hummingbird kit ideas?

you are a man after my own heart Chook. Have fun experimenting and a little bit of risk makes life worthwhile.

I was involved in a crash when I was racing in speedway, The other guy involved in the crash went away and raced model cars as it was safer. I ran into him at Claremont Speedway a couple of years later and he was on the track next to me. After the race I asked him why he came back. He said he missed the risk.

Cheers
Vic

sn,
If you are going to prefab steering head and mast step then why would you want to Bolt the Axle to the Chassis. I Would be setting the thing up as a "T" frame consisting of the Rear section of the chassis being "T" and Mast Step the Front section would slip into the rear and Bolt into place Chassis complete. The Axles are individual parts that are interchangeable and slip into the "T" (Chassis axle stubs). Barrow Wheels to run on A seat could be simply mounted with a seat belt mounted to the Chassis Axle Stubs. I had to do that with Schrodinger's Cat after the Carbon idea failed. Works fine and is dead simple.
A Kit should be free of any machine work and as few tools as possible,a shifter is about all. Do not give the majority credit skill. You must start thinking for your client base as in general they don't have a great deal at hand to work with. Why do you think IKEA make Flat Packs with Allen Key/s supplied.
Ron

I sometimes wonder how many Ikea bits might be pressed into service. If you choose carefully you can find some quality materials/assemblies. For example, the two 'Poang' armchair frames lying in my shed at home have some seriously strong laminated wood components that might serve as axle planks........

if your shying from a welderand want to bolt/screw, you might as well look at designing something in ply and wood with some simple bolt on wheel fittings.
not as simple or longlived , but easier for simpleton dads

Stephen I have been recently liasing with some chinese suppliers regarding masts specifically. I have a few contacts. A couple of them will supply small quantities, (20-50, some as low as 4 and 10). Generally about 140-200 USD. Then add freight and probably duty, (if over $1000)

I have also another supplier who want's to know exactly what dimensions the mast is to be. This might be an opportunty to design something specific to a landyacht needs, (heavier wall base and alike). Don't have pricing yet but it might be possible to organise a buying group to get a big enough volume to get their attantion!

You are right stephen, it can be a trap. But some of the pricing i am getting makes it worth crunching the numbers. I'm not sure how DHL, or FedEX, or the others will go with a long narrow package, might be worth the question.

After a fair bit of scribbling, measuring, number crunching, head scratching, talking to Design and Tech at mercy college and a mate who is pretty high in the Scout Association -shortly followed by a visit from Hizzonor Mr Landyacht, I have changed plans!

Roughly, a bolt together landyacht with pre welded steering was going to be just as labour intensive as a regular lefroy mini- and cost even more.

But- as a regular lefroy mini is just a bit too big for smaller kids, I have started putting together a scaled down lefroy min- that will fit inside a 6' x 4' trailer without dissassembly.
The "Sawn-off" will be using a plastic seat with simple bodywork to prevent kids putting thier feet on the ground.

Still trying to work out an alternative for the mast instead of using scarce windsurfer masts.
The mast step will be more upright- and might be taller so possibly hi tensile ally tube can be used.(2 masts from a length of ally?- no wastage)
Sail similar to blokarts with captive boom so sail can go lower.
If anyone can think of alternative masts- sing out!

I had planned on using Richcastings wheels- but as I have a spare set of Fallshaws I will be using them (saving myself a bit of cash instead of buying more wheels)

Once "Sawn- Off" is up and running- I will probably have a go at a stitch and glue plywood body with axles and steering that bolt on, to to see what happens.

stephen.

Forgot to mention they are telescopic, so a bit of chopping and resin would probably be needed as well.




Heres one slightly struggling with 9m of sail.

Cheers Col

Why not use 4 or 5 different diameter of aluminium tube slotting into each other . Same as all the European yachts ?

Big advantage is that the sectional mast and also the rolled sail fits into a car boot along with the miniyacht !

Boom in two sections from similar material.

I am curious as to why you would spend any time calculating the cost of a mast which would not be legal in the class.[}:)]
For the small yacht (Hummingbird) why not just use a single length of tube? You are going to carry it assembled on a trailer so ???
FWIW before Landyacht got involved with the class 5 we used 50 by 3mm wall tube with a dowel (wood) in the bottom 2 metres and they worked just fine, temper was T6

And the other problem being, a decent supply of second hand windsurfing masts isnt there.
I am keeping a close eye on several different salvage depots in Perth- and cannot keep up with finding enough masts for the Kalgoorlie and Esperance crews, let alone enough to get a couple of scout troops rolling.

Capral do not stock T6, only T5, 50mm x 3mm comes in 6.5m lengths, cut in half, that is 2 masts of 3.25m, (not even sure if T5 is ok for masts)
With a longer mast step and an extension this could be stretched to 4m. not sure if its do-able, or practical. With a Blokart type sail you gain extra sail area below the boom- making up for the shorter mast (hopefully)

Ally is roughly $10 per metre, then the base reinforcement and extensions that need to be turned up on a lathe, costing a lot more than a $15 secondhand windsurfer mast- but if there are no windsurfer masts around you dont have much choice!

Idont know how I got the blame for introducing thinner walledhigh tensile sections to landyachting!
transporting long masts has been a problem as long as class 5 yachts have been around. in about 1987 we became aware of lighter section s in a telescoping range that could be used for class5 masts.
previously we were using48.7x4.7wall T6 scaff with a wooden plug. if you wanted a 2 piece mast there was a section around 40mm that would fit, but it would inevitably bend and was incredibly heavy, especially up high.
then came the lovely 2 piece T8 masts on the winger and faze 5 Given yachts courtesy of Ron Given , a new zealand catamaran designer.

back then i could walk into a warehouse on scarborough beach road and buy it by the truckload.
we bought 3 batches over the next 25 years ,in 87,91,2007.
when we bought a batch in 2007 they delivered about 2/3 of what we ordered , and explained that this stuff was the last of the mountain of stock we had been buying from, then told us that when a big enough order for the rest of the sections came in we would get the rest( it was all coming from sydney). when we explained that the missing sections were for the middle of the job and we needed it all not some of it , they milled the rest of the order.
since then none of the sections have been available, and I believe the mill has now closed.
weve run out of suitable ally.
That why Ive been investigating carbon. I believe it is possible to buy off the shelf,windsurfer mast that would suit a class 5.
ok its against the rules, but if you cant make a mast, you need to look into the future and find an alternative.
the mast Ive just finished has to break down to 2m sections to fit in a crate,and Ive had to use a cold drawn steel section to replace one of the now unavailable ally sections. of the 4 sections used in a mast,all 4 are unavailable and Ive used all but 1 length of my personal stock.
sandgropers club had to "import" their replacements from the east. and that supplier has only a few masts left
Alan , in Europe you have the advantage of numbers. It was explained to me by seabreeze member Frogy that all the french manufacturers combined were able to make up a big enough order each year to warrant the mill to make the required material. It would seem like a good idea to all have ally masts rather than going to composite masts, if you consider that if 1 of the group changes the others would have to carry the burden of a bigger order.
i would suggest that the kinds of lengths and strengths needed for a hummingbird kit could be achieved with a section from an antenna manufacturer or mast manufacturer. it would be worth trying to track down those who made the early "wally masts" as the original Blue windsurfer brand masts are exactly the diameter,length and flex needed for this project..
I would suggest taking one of those masts to someone like Windrush in east fremantle and finding out what it would take to "re-invent" them

stays would certainly make wood an option for your rig, but keep in mind that that ally rig of gizmos is the stuff thats run out

i recon it would do the job , aven a lug sail up a short mast as weve seen on some yachts.
what about the old waldecks nursery?
maybe in an old market garden somewhere. and of course perth zoo

Paul. Apparently the way it's done in the UK is mixing Imperial with Metric stock. One fits into the other fine. I couldn't get the metric stuff so ended up hand fitting the lot together which was a week or two of hard work. I think this summer (for us) you might be fairly near to a source of imperial stock

Cheers Col