Select to expand quoteRex said..Cobra said...Rex said..
Cobra said..
Rex said..
Cobra said..
Rex said..
Cobra said..
i see & hear of more poor treatment to humans per day than animals.
Which is a drop in the sea compared to the animals being mistreated daily.
have you been to Africa 
No and I don't need to, the ratio is so low compared to animals. What's your point anyway? because people treat other people poorly its somehow ok to mistreat animals? Why try and minimise the poor treatment of animals by bringing humans into it?
didn't ask if you needed to. And I don't care what you need to do 
NO it's not ok to treat animals poorly and I never said It was.
because someone doesn't agree with the view that animal cruelty is out of control, don't mean they except it.
its like Meg's comment about pets or unwanted pets, for every bad case of pet abuse there's thousands of good And loving owners
... You see my glass is half full.
i minimise it because that's what it is. compaired to humans.
Because one story gets posted on sea breeze lets start beating the out of control drum.
BTW what's your point making statements then adding a ? BTW that's not a question.
These discussions usually bring out the mean spirited callous type bent on trivialising the issue rather than acknowledging that there is plenty of unnecessary animal cruelty 
i laugh that hard water come out.
Hey Rex start naming and shaming mate. You make it sound like it's common knowledge
start naming ALL these places in Australia ,,,your words,, 'there's plenty of unnessasay animal cruelty.
dont keep it a secret form us trivialising callous mean spirited types,share your wealth of knowledge .
theres a place in Australia called RSPCA tell them ,if you won't tell us.
Sorry bud, I didn't mention Australia so your huge laugh was in vain, however the grey hound racing industry is getting a little air time, could be worth having a read up on it.
are they ALL doing that Rex. Of course they are hey. Horse racing must be as well , and all slaughter houses are flogging cows to death I guess.
like I said for every bad case theres thousands of good.
Sadly some have a glass half empty.
Select to expand quoteCobra said...Rex said..Cobra said...Rex said..
Cobra said..
Rex said..
Cobra said..
Rex said..
Cobra said..
i see & hear of more poor treatment to humans per day than animals.
Which is a drop in the sea compared to the animals being mistreated daily.
have you been to Africa
No and I don't need to, the ratio is so low compared to animals. What's your point anyway? because people treat other people poorly its somehow ok to mistreat animals? Why try and minimise the poor treatment of animals by bringing humans into it?
didn't ask if you needed to. And I don't care what you need to do
NO it's not ok to treat animals poorly and I never said It was.
because someone doesn't agree with the view that animal cruelty is out of control, don't mean they except it.
its like Meg's comment about pets or unwanted pets, for every bad case of pet abuse there's thousands of good And loving owners
... You see my glass is half full.
i minimise it because that's what it is. compaired to humans.
Because one story gets posted on sea breeze lets start beating the out of control drum.
BTW what's your point making statements then adding a ? BTW that's not a question.
These discussions usually bring out the mean spirited callous type bent on trivialising the issue rather than acknowledging that there is plenty of unnecessary animal cruelty
i laugh that hard water come out.
Hey Rex start naming and shaming mate. You make it sound like it's common knowledge
start naming ALL these places in Australia ,,,your words,, 'there's plenty of unnessasay animal cruelty.
dont keep it a secret form us trivialising callous mean spirited types,share your wealth of knowledge .
theres a place in Australia called RSPCA tell them ,if you won't tell us.
Sorry bud, I didn't mention Australia so your huge laugh was in vain, however the grey hound racing industry is getting a little air time, could be worth having a read up on it.
are they ALL doing that Rex. Of course they are hey. Horse racing must be as well , and all slaughter houses are flogging cows to death I guess.
I'm not sure what has given you the impression that I think all animals are being mistreated, I can't see anywhere that I have conveyed that.
I said all referring to the grey hounds Rex, you can see that Mate.
as for the dogs well that's sad and those people have been stopped thanks to the authority's . so all is good.
Amateurs, in Las Vegas and a few other places here in the USA, we know how to serve and eat beef, at a certain joint.
There is a chain of restaurants called "The Heart Attack Grill", the only veggies they serve are lettuce, tomatoes, onions, pickles, and potatoes, and those are mainly for burger toppings, with some fries (or chips) served on the side.
As for vegetarians, that's all fine, just so long as they don't become all evangelical about it. I've run into too many of them that treat their new discovery the same way as reborn Christians do, just let me eat my burger thank you.
They shoot cattle for meat the some way they shoot old and/or sick cattle so they don't die a slow miserable death, out in the pasture, with buzzards starting to eat them before they are even dead yet.
I've been a vegetarian for 15 years and agree with Cobra's sentiment.
Animal rights people have gone too far.
Let us start treating people right, then worry about the animals.
During the Four Corners doco about live cattle export, no one seemed that concerned about the poor buggers working in the slaugtherhouses in thongs or bare feet, with no protective equipment in place. If that was Australia the place would be closed down for OHS reasons, yet it didn't rate a mention because Animals Australia are too worried about the cows.
This is where the myopic vision of too many do-gooders is misguided.
If anyone is that worried about it, become a vegetarian- problem solved.
If you can't stomach being a vego, read some of animal ethicist Peter Singer's work and you can put in perspective pretty quickly. Nothing wrong with the humane and painless death of an animal.
This shows how most people's logic is so completely flawed on these matters.
Clarence
Why can't animal rights and human rights run parallel, why does it have to be one or the other?
I don't agree that its all or nothing, the status quo or veganism, I feel it's an angle designed to be divisive.
Edit: To be fair, Animals rights groups and human rights groups have different charters, its natural that they would be focusing on their particular field.
i just read some of the greyhound racing industry facts,its a very sad story.
i tell you something sad,,,,Google wiki ,how many people get raped every year.
from wiki
The attitude of the police in many countries often discourages victims from reporting rape: one study inTurkey (1999) found that 33% of police officers agreed with the assertion that "some women deserve rape" and 66% agreed that "the physical appearance and behaviors of women tempt men to rape.
Ummm and this is only reported cases.
this is what one writer has to say about pets in turkey
www.haaretz.com/turkey-regulating-pet-ownership-1.5246729
so it seams pets are getting a better life in turkey,good.
pity their women don't.
but what baffles me, is when i stated" i see & hear of more poor treatment to humans per day than animals.
i was told " Which is a drop in the sea compared to the animals being mistreated daily.
i put human rights very high on my priorities in life.
apparently mistreated humans in the world, rape, violence,forced prostertution,killings,just to name a few
is just a drop in the ocean compared to the animals being mistreated daily.
^^^just a drop in the ocean - yep I'd agree with that!
How many BILLION people eating meat everyday - how many BILLIONS of animals suffering in factory farming their entire lives.....
Australia exporting live animals to be butchered overseas in cruel and barbaric ways - should be outlawed.
If the barbarians that eat this meat - were to eat grains and legumes instead, they would perhaps be less aggressive and there would possibly be less conflict in these regions.
Its far from a perfect world, lots of very bad people out there, even the good people have bad traits, people are consumed with greed and vanity, dont give a toss about other people, changes take along time to come into effect.
Not to mention some religions believe if you've been a bad person you will get reincarnated as a lowly animal, how do you change these mindsets.
Upto 120 yrs ago (not long) people kept other people as slaves.
People are the problem ^^^ agreed!
Population growth of people in developing countries is huge and completely unsustainable. To lift these billions of people out of poverty and to provide them with the quality of life as we know in the west, is probably going to destroy the environment way beyond the tipping point of runaway climate change.
The way we are heading - suffering is going to increase rapidly, for all animals including ourselves.
Mass extinctions of many, many species - followed by our own demise - unless we can change our ways and learn how to reduce our impact (including what we consume).
Have any of you been to a slaughter house in aus?
Ive witnessed it first hand. Theres rules and regulations that say animals are to be killed this certain way which is humane but when you phyiscally see it. Its no humane well not to me.
cattle will be walked along a raceway, and then into a walled box area. A head neck restraint is applied and the animals will be stunned, usually with a captive bolt or percussion gun. The unconscious animal is then released onto a platform where slaughter begins.
Though i saw that the captive bolt did not always knock the cow out unconcious before the throat was cut so the animal was concous and kicking and screaming as its throat is cut taking considerable time for the animal to bleed out and die.
If we killed hunans that way on death row there would be outrage.
In my role with my company ive also witnesses cattle trains being unloaded at meat works. After a 40 hour train trip from North west Qld to brisbane often cattle on unloading would be found dead. Or legs broken or purely exhausted and cannot get up. They are meant to go into the wagon shoot them with a bullet dead and then drag them out. When this happens the vet comes out checks its internal temprature and decides if the cow is still able to be slaughtered for human comsuption. Ive witnessed many times they stockman saving his bullets just going in there with a rope tie its legs and drag it out with a tractor which is one of the most horrifc acts ive seen to an animal being dragged alive out of a wagon then dragged down an bank and into a paddock 100's of metres. And the stockman just write it down as been found dead on arrival.
Not to mention the baby calves born on the train trip the stockman would find them and simply cut there throats there and then as they are rended usless for any human consumption under law.
There isnt a humane way to kill a cow at an australian meat works. If there is i didnt and havent seen it.
Anyways we could all rant for ever about all this good or bad. We all have a choice. I made my choice to stop eating animals im happy with that choice.
Select to expand quoteHausey said...
If the barbarians that eat this meat - were to eat grains and legumes instead, they would perhaps be less aggressive and there would possibly be less conflict in these regions.
So all we have to do is give Kim Jong un lentils
I find it hard to be vego 100% of the time so I'm 100% vego on 2 seperate days of the week. It breaks it up and as little as it is it's still better than doing nothing.
How can you humanely kill an animal?...
Using that same theory it would be alright to humanely kill a human being? Or is that different?
Select to expand quoteAndyR said..
Have any of you been to a slaughter house in aus?
Ive witnessed it first hand. Theres rules and regulations that say animals are to be killed this certain way which is humane but when you phyiscally see it. Its no humane well not to me.
cattle will be walked along a raceway, and then into a walled box area. A head neck restraint is applied and the animals will be stunned, usually with a captive bolt or percussion gun. The unconscious animal is then released onto a platform where slaughter begins.
Though i saw that the captive bolt did not always knock the cow out unconcious before the throat was cut so the animal was concous and kicking and screaming as its throat is cut taking considerable time for the animal to bleed out and die.
If we killed hunans that way on death row there would be outrage.
In my role with my company ive also witnesses cattle trains being unloaded at meat works. After a 40 hour train trip from North west Qld to brisbane often cattle on unloading would be found dead. Or legs broken or purely exhausted and cannot get up. They are meant to go into the wagon shoot them with a bullet dead and then drag them out. When this happens the vet comes out checks its internal temprature and decides if the cow is still able to be slaughtered for human comsuption. Ive witnessed many times they stockman saving his bullets just going in there with a rope tie its legs and drag it out with a tractor which is one of the most horrifc acts ive seen to an animal being dragged alive out of a wagon then dragged down an bank and into a paddock 100's of metres. And the stockman just write it down as been found dead on arrival.
Not to mention the baby calves born on the train trip the stockman would find them and simply cut there throats there and then as they are rended usless for any human consumption under law.
There isnt a humane way to kill a cow at an australian meat works. If there is i didnt and havent seen it.
Anyways we could all rant for ever about all this good or bad. We all have a choice. I made my choice to stop eating animals im happy with that choice.
By doing so you've made a small difference.
Capturing those barbaric 
images you've described - in a video and giving them to a TV station like the ABC would make a bigger difference....
You'd probably lose that job though?
Select to expand quoteCobra said..
Hausey said...
If the barbarians that eat this meat - were to eat grains and legumes instead, they would perhaps be less aggressive and there would possibly be less conflict in these regions.
So all we have to do is give Kim Jong un lentils
That'd fix Nth Korea - genius! The dictatorship would mellow and he'd become like Gandhi.
They go hungry over there in Nth Korea apparently? Lentils / dahl go a long way.
I'll send you a recipe - might mellow the Indo's too - though I was referring to the barbaric ways in the Middle East.
Watched a doco on Australian sheep that suffered a trip across the equator, squashed like sardines on a ship - some with legs trapped over the side..... to get unloaded in the Middle East, sold and thrown into a car boot - some died of heat exhaustion in the car boot - others throats slashed in some 'traditional' ceremony!
Select to expand quoteAndyR said..
Have any of you been to a slaughter house in aus?
The unconscious animal is then released onto a platform where slaughter begins.
Though i saw that the captive bolt did not always knock the cow out unconcious before the throat was cut so the animal was concous and kicking and screaming as its throat is cut taking considerable time for the animal to bleed out and die.
If we killed hunans that way on death row there would be outrage.
Which is why I don't buy or ear halal meat.
Select to expand quoteHausey said.. Cobra said.. Hausey said...
If the barbarians that eat this meat - were to eat grains and legumes instead, they would perhaps be less aggressive and there would possibly be less conflict in these regions.
So all we have to do is give Kim Jong un lentils
That'd fix Nth Korea - genius! The dictatorship would mellow and he'd become like Gandhi.
Yeah - I suppose that with a vegie diet, we can hope that Kimmy would become nice and placid like a few other notable vegetarians!
Pol Pot,
Charles Manson,
Genghis Khan,
Adolf Hitler [although he wasn't a real die hard vego - that was a mix of Goebbels's propaganda and Adolf being a pretty fussy eater]
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Your diet doesn't dictate if you are going to be a nice bloke / bloke-ess.
It just means your farts might smell a bit different 
stephen.
No way Genghis was a vegetarian, the silver people of the stepe didn't become the worlds most competent/ accurate with a bow and arrow by shooting prickly pears.
When times were real tough they would bleed their horse for sustenance. They knew exactly how much of their horses blood they could drink - clot the wound and both parties would live to fight another day.
Their lands and rivers froze over in winter. Way off topic but the Mongols while Genghis lived were brutal and carnivores.
Select to expand quotedjt91184 said..
No way Genghis was a vegetarian,
Well, who'd a thunk it! - my state appointed teachers at high school got something else wrong...
mind you - this was the same teacher that was quoting to us from Chairman Mao's book - so I should have been suspicious.
seriously though - I just did a google and there are lots of mobs saying Genghis was vego! [and just as many saying he wasn't]
stephen
Hey yeah I guess he did live 900 yrs ago people will believe what they want. I made quite a study of him, my favourite reading would be Con igguldens 5 book series on the matter, Con spent some time in Mongolia.
Genghis killed his older brother at age 12 for not sharing his food with their family which had been discarded by the wolf tribe.
He's said to have eaten another mans heart from another tribe after his wife was abducted in a raid and raped.
But whos to know it was along time ago!
Sorry for stealing the thread ill get back in my box now.
Have a good Christmas day everybody.
Select to expand quoteCobra said..
i see & hear of more poor treatment to humans per day than animals.
Thats because know one ( press media ) give a F888 about the animals.
The frozen meat trade is worth at least 4 billion a year the live trade is worth about 500 million so really no need to transport animals alive when they can be slaughtered here creating local jobs and freezing the meat for transport.
Select to expand quoteMrknownothing said...
How can you humanely kill an animal?...
Using that same theory it would be alright to humanely kill a human being? Or is that different?
This is the way i feel about it these days. No animal or human is ever killed with intention to kill by someone else humanely.
If you have time watch the cowspiracy sustainability secret. We have the ability to feed the world but ignorance and greed are to strong a human trait to really care on mass.
We are in the next phase of mass extinction to supply the greed of most nations & no one really cares.
F78697g kids screaming next door/restaurant etc are only a pain when there not your kids.
The slave trade also continues just not on the cotton fields in america.
The truth is out there if you can be bothered to look.
Unti then it's blowing 20 +
Select to expand quotedjt91184 said..
Hey yeah I guess he did live 900 yrs ago people will believe what they want. I made quite a study of him, my favourite reading would be Con igguldens 5 book series on the matter, Con spent some time in Mongolia.
Genghis killed his older brother at age 12 for not sharing his food with their family which had been discarded by the wolf tribe.
He's said to have eaten another mans heart from another tribe after his wife was abducted in a raid and raped.
But whos to know it was along time ago!
Sorry for stealing the thread ill get back in my box now.
Have a good Christmas day everybody.
Brilliant series of books. I recommend them to anyone wanting to get totally lost in another time and place. As for Genghis being a vego, what the...? Whoever started that one must be laughing their asses off by now. Did you hear the one about the vegetarian Eskimos?
