Hi all,
eeing as i have gone the full upgrade this year, i was thinking about attaching some kind of leash from my foil to the leash plug on my board in case of some sort of failure or rock strike.
Has anyone done this? or do you reckon it is worth doing? Was thinking of using some heavy duty fishing trace wire or similar. Saw a vid online where he used a bike brake cable through a hole he drilled in an alu mast. I have a carbon mast, is drilling a hole in reasonable idea?
Cheers Chris
I do it when traveling in areas where It be hard to get replacement foil parts or board construction boxes might be a bit sketchy.Simply use kite bridal line or equiv with built in/sewed in loop and run one end thru loop and noose it tight around foil mast/baseplate and run other end to leash plug and tie bowline done but more security for you foil in those situations
I do it too and tie it around the mast base and wrap tape around it to hold it in place there have been posts on here about people losing there masts and foil assemblies probably unlikely but very Expensive if it does happen ????
Yeah I was mostly worried about user error, my daughter is just getting going as well so I thought it might be one less thing to worry about.
I'm def the one prone to user error
I lost a foil set due to board failure.
I now use a bit of kite line and snap hook. Prob never happen again but insurance if it did.
If your moving with enough force to remove the foil your probably also moving with enough force to remove whatever the leash is attached to on the board.just saying..
has anyone ever had a foil saved by a leash?!
Select to expand quoteTooMuchEpoxy said..
If your moving with enough force to remove the foil your probably also moving with enough force to remove whatever the leash is attached to on the board.just saying...
Unless the board is of rather poor construction, a huge amount of energy will be absorbed in the removal of the foil, and not much left to rip out the leash anchor point. Spectra /kite bridle lines will also absorb some more of the energy, and a board leash plug or a footstrap screw should easily withstand whatever force remains.
Select to expand quoteSandee said..TooMuchEpoxy said..
If your moving with enough force to remove the foil your probably also moving with enough force to remove whatever the leash is attached to on the board.just saying...
Unless the board is of rather poor construction, a huge amount of energy will be absorbed in the removal of the foil, and not much left to rip out the leash anchor point. Spectra /kite bridle lines will also absorb some more of the energy, and a board leash plug or a footstrap screw should easily withstand whatever force remains.
Spectra absorbs 0 energy! There's 0 stretch in spectra so it all gets transferred to whatever it's attached to. The shorter the leash the greeter the chance it just breaks or rips a plug out(leash plugs are super weak and rely on a LONG stretchy leash to not rip out)
I think if your going to do anything just leash the foil from your ankle to the foil so it functions as a board leash 99% of the time and has the stretch to save the foil on the improbable scenario there's an issue.which has never happened to me in my 10 years of foiling.
honestly leashing the foil is dumb. Any foil worth worrying about floats these days and the type of thing somehow only happens to dweebs who are worried about a "$2500 foil" that they bought 6 years ago and is now realistically worth $20.$15 after whatever foil damage occurs after you just ran it at Mach 3 into a floating tree (legitimately trying to think of a scenario where youd rip the tracks out). I've hit rocks at prone speed(slow) and it OBLITERATED the foil and the board was FINE. Foil ended up in the dumpster!
maybe a bigger issue if your running m6 fasteners (are any good foils m6 attachment? - see above)
I use a leash on my foil. Old habit from the early days of windfoilingwhen most foils had deep Tuttle heads and real foil boards didn't exist.
Made my own deep Tuttle box and since I wasn't sure the loads I designed for were correct I added a leash just in case
Leash is spectra threaded thru extra holes in the foil mast base (slingshot phantasm) and girth hitched to a stopper which is on a short line attached to the boards leash plug. Very quick and easy to attach and remove, but still secure to the limit of the leash plug. I attach my board leash the same way since I share it between boards.
Select to expand quoteTooMuchEpoxy said..Sandee said..TooMuchEpoxy said..
If your moving with enough force to remove the foil your probably also moving with enough force to remove whatever the leash is attached to on the board.just saying...
Unless the board is of rather poor construction, a huge amount of energy will be absorbed in the removal of the foil, and not much left to rip out the leash anchor point. Spectra /kite bridle lines will also absorb some more of the energy, and a board leash plug or a footstrap screw should easily withstand whatever force remains.
maybe a bigger issue if your running m6 fasteners (are any good foils m6 attachment? - see above)
Sure there my be some comfort in using a leash but in my experience its probably not really required on most of the later generation of boards and foils. In answer to TooMuchEpoxy re M6 attachments my Armstrong A+ masts use M6 and I have hit loads of things winging at good speeds without significantly damaging either the foils or the board. The M6 bolts and nuts were fine.
I have hit semi submerged logs, reef rocks, a concrete groyne (oops) and the beach any number of times.
For sure I think that not using footstraps is easier on the kit as it only has its own mass to stop and this limits the loads.
I have lost the foil SUP Surfing going over the falls in fast waist high waves. Fortunately the big foil floats. The A+ kit was fine but the board tracks had ripped out (Gong Zuma with old style plastic tracks, newer Gong long tracks seem fine)
Have moved on to M7 with performance mast but still use the A+ M6 for SUP Foil.
Select to expand quoteTooMuchEpoxy said..
Spectra absorbs 0 energy! There's 0 stretch in spectra so it all gets transferred to whatever it's attached to.
Actually, if you know anything about Spectra, you'd know that it has limited stretch. but it will stretch, until it's pre-tensioned! (Any yachtie using synthetic rigging would vouch for that.)
As it won't be pre-tensioned in this application, it would indeed absorb a significant amount of energy.
Select to expand quoteSandee said..TooMuchEpoxy said..
Spectra absorbs 0 energy! There's 0 stretch in spectra so it all gets transferred to whatever it's attached to.
Actually, if you know anything about Spectra, you'd know that it has limited stretch. but it will stretch, until it's pre-tensioned! (Any yachtie using synthetic rigging would vouch for that.)
As it won't be pre-tensioned in this application, it would indeed absorb a significant amount of energy.
This is idiotic! I am a ducking yachtie(at least I still was 8 years ago when I quit sailing for kiting/foiling)! Spectra does stretch compared to carbon or rod rigging, slightly more than vectran, and is noticeable in some sailing applications where your trying to control something in a centimeter range using 20 meters of line but not significantly compared to materials designed to absorb energy like a climbing rope or a surfboard leash. The length of stretch on a 30 cm piece of spectra used as a board leash would be measured in millimeters! Surf Board leashes are highly elastic (a 5 foot leash will stretch an additional 3-4 feet) for a reason - to save the leash plug. Try some rock climbing using spectra to catch you! I'll come visit you when your paralyzed!
Highvolume as a person who has lost a foil (temporarily), I'd say it is worth it to use a leash.
Mine broke out when the box failed due to poor quality and fatigue. I'd suggest a lot of the more recent boards now have higher quality boxes so it's less likely to happen, but if you stress something enough, it will fail.
My carbon mast weighs a lot and it sank, taking the foil with it and it wasn't leashed. Luckily it washed up on a nearby beach the following day. If I was in the Derwent River, it would have been gone for good (20m+ deep). Best way to check, is assemble your foil, take it into the water and see if it floats. If it does then that's good. If it sinks, well then it's an issue to think about. I would not assume that a foil worth worrying about just floats - many don't. To assume they all float.... well that's dangerous.
As for the 'give' in spectra, yes it won't give significantly. But think about a foil mast ripping out of a box. Upon failure, the foil assembly will rotate around the box and not all of the force of the hit will then go into the spectra cord. That force that does get transferred will be applied over the time of the foil rotating, which is not immediate. It will occur over a period of time meaning that peak load is reduced. Much of the force will have been lost with the energy to break the box as well. I'd say its definitely worth considering a leash if your kit sinks. It doesn't cost much in terms of money or drag if you use thin cord. You can also attach spectra to the mast for minimum drag, and put some sort of bungee cord up on deck with give to decrease load.
I have a board plug with both a loop of bungee cord and a bigger loop of spectra. The bungee takes up most of the shock, and the spectra is there as a fail safe to prevent loss if the bungee breaking strain gets exceeded. Attach my body leash to it and the foil leash. Plenty of give. Plenty of security.
Hi Marty,
i think it will be something that is not going to hurt to put on my foils in case. I will be sailing a bit from sandy bay, so a lost foil there will probs be gone. I have lost a foil in surf before but it was a floater and turned up, still was suprisingly hard to find tho. That was back in the day when i was building my own gear which had a few weak points.
I like the sound of using shock cord to tension the leash i was just going to gaffa tape it down.
Thanks every one for your thoughts on this.
Cheers Chris
Select to expand quoteTooMuchEpoxy said..Sandee said..TooMuchEpoxy said..
Spectra absorbs 0 energy! There's 0 stretch in spectra so it all gets transferred to whatever it's attached to.
Actually, if you know anything about Spectra, you'd know that it has limited stretch. but it will stretch, until it's pre-tensioned! (Any yachtie using synthetic rigging would vouch for that.)
As it won't be pre-tensioned in this application, it would indeed absorb a significant amount of energy.
This is idiotic! I am a ducking yachtie(at least I still was 8 years ago when I quit sailing for kiting/foiling)! Spectra does stretch compared to carbon or rod rigging, slightly more than vectran, and is noticeable in some sailing applications where your trying to control something in a centimeter range using 20 meters of line but not significantly compared to materials designed to absorb energy like a climbing rope or a surfboard leash. The length of stretch on a 30 cm piece of spectra used as a board leash would be measured in millimeters! Surf Board leashes are highly elastic (a 5 foot leash will stretch an additional 3-4 feet) for a reason - to save the leash plug. Try some rock climbing using spectra to catch you! I'll come visit you when your paralyzed!
Geez, how fast do you guys go that you could rip off the foil assembly & still have enough momentum to bust out a board leash plug? 
That's amazing!
Maybe running the leash through the leash plug to keep it in the right place, and securing the end to the rear footstrap might be a better option, if that's a real risk? Plus a bit of shock cord to soften any jerking, and you really can't go wrong.
Select to expand quoteSandee said..TooMuchEpoxy said..Sandee said..TooMuchEpoxy said..
Spectra absorbs 0 energy! There's 0 stretch in spectra so it all gets transferred to whatever it's attached to.
Actually, if you know anything about Spectra, you'd know that it has limited stretch. but it will stretch, until it's pre-tensioned! (Any yachtie using synthetic rigging would vouch for that.)
As it won't be pre-tensioned in this application, it would indeed absorb a significant amount of energy.
This is idiotic! I am a ducking yachtie(at least I still was 8 years ago when I quit sailing for kiting/foiling)! Spectra does stretch compared to carbon or rod rigging, slightly more than vectran, and is noticeable in some sailing applications where your trying to control something in a centimeter range using 20 meters of line but not significantly compared to materials designed to absorb energy like a climbing rope or a surfboard leash. The length of stretch on a 30 cm piece of spectra used as a board leash would be measured in millimeters! Surf Board leashes are highly elastic (a 5 foot leash will stretch an additional 3-4 feet) for a reason - to save the leash plug. Try some rock climbing using spectra to catch you! I'll come visit you when your paralyzed!
Geez, how fast do you guys go that you could rip off the foil assembly & still have enough momentum to bust out a board leash plug? That's amazing!
Maybe running the leash through the leash plug to keep it in the right place, and securing the end to the rear footstrap might be a better option, if that's a real risk? Plus a bit of shock cord to soften any jerking, and you really can't go wrong.
I think TooMuchEpoxy has had too much epoxy. Stay away from it mate. Aside from making you think weird things, it stuffs yer lungs up.
