turns like a dream. I'm mostly on the sk8 1050 at 92cm span, the sk8 850 at 84cm is lively. Not used my unifoil vyper 130 at 70cm span yet, but I'm sure will be even livelier. I don't think I'd go narrower than 19". I might get a gong diamond 5'10x20x90l for lighter wind.
Mike
Select to expand quoteMikedubs said..
My 5'5x19x65l amos sultan turns like a dream. I'm mostly on the sk8 1050 at 92cm span, the sk8 850 at 84cm is lively. Not used my unifoil vyper 130 at 70cm span yet, but I'm sure will be even livelier. I don't think I'd go narrower than 19". I might get a gong diamond 5'10x20x90l for lighter wind.
Mike
Good feedback. What makes you say you wouldn't go narrower than 19"?
put marks on the deck pad of your 20" wide board, one inch from the edge on both sides. Now ride with feet inside the marks, pretending it's 18 wide.
Select to expand quoteBWalnut said..
However, in watching reviews/commentary about the ultra narrow gear coming out I know I've heard a few grumbles about how hard it is to leverage a board in the 16"-17" range and I know James Casey has commented that turning his 20" is more enjoyable than the 18".
This had me wondering about what the disadvantage of the narrower boards is, if stability is not an issue.Select to expand quoteDWF said..
put marks on the deck pad of your 20" wide board, one inch from the edge on both sides. Now ride with feet inside the marks, pretending it's 18 wide.
That points towards leverage - you can't get the feet / weight far enough to the outside for good turns? Does foil size / width / type come into play here, too?
Select to expand quoteDWF said..
put marks on the deck pad of your 20" wide board, one inch from the edge on both sides. Now ride with feet inside the marks, pretending it's 18 wide.
I move my feet a lot when riding, I wouldn't be able to consistently look down and evaluate that unfortunately. However, I do already hang my rear foot toes over the edge of the board. That's not to say I couldn't ride narrower, but I do naturally fill a 20" board.
I think, unless you're a pro, you run out of foot space. Maybe a longer 18" would aid stability, buying think you need deck space.
I love the 19" as you just have to think about turning and it reacts.
Long and narrow is definitely the way to get on foul quickly and be very responsive.
Mike
Riding the SAB Torpedo 6.1 90L 19,5 wide. Just got of the water, love it for its agility, fast take off and turns great, all my tricks are easier, both with 800 as well as 1095 foil. Today was not that much wind even, 10-16 knot. I weigh 83 kg.
I have the Carver (same size as yours) and Sunova DW 18" (7'2" 103L a size larger than your contender)
I don't think 90L DW board will be a good complement to your existing board. It is too similar. You will be better off with 7'2" or even a size larger if you plan to paddle it.
DW style board need volume to float you to make it a true lightwind board.
Select to expand quoteBWalnut said..DWF said..
put marks on the deck pad of your 20" wide board, one inch from the edge on both sides. Now ride with feet inside the marks, pretending it's 18 wide.
I move my feet a lot when riding, I wouldn't be able to consistently look down and evaluate that unfortunately. However, I do already hang my rear foot toes over the edge of the board. That's not to say I couldn't ride narrower, but I do naturally fill a 20" board.
What about some thin line taped to the deck at 18"? You wouldn't have to look but could feel it.
Select to expand quoteSeastudent said..BWalnut said..DWF said..
put marks on the deck pad of your 20" wide board, one inch from the edge on both sides. Now ride with feet inside the marks, pretending it's 18 wide.
I move my feet a lot when riding, I wouldn't be able to consistently look down and evaluate that unfortunately. However, I do already hang my rear foot toes over the edge of the board. That's not to say I couldn't ride narrower, but I do naturally fill a 20" board.
What about some thin line taped to the deck at 18"? You wouldn't have to look but could feel it.
Water is at 43 degrees right now so booties are mandatory. Summertime I could pull that off tho.
Select to expand quoteTaeyeony said..
I have the Carver (same size as yours) and Sunova DW 18" (7'2" 103L a size larger than your contender)
I don't think 90L DW board will be a good complement to your existing board. It is too similar. You will be better off with 7'2" or even a size larger if you plan to paddle it.
DW style board need volume to float you to make it a true lightwind board.
Good point but I'm not fully looking for a board to cover a larger wind range. My Carver, Cloud IX 1350, and 4.2m SLE get me below 10 knots. I'm thinking more about second board that is maybe slightly better at lightwind but still enjoyable at all winds.
How do you you like the 18" vs 20" width tho? You're the perfect tester since you have both boards!
Between my Carver (5'10" x 20" 85L) and Aviator DW 18 (7'2" x 18" 103L). I weight 74-75kg dry.DW board is much more stable in messy conditions. The Carver is significantly less stable in the fore-aft direction but a bit more stable in the roll axis but the difference in roll stability is negligible IMO.
In the lightest conditions and flat water, DW board is only a bit easier to take off but in the choppy sea but light wind, DW board is much better at taking off due to its stability and ability to keep its speed through the chops.
When they are on foil the carver rides like a traditional shaped 5' board and the DW rides like a long board.
Select to expand quoteTaeyeony said..
Between my Carver (5'10" x 20" 85L) and Aviator DW 18 (7'2" x 18" 103L). I weight 74-75kg dry.DW board is much more stable in messy conditions. The Carver is significantly less stable in the fore-aft direction but a bit more stable in the roll axis but the difference in roll stability is negligible IMO.
In the lightest conditions and flat water, DW board is only a bit easier to take off but in the choppy sea but light wind, DW board is much better at taking off due to its stability and ability to keep its speed through the chops.
When they are on foil the carver rides like a traditional shaped 5' board and the DW rides like a long board.
On foil though, so you feel much difference in 20" vs 18"?
I don't know how to differentiate how it rides due to its width. I feel the board as a whole and these two have completely different feels.
If you mean the foot real estate, I do feel the narrowness. My toe is sometimes on the edge of my DW board but never happens on the Carver.
I don't feel the difference other than the foot placement. Maybe I'm not good enough to bank hard enough for the width to make the difference.
Select to expand quoteTaeyeony said..
I don't know how to differentiate how it rides due to its width. I feel the board as a whole and these two have completely different feels.
If you mean the foot real estate, I do feel the narrowness. My toe is sometimes on the edge of my DW board but never happens on the Carver.
I don't feel the difference other than the foot placement. Maybe I'm not good enough to bank hard enough for the width to make the difference.
Good feedback! My foot is commonly over the edge on the Carver but it doesn't sound like you feel awkward on the Aviator 18. I'm still a bit in the air about it but appreciate the feedback. Very interesting too that you don't see much better takeoff on the Aviator. I would have expected it to be way better.
It is a lot better in general. Only in flat condition that the difference is not significant.
