Do any of you blokes also Paraglide? If so what's the go with the sport from your own experience with it?
I heard of a bloke that unfortunately lost his life doing it when a wind going straight down out of nowhere pushed him down to the ground in what was considered by those that told me the story fourth hand, something that can happen to anyone at any time when paragliding. Can a super rare wind just push you out of the sky unexpectedly? Even if you are very very experienced? Like not a collapse but just pushing you down? Is this incident possibly being inaccurately told due to some details perhaps being missed through the retelling so many times?
I have heard that kiteboarders dabble and get seriously into paragliding it and would love your thoughts on the sport from a kiteborders perspective. Any thoughts on it from your own experience. Not limited to safety. Enjoyment. How it compares to keyboarding. Etc. Thanks in advance.
www.xcontest.org/world/en/pilots/detail:noefont#pilot_flights[sort]=points@tab=stats
This dudes just thrown a hell of a flight www.xcontest.org/world/en/flights/detail:noefont/15.02.2024/13:56
Everyone in the comp scene will have flown with and usually been friends with about 2 people a year thatll die... bit of a word salad but yeah... probably triple that if you on the world circuit
Its grim... because the bedt in the world can die thru no fault of his own...
The wings fold in half then turn to face a whole.new direction then they reopen and the ensueing energy can make you look like a yoyo
Falling into your wing even for a split second is just so terrifying because everyones watched so many of those videos and yeah...
Most pilots have a close call and quit or fly only coastal (can see the air easier) etc etc
I wouldnt let anyone i care about do it and i highly advise against it if you have kids and family and work commitments and wealth or just anything.
We are not europe. So we have coastal and essentially flatlands where it can really boom. 8meter a second climbs are casual and we go toe to toe with brazil for world record sending flights of over 400 even 500kms
But seriously dont do it unless your unemployed and homeless / retired and no one loves you anymore
No expert here, having only been flown as a passenger on a tandem & did a one-day intro course (due to no school available in our area). But hoping to organise to do at least PG1 course someday soon as it is such an amazing feeling, and not scary at all with a good pilot or instructor.
I believe that paragliding is much like kiteboarding. just as safe as you want to make it!
There's a vast difference between coastal flying in predictable onshore winds riding ridge lift, and thermalling or other flying inland among hills in less predictable winds. I don't think the sort of extreme down draft that could push a glider out of the sky can actually happen aside from around thermals or downwind of obstructions.
And anyone who falls into his own canopy must've been attempting an advanced stunt or trying to fly beyond his capabilities.
Try doing a tandem flight first and see if you like it, then just find a good trainer and fly safely.
Hahahahah you have no idea sandee ive competed in 5 countrys worked for 3 paragliding companys and i was intentionally being vague and suger coating paragliding if you want to talk stats for anyone who cares the brits crunched the numbers and being the only country in the world to do so came back with paragliding being 8 times more dangerous and likely to die then rideing motorbikes.... what makes this statistic really fun is they have a tiny flying window and barely fly at all and they ride motorbikes in some of the most dangerous conditions available.
No other sport apart from freediving will a world champion regularly die during a heat thru no fault of theyre own.
To give you some perspective on how we train i have to practice blacking out from gforces over the water while im blacking out i need to be aware of who or what is around me as im spiralling towards the ground i need to calculate how long i have before i loose peripheral vision and colour. While im trying to pump blood back into my head i need to still be reading my instruments.
This is considered basic training for anyone doing crosscountry. If your pushing the kms (check the recent french title where 5 guys did over 400kms will be up on every ozone newsfeed) you must be able to handle your g forces otherwise you will be in a situation where you are unable to go DOWN.
THINK ABOUT THAT
Cant get down. Sounds like time to drop the eva link
Yeah, gotta agree with Froth Goth. I'm no pilot but I think the phenomenon where pressure systems meet is called a downspurt, a sudden down draft then wind in all directions, then lift further out. I think it's the cause of some runway windshear warnings. I saw a photo with about six simultaneous, looked Photoshopped, just surreal.
I really wouldnt worry about "down spurts" or whatever you guys are talking about hahahaha thats like being worried about lightning.
You need to be worried about the absolute basics.
You can have absolute perfect conditions and be nice and gently landing into wind then cop a tiny little bullet gust from the side everything flys because airflow passing over an object creates lift you no longer have as much or any lift on part of your wing that makes it fold you turn a touch and reopen at a slightly different angle and that will induce the most VIOLENT of rugby jersey slings you have ever experienced and even tho your feet were 1 meter off the ground as this happend your now FLUNG into the ground impacting your side so shoulder ribs hip etc and you wont be the same ever again.
So dont stress about cloud suck and all that other amazing **** just worry about the basics. And when you dont even have control of the basics theyll eat you alive.
Hot little tip for anyone i have scared off thats actually a pilot!!
When you start feeling out of control a bit like a cork in the ocean during a storm just remember its all about wingloading so dive that bitch agressively keep that wing loading up as much as possible and it took me nearly a decade before i had to REALLY throw my reserve in the wild (ignoreing sivs) and i realised theyre was half a dozen other times where "i got lucky" and sorted it all out without a reserve when i wish i had of just thrown it anyways. So many stupid low saves for fight and ego i coulda just copped some very tender/broken legs instead of drinking myself into a bit of an oblivion over them.
The one good thing about paragliding is itll make all your other activitys safer. I solo dive etc alot but i have all the wise words i used in flying to help me little mantras like "this is the most important flight of your life!" Just before takeoff so you double check the conditions and equipment and most importantly your own mental state.
Walking down from the hill during a competition while 300 others take off is much harder then any Kilometer milestone or triangle task. And those who have been theyre ackbowledge and applaud it. No one wnats to be in the sky with some froth goth who only the nught before had a head full of acid and a belly full of goon 
I know what this post needs! Some incident reports!
Hahaha nahhhh thats enough ground sucking for a little while
www.safa.asn.au/news/skysailor-issues/current-issues
Can check the magazines yaself from that link
And a snippet for the lazy of the latest magazine
(complete bullocks only 2 deaths since 2021 hahaha i know of way more then that!!)
Omg... i promise im trying to stop ranting but just reading that kinda just makes me wonder what the ****. So first of all leaveing the body and equipment! If your first on the scene as i have been in my earlier years a fair few times. I know stuff all about saveing someones life but i sure know about wind and canopys so you would ALWAYS disconnect if possible but at least disable the wing from dragging the bloody body around the paddock. And if its not a body its going to need a helicopter so its a danger to the rescue team if the gear is left as is. Anyways Blerghhh anyways ill shut up starting to remember too much
I dont really want to dox myself theres already way too many photos of me all over the safa insta and websites and magazines but if you want to private message me any non doxing questions by all means flick em thru i can yell at you from there how theyres spiders in the clouds and how you dont need a fridge when camping at a paragliding competition cause you can just throw a couple hot cans of TUN in ya flight deck and theyll be frosty cold after a few hours of flying round at 11k feet 
I recently retired from paragliding after 30 years of pretty full-on involvement. The reason wasn't safety, although there were some recent events that were cause for concern. And it wasn't cost, even though it costs at least $100 an hour to go flying.
The real reason was logisitics. The nearest decent thermalling site is two hours away. 4 hours round trip. A couple of hours dicking around. An hour of flying. Fuel cost. General wear and tear. A whole day gone. Maybe a notable flight. Maybe not.
The best site near Melbourne is Bright, so 4-5 hours each way. A couple of nights accommodation. I used to get OG pilot rates on accommodation ($27 a night, come and go as you please, always a spare room available) but new management put that up to $85 a night off peak, non-refundable, strict checkout rules.
Cross country flying is a hoot, and I have had some memorable retrieves, but landing 100km from home with no mobile coverage, and hitching in the boonies. 
Then there's trips to France and India to fly proper mountains at $8,000-10,000. $10,000 of flying gear. Lightweight camping gear and boots and down jackets and radios and ...
Add in $360 annual licence fees, and $100 site membership.
Compare that with foiling in all it's forms. Sessions 5 days a week all year round. Wind usually pushes in late afternoon so plenty of time to do other stuff in the day. Excellent conditions literally 5 minutes up the road. Virtually every session is huge fun in one way or another. Finish a nice session and home for dinner. Gear lasts pretty much forever. Virtually zero chance of dying or being seriously injured, except for the chunts on the bike track though the beach access.
You can hang around in the sky at the coast. It can be fun. There is a coastal site a couple of minutes from my house. But the narrow weather window still applies. The potential for danger is still there, but different. The chance of something fun and exciting happening can be low.
Here's a couple of photos of me. One is a long way from home. One is just up the road on a fun afternoon.
Okay look last post i promise but lets look at the top right instance for those that believe coastals safe as houses (which i ironically do but only in comparison to REAL flying)
But this is a great example and ill explain why
#1760 safe* coastal flying with friends!
Wind changed all 3 could have (in my eyes would have but got bloody lucky!) Died
Why is this a good example???
Ever been kiteboarding and the wind seems a little squirelly and lulls and gusts and changes direction and all of a sudden your looking out over the water and half a dozen kites are sitting on the water and everyones scratching theyre heads?
All that has to happen for this is have a little cell block some prevailing wind out of site.
How OFTEN have you seen that happen?!? 10s of times? Hundreds of times?
Now imagine 3 of those people died because of it!?! It didnt happen but it bloody well could have.
Landing into trees isnt too bad if you know what your doing but if you dont then your a wager balloon being thrown at a pointy stick at 56kmph
Being sucked out to see cause of a rip trying to save ya mate? Happens alot when people try swim after a loved one who is kitelooping down the estuary doesnt it.
And how about probably my biggest fear of all just getting ROLLED in the surf being tangled in lines haveing them wrap aroubd your legs and arms and head (Wheres my mate UNDERTOW when you need him?? Hope the fam and chillis are going well matey)
Okay now ill shushyshoosh
Nice photo gorgo! Doesnt look dolomitey is that the french? think we were gonna get a flight together at yeppoon of all places in 2013? But it didnt eventuate ill have to find some photos or video of me over the dachstein in 2018 hahaha when i still had balls and hadnt fallen into my wing yet (did that at halstat in austria )
Yeah sucks about old mate died at bright earlier this year i never quite heard if he was a coasty hitting up the inland for first time or what actually happened. Every time i hear another one i hold my breathe scan the name and hopefully breathe a sigh of a relief as rough as that sounds
The costs are bloody high but no where near as high as the cost of time! Good old parawaiting
Oh for kiters weighing up the cost just DOUBLE everything double the cost equipment (yes even that alluula stuff) and dont forget to double the length of time youll need so for example comps dont run for a day or 2 its more or less a WEEK so your accomodation is also double that 7 year sebatical kite trip where you spend a month in mauritius? Going to need at least 2 months at any flying site to get equivelant air/water time
Anyways gorgo glad you made it out im still staying current been a couple years since ive done a *intentional* siv but focusing on more physically demanding sports like climbing running etc just because of the accessability and i feel just as accomplished hitting that half marathon mark as i ever did landing out past bingara 
Select to expand quoteFroth Goth said..
www.safa.asn.au/news/skysailor-issues/current-issues
Can check the magazines yaself from that link
And a snippet for the lazy of the latest magazine
(complete bullocks only 2 deaths since 2021 hahaha i know of way more then that!!)
Omg... i promise im trying to stop ranting but just reading that kinda just makes me wonder what the ****. So first of all leaveing the body and equipment! If your first on the scene as i have been in my earlier years a fair few times. I know stuff all about saveing someones life but i sure know about wind and canopys so you would ALWAYS disconnect if possible but at least disable the wing from dragging the bloody body around the paddock. And if its not a body its going to need a helicopter so its a danger to the rescue team if the gear is left as is. Anyways Blerghhh anyways ill shut up starting to remember too much
I dont really want to dox myself theres already way too many photos of me all over the safa insta and websites and magazines but if you want to private message me any non doxing questions by all means flick em thru i can yell at you from there how theyres spiders in the clouds and how you dont need a fridge when camping at a paragliding competition cause you can just throw a couple hot cans of TUN in ya flight deck and theyll be frosty cold after a few hours of flying round at 11k feet
Please don't stop. This is fascinating!
When you said you if pull your reserve you might break your legs, do you mean that a reserve chute isn't large enough for a soft landing?
When you go around in circles chasing a thermal to gain altitude, what's the g-force like?
What conditions outside of a pilots control leads to a world champion dying during a race/event?
So theres a few schools of thought with reserves i used to believe bigger the reserve the safer but what actually occurs is the nore boyant you are the more you are going to oscillate under the canopy swinging around but if you were to imagine a much smaller reserve so essentially you are less boyant because the pilot weighs more in comparison then youll actually fall straighter less swinging around.
So what do you want more? To land pretty much straight up and down (ofcourse inevitable drift sometimes tho alot less drift) on a smaller parachute or be blown about and oscillate more wildly etc under a larger reserve.
Theres not many g forces when thermalling up unless your doing a little show boating trying to steal the core and come up on the inside of everyone but you can get some scary bloody thermals man you cant quite grasp what it feels like to accidently bumble into a double digit screamer i certaintly have never enjoyed absolutely booming days and theres a general consensus on the really big days theres a very small window to launch before it becomes far too unsafe so the gun pilots generally pop off first until they break thru the inversion layers etc and second we see theyve gotten thru that its a bit of a mad rush to get off before the inevitable shuffle to another launch is required. You need to remember in free flight your essentially raceing the sun, it heats up different faceing surfaces so rocky ridges faceing direct sunlight heat up much faster then shaded spots etc etc even i cant type enough to explain all the meteorological stuff thats involved in inland xc flying but you can download a book by Dennis Pagens "understanding the sky" think thats what it was called add a .gif on end of that into ya google search.
If you want to know what sort of things can occur for a good pilot to crash just read the incident reports the "things" that happen dont care how many hours your got or how hot ya ship itll happen to anyone. when your dealing with small little gas bubbles raceing out of the atmosphere they have very little consideration if your first into goal or not it just happens.
As aussies we are completely behind the rest of the world in paragliding we have bugger all mountains theres virtually no teenagers doing it in europe its on theyre money theyres 3 year olds paragliding they have leagues and schools and government funding its a real thing. In australia well we try to give them a run but if you watch the Red Bull X Alps youll see just how involved and intense the euros are about paragliding... aussies and kiwis tend to be more relaxed adventurous and not so ..... i dont know how to describe it ....
Anyways i cant think of anyone less qualified to be spewing all this **** then me but there ya go ( apart from maybe this new gen of mullet and moustache lads ay ay ) hahaha
So yeah watch some xalps and read that understanding the sky book if your still keen to sign ya life away then jump on the safa site and see what schools are nearby. I cant reccomend any without completely doxing myself hahaha but youll figure who to go to pretty quickly if ya research. If ya dont then theres nothing wrong with ya local instructors its definitely not a money makeing industry but as opposed to kiteing and diveing where the industry is churning over instructors and more importantly instructor licences the paragliding world the instructors generally settle down in a patch and theyll remain there for 50 years before giving up the rei?ns.
Bit of a google about the poor bloke that was teaching/tandeming at lennox he?ds few years back and fell out (passing away) leaving his passenger to luckily fly into the hill on his own (broken bones etc but survived)
Actually you asked about what causes a recogbised sky god to die? Heres a fun one! The media! Hahaha (the heavy weather boys love that word at moment) unsure of exact detai?s but it was an old tale i heard 10 or so years ago about an aussie female pilot being questioned by the media while she was setting up her gear and clipping in and she forgot a few buckles and took off while media was filming and i think... i honestly cant remembe how it ended but fell out? Bit before my time that one
But thats a good point me hearing that morbid story when i was starting out really made me remember to not get distracted by talking to people asking questions when im clipping in.
If we were to not discuss instances like this then the accidents will only reoccur. So altho the world of aviation may seem a bit unkind or ... stern?? Its for many reasons but it is helpful in ways that really matter.
Anyways go watch and read im done
theres always paraglidingforum.com where believe it or not i use my real name and i never talk **** on
Select to expand quoteFroth Goth said..
So theres a few schools of thought with reserves i used to believe bigger the reserve the safer but what actually occurs is the nore boyant you are the more you are going to oscillate under the canopy swinging around but if you were to imagine a much smaller reserve so essentially you are less boyant because the pilot weighs more in comparison then youll actually fall straighter less swinging around.
So what do you want more? To land pretty much straight up and down (ofcourse inevitable drift sometimes tho alot less drift) on a smaller parachute or be blown about and oscillate more wildly etc under a larger reserve.
Theres not many g forces when thermalling up unless your doing a little show boating trying to steal the core and come up on the inside of everyone but you can get some scary bloody thermals man you cant quite grasp what it feels like to accidently bumble into a double digit screamer i certaintly have never enjoyed absolutely booming days and theres a general consensus on the really big days theres a very small window to launch before it becomes far too unsafe so the gun pilots generally pop off first until they break thru the inversion layers etc and second we see theyve gotten thru that its a bit of a mad rush to get off before the inevitable shuffle to another launch is required. You need to remember in free flight your essentially raceing the sun, it heats up different faceing surfaces so rocky ridges faceing direct sunlight heat up much faster then shaded spots etc etc even i cant type enough to explain all the meteorological stuff thats involved in inland xc flying but you can download a book by Dennis Pagens "understanding the sky" think thats what it was called add a .gif on end of that into ya google search.
If you want to know what sort of things can occur for a good pilot to crash just read the incident reports the "things" that happen dont care how many hours your got or how hot ya ship itll happen to anyone. when your dealing with small little gas bubbles raceing out of the atmosphere they have very little consideration if your first into goal or not it just happens.
As aussies we are completely behind the rest of the world in paragliding we have bugger all mountains theres virtually no teenagers doing it in europe its on theyre money theyres 3 year olds paragliding they have leagues and schools and government funding its a real thing. In australia well we try to give them a run but if you watch the Red Bull X Alps youll see just how involved and intense the euros are about paragliding... aussies and kiwis tend to be more relaxed adventurous and not so ..... i dont know how to describe it ....
Anyways i cant think of anyone less qualified to be spewing all this **** then me but there ya go ( apart from maybe this new gen of mullet and moustache lads ay ay ) hahaha
So yeah watch some xalps and read that understanding the sky book if your still keen to sign ya life away then jump on the safa site and see what schools are nearby. I cant reccomend any without completely doxing myself hahaha but youll figure who to go to pretty quickly if ya research. If ya dont then theres nothing wrong with ya local instructors its definitely not a money makeing industry but as opposed to kiteing and diveing where the industry is churning over instructors and more importantly instructor licences the paragliding world the instructors generally settle down in a patch and theyll remain there for 50 years before giving up the rei?ns.
Bit of a google about the poor bloke that was teaching/tandeming at lennox he?ds few years back and fell out (passing away) leaving his passenger to luckily fly into the hill on his own (broken bones etc but survived)
Actually you asked about what causes a recogbised sky god to die? Heres a fun one! The media! Hahaha (the heavy weather boys love that word at moment) unsure of exact detai?s but it was an old tale i heard 10 or so years ago about an aussie female pilot being questioned by the media while she was setting up her gear and clipping in and she forgot a few buckles and took off while media was filming and i think... i honestly cant remembe how it ended but fell out? Bit before my time that one
But thats a good point me hearing that morbid story when i was starting out really made me remember to not get distracted by talking to people asking questions when im clipping in.
If we were to not discuss instances like this then the accidents will only reoccur. So altho the world of aviation may seem a bit unkind or ... stern?? Its for many reasons but it is helpful in ways that really matter.
Anyways go watch and read im done
theres always paraglidingforum.com where believe it or not i use my real name and i never talk **** on
Thanks. I was going to go for a tandem and see if I like it but after reading all that it's a hard no. That movie was a great watch. Might look into paramotor instead.
Hahahaha gotto do ya 30 hours airtime without a motor before you can get ya motor endorsement
Sailplanes are pretty cool alot of paragliders gravitate towards those afterwards but honestly matey aviation isnt for everyone and i wouldnt ever see paragliding as just a "Cheap" way to get into aviation. Theres to many other factors.
Surfings where its at
I've done tandems in lots of places on holidays. Brazil, Colombia, Costa Rica, Indonesia, Croatia, Italy, Switzerland, France.
It's absolutely awesome, and at one point I was seriously considering training up to get licensed etc.
Main reasons against:
1. I live in Sydney. There's really only two sites we can do it here; Stanwell Park and Long Reef. Coastal hills more or less, and both are up to an hours drive away from home. To get to proper 'mountains' is a couple of hours away at least and as mentioned above, well that's a whole weekend dedication. If I lived in Switzerland or in NZ where I had mountains and steep valleys on my doorstep - it would be a different matter.
2. Getting licensed up involves what a 10 day course that is very weather dependent. Bad weather and you'll need to delay, and maybe delay again, it could be a long time before you get certified. And after all that, how many times a year would I get out to do it? See point 1. I already have enough weather dependent hobbies. Only paragliding costs ~$10k minimum to get certified and setup with the gear. Is that going to sit in the garage collecting dust, along with my surfboards and fishing rods etc?
3. I'm not convinced that I trust myself that much. Going tandem with a professional (even in dodgy countries), and only every now and then while on holidays, I feel is much safer option.
Doing a motorbike tour through Nepal is high on my bucket list and I'll be sure to hit up paragliding once or thrice on that trip. That's enough for me.
It's a bit like scuba diving in that respect. I love doing it on holidays, but as for buying all the equipment and doing it 5 mins from home. I just cbf.
I agree with all that Phoney says here; sums it up nicely.
Lots of tandem flights in various locations would be a good strategy for getting the fun of flight, with very minimal risk, small cost and zero hassle.
As I stated before, most paragliding, for sensible pilots, does not carry anything like the same risk as Froth Goth keeps going on about.
In fact, I don't understand why he even persists in pursuing this activity which he paints such a grim picture of? You're pretty 'safe' in your armchair at home, but that's hardly living, is it?
In terms of safety, paragliding is fairly dangerous, but there's thousands of people who do it all the time. Some of those people I wouldn't trust walking across a road let alone flying, but they seem to survive.
It's bizarre to think of the danger of paragliding, but then to ride motorbikes, or even bicycles, on the road. Both things I have done extensively, and both things I would definitely not do now. They have a similar risk profile to paragliding in that they're quite safe when things are going ok, but a random minor event can kill you.
If I lived somewhere that had good flying and good wind sports I would still be flying. There's been some significant advancements in equipment in the last few years and I would love to get my hands on them. 2-liner C wings and parakites in particular.
The scariest thing ive ever done in paragliding is be a tandem passenger.
You guys are nuts.
Gorgo if you want to get ya hands on a mullet let me know but i will warn you just like the kite mixers theyre designed to just keep the wing open so it will ruin your regular flying because youll find yaself doing stuff you would never do on a regular wing check out some of the frontal "attempts" we can literally grab another pilots a lines and yank em so hard down and she still wont frontal its wild to see the pitch control being tested to its limits
Been working on a safer way to fly
Hey
I broke me back with paragliding. 2 T12-13 compression fracture. Metal plates and that. Long recovery.
Did that while training for competition in year 2000.
Many of ppl I knew died over the years. Its fun, but be ready to pay a high price.
Kiting is way more safe. Mind u, broke me ankle and a clevicle, thats me :)
I know four paragliders.
scratch that, three- one died paragliding.
One got a fractured spine, another fractured his pelvis and broke both legs. The third is fine and does mostly powered paragliding now.
it looks fun, but if I extrapolate from people I know who do stupid stuff, the numbers seem poor on this one.
www.redbull.com/au-en/films/flying-between-giants
For anyone who is still thinky ol frothys just a spinner check out how 4 x world champion goes about halfway thru the movie.
Tldr etc ol mate gets some troubleing air he ends up not climbing out with the other 2 instead is forced to land at a basecamp of some sort (not his goal) gets lucky and gets to borrow a sleeping bag and tent and has a nice little walk out for a couple days and shoots off home. No harm? no foul? Maybe... that whole part of the movie is maybe a minute to a non pilot its basically completely uneventful but if you read between the lines a bit and put yourself in his shoes... its wild. Just look at that terrain.
Ive had ..... about 10 friends fly that same region and i wont go into any details but i thought this movie is just a great example of what makes paragliding so different from other sports those same friends some are dieing to go back and others will never go back.
Theres no kitesurfing situation where 3 world champions are kiteing together and one gets shook like a tree until he goes home and the other 2 are super stoked and happy.
Ive lost count the amount of times ive had a rough as guts flight and i check the logs see who was flying with me simular place simular time and i ask them how they felt about the air and they say it was beutiful and fun and im not talking some pro on a ccc im talking even a recent student who learnt a few months ago.
And as usual the real adventure only starts after you have landed sometimes.
I will hands down never fly the BIG big air i like to surf in boardies and fly without o2. Plus im wholey incapable of ever doing it.
i cant think of a single place where i would refuse to kitesurf. But with flying even the safest place a literal launch site on your own block of land can be perfect at 10am and suicide by midday.
Wish we could close this thread so i can shut up
I think its a bit over the top tho.
Remember Coldshot? He also died @ Cott.
Kiting IS more safe, but only for some. Some ppl actually broke a neck, ie @ PeliPt. You well know who.
But, paragliding is about hours in the air.
Justin from Perth did a flight from York to Geraldton in 2003, if remember well. 10 hrs flight. Zig-zag.
He survived :)
Which kiter did 10hrs and that distance? That would be an equivalent of how many sky diving jumps?
Many. So just like with anything, doing more hours will increase the risk.
Gliders are great option tho. Shared ownership for like 20k and flying for hours and hours. I only know for one single fatality from 2002 in WA.
Paramotor paragliding is a no for me. Crazy loud. Also a friend died in fire after bad landing.
Your choice of poison tho ;)
Ummmm kiteing is just sailing... paragliding is flying with a wing that folds itself into a ball at random..... i kited to islands and camped on them for weeks towing my food and water and tent supplys and would go from island to island like this plenty of times one of my flying friends louis tapper kited the whole coast line of brazil for the world record.
He was later support on the xalps where you paraglide and hike for a few weeks in a race thru several countrys.
Kiteings so easy you dont even need an assist.
Same trip on a paraglider you need an assist. That kind of answers itself right there.
You talk about which kiter did 10 hours hajajahaha ive done more then that. And in BOOTS kiteing for longer then 6 hours in straps hurts the bottom of your feet so much it like bruises them but a good pair of ronixes thermo moulds and i can kite for days.
10 hours of flying isnt like a record... thats just a good day ive seen countless times people fly past 10 hours even teams fly for 12 together. You have to remember some countrys get more daylight then others. Same deal for kiteing tho when teaching in poland we get to do 14 hours of teaching kiteing in 1 day thanks to the sun up there.
Skydiving jumps arent really any sort of measurement of anything. Its how many different jumps you do that matter as far as experience building goes. So jump with this suit or that suit from a chopper with this helmet with camera helmet under this wing with this pack this temperature of air or passing thru an inversion etc etc it kinda goes on but u get the point i hope.
But yeah sailplanes are pretty much it if i was wanting to FLY like a plane i would go the sailplane route join a club use the clubby plane for a few seasons and go halves with a mate.
One of the mods / editors here on seabreeze had his own sailplane i think from the age of a teenager propbably just doxed myself but yea hes in the biggest of commercial jets by now probably holding onto a boeing door as we speak
10 hours of kiteing = die of boredom
10 hours paragliding = your on an entirely different planet the whole time and when you land earth doesnt even feel like earth it takes ahwhile for your brain to like reconfigure a bit like how someone who has been on a rocky boat for a long time sways a little at the yacht club when trying to order a schooey
Select to expand quoteFroth Goth said..
www.redbull.com/au-en/films/flying-between-giants
For anyone who is still thinky ol frothys just a spinner check out how 4 x world champion goes about halfway thru the movie.
Tldr etc ol mate gets some troubleing air he ends up not climbing out with the other 2 instead is forced to land at a basecamp of some sort (not his goal) gets lucky and gets to borrow a sleeping bag and tent and has a nice little walk out for a couple days and shoots off home. No harm? no foul? Maybe... that whole part of the movie is maybe a minute to a non pilot its basically completely uneventful but if you read between the lines a bit and put yourself in his shoes... its wild. Just look at that terrain.
Ive had ..... about 10 friends fly that same region and i wont go into any details but i thought this movie is just a great example of what makes paragliding so different from other sports those same friends some are dieing to go back and others will never go back.
Theres no kitesurfing situation where 3 world champions are kiteing together and one gets shook like a tree until he goes home and the other 2 are super stoked and happy.
Ive lost count the amount of times ive had a rough as guts flight and i check the logs see who was flying with me simular place simular time and i ask them how they felt about the air and they say it was beutiful and fun and im not talking some pro on a ccc im talking even a recent student who learnt a few months ago.
And as usual the real adventure only starts after you have landed sometimes.
I will hands down never fly the BIG big air i like to surf in boardies and fly without o2. Plus im wholey incapable of ever doing it.
i cant think of a single place where i would refuse to kitesurf. But with flying even the safest place a literal launch site on your own block of land can be perfect at 10am and suicide by midday.
Wish we could close this thread so i can shut up
I've been sacked from my job. These comments are informative and entertaining. The thread stays open.
Select to expand quoteFroth Goth said..
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For anyone who is still thinky ol frothys just a spinner check out how 4 x world champion goes about halfway thru the movie.
...
It's a bit of an apples to brussel sprouts comparison. Think of how it would be if a flat water dinghy sailor was put into a kiting competition at Jaws or Teahupo'o and told "You'll be right. It's just sailing."
Thing is one of the paraglider guys is a super experienced paramotor pilot and sailor and acro guy and all-round professional adventurer. I suspect if the positions were reversed he'd still do ok.
Select to expand quoteFroth Goth said..
Does kai lenny paraglide?!?
That would be very interesting if he didnt
You sounds like Ian Young :)
Not everyone is kiting for 10hrs just like not everyone is flying for 10hrs XC.
As I wrote, Coldshot also died. Plus others.
Did many many hours in the air, never colapsed and never front stalled.
But, be fair to the readers and say there are different paragliders, correct?
One might kill you in no time. And the other, being DHV1 is very safe.
So I recon going into extremes with a perfomance paraglider is just that - extreme.
More people are dying skiing on slopes than paragliding and kiting combined. Its still very safe to ski. Just wasnt for some.
Good luck
PS
And skydiving is also very safe. Or diving. Would I do it? No way. As I already have many broken bones. But, thats me, I never follow rules.
I typed like a 10 page response then it didnt save 
The certification process happens in benign air been there in the 777 van in slovebia with the test cert pilots for days with them seeing exactly how that whole process works first hand.
Airflow over wing = power and lift = flight
"Passive safety" is ment to be zero input and the wing self rights itself.... you still get thrown into objects and die...
Theres nothing scarier then being pinned because your wings too slow to get thru some airmass thats sinking like around a strong thermal you just slide down like a cartoon character hitting a pole.
(Just place yourself in the saddle of a ridgeline with no forward penetration as you slide down into rotor and leeward wind fun fun!) A fast more "dangerous" wing would actually just let you cut thru that sinking air and into the riseing air behind it and you could climb out to safety*
So in that scenario a very blood common scenario you would be infinitely safer on the less safe faster wing.
Theres endless scenarios where a A wing is safer then a D wing and vice versa
I wrote so much more before but the mojos disipated sorry
So speaking of skydiving and scuba diving ...
If you recognise this carpark then ill be bringing some tanks this weekend come say high
Oh also i checked Xcontest and asked AI and no kai lenny doesnt paraglide.
Think about that. (Maybe its just cause of hawaii buuuut maybe its not )
