Select to expand quotePiros said..
That's really well picked up Ghostman and I agree 100% on the straight rail theory.....Until I rode Clarkys board it has a 50mm more pulled in tail than all the rest. A bunch of us have all been riding together on different types of Vanguards swapping boards and what I found with Clarky's is when I pulled off the back of the wave and I pushed really hard it came over so hard on it's rail . Once I did that a few more times and it actually did a 180 degree hook turn pulling off the wave. So much so it hurt my ankle it pulled around so hard. None of the other boards with the straighter sides and wider tail did this.
So for my board I let that theory go .I personally think the more pulled in tail from the centre back is the way to go. I know it runs against what should work. I've gone 100mm less..too far I don't know yet the surf has been sh!t. This board is an experiment and I'm just trying stuff that's why I did a backyard job to keep the cost down , worst case my kids score another board.
Yes Piros i do too. I reckon you said the meanest in the Tomo design 
The 2" front width of the Vangard outline allows to pull in line tail from the line of centre back.
You can't have it with a pointed nose because of unbalance areas between the forward and rear part.
Hi Piros
I am super keen to hear how the pulled in tail, straight fin combo works. That is board is looking like a ripper!
Cheers Chris
Just came in from a 3 hour shoulder high surf at Currumbin , here's the pros and cons review of the VP 7-6 x 26 compared to a Gulliver 7-3 x 27...
Pros:- So good to finally get it in decent surf , it's pretty amazing and it's like riding a bike for the first time without training wheels. You can ride the boards two ways really heavy on the back foot and rail drive or keep it flat and it's like riding in a skate bowl. Re-entries and cutback backs just link up producing so much speed. The more I ride it the more stable it is so you do adjust to it. It was a real 4 seasons day will glassy water , wind , rising tide into choppy conditions , so a really good test. In the end I was behind the rock and was pretty comfortable with the swell rebound coming off the rocks and the cross shore breeze.
Cons:- The board did seem to struggle trying to make it's way through the fat section at the Alley and when I swapped with Porchey on his 7-3 it didn't have that problem. The VP wouldn't climb as well when you didn't have the speed behind you it would slow down and thats got me thinking the narrower tail is sinking or the water flow is not happening because of the over pulled in rails. So maybe I've gone too far and it backs up the theory of the straighter rails. In the smaller waves which walled up better it was fine but on the bigger open fat slower faces you could feel it stall. Another thing to look at is the 7-3 has a massive V all the way through and the VP is concaved with a tiny V (see pic below). This is also worth looking at. This is weird for some reason on re-entries I kept getting smacked in the nuts. Lucky it was bit cold and I had boardies on so they were safely tucked away. You really have to compress on the board through your turns so if you have dud knees these boards are not for you. My board had a really small sweet spot and you constantly need to shift your feet , the 7-3 had a really big sweet spot with little foot movement , again I saying it's my narrow tail but his rear fins where too small , when it let go you went flat on your back.
Summary:- Because the boards are so lively and easy to surf , you really do pull off and link together some amazing moves but it's pretty easy to over surf them and start going all over the shop. It's very rare at the Alley to get guys paddle over and ask about the board normally it "Fark Off" , so I must have doing some things right. I know I can go smaller surfing the 7-3 it was just stable as my board with the wider tail. These are the changes I will make on the next one , 7-3 make the tail wider by 2 inches which will make it close to Simons boards at Deep , narrow the nose by and inch , it's wider than all the rest and drop it down to 25 wide.I'll add some foam to bring back the lost volume. Re the V schools still out on that one .I'll discuss that with the boys over a few beers.
and I going back to the straighter rail theory. My board had it's merits and would draw cleaner lines but overall I think the Gulliver 7-3 was the better board.
Here are some pics of the comparisons , and I threw in a shot of a older Simmons Hydro (not a Deep) 7-0 x 30 - 98 litre (massive concave) , my mates comment on this was it is really a front foot board , good side ways stability but really rocky fore and aft. Very twitchy and hard to find feet placement.
I'll shot a video over the weekend.
I've put about 15 hours into this board , surfing it in sh!ty little mush to peakey 4ft slabs. Never really got settled on it but it wasn't untill the Saturday early morn surf at Currumbin that made me want to burn this board. Fat lumpy shoulder high waves with the rebound off the rock at high tide. I struggled so hard the with the narrow tail in the lumpy conditions combined with the offshore trade winds at the Alley.The board has it's merits on the right wave but overall it's a leg burning beast that cost you waves and drags it's arse. I was all full of first love with the blinkers on but overall it just doesn't work. It was a fun project and I'm back on my new JP 8-6 after my holiday in Cambodia on the Double Helix.
Select to expand quotePiros said..
I've put about 15 hours into this board , surfing it in sh!ty little mush to peakey 4ft slabs. Never really got settled on it but it wasn't untill the Saturday early morn surf at Currumbin that made me want to burn this board. Fat lumpy shoulder high waves with the rebound off the rock at high tide. I struggled so hard the with the narrow tail in the lumpy conditions combined with the offshore trade winds at the Alley.The board has it's merits on the right wave but overall it's a leg burning beast that cost you waves and drags it's arse. I was all full of first love with the blinkers on but overall it just doesn't work. It was a fun project and I'm back on my new JP 8-6 after my holiday in Cambodia on the Double Helix.
Ha ha - funny. Well it was worth a shot - good on you for trying.
Are you still going to try a version II, with some of the tweaks you mentioned?
Select to expand quotePiros said..
The board has it's merits on the right wave.
Always found that on wide tailed beasts, they work really well on one wave and feel sh1te on the next. I remember the lazor zaps and using Mitch Thorsen boards in the 80s. Who can forget Cheyne at Waimea Bay on a 5 6 I think, he could do it but why would you
The classic shapes work on a variety of waves.
Not at the moment Casso I'll get through the Qld & Aussie titles , then start playing again. Will probably look at Nano's next and agree with your comments Hilly
Select to expand quotePiros said..
Not at the moment Casso I'll get through the Qld & Aussie titles , then start playing again. Will probably look at Nano's next and agree with your comments Hilly
What are you riding now Piros? Are you still riding the 8-6 JP or did you build a new tomo-ish style board?
Yes 90 % of my riding is on the new JP 8-6 , looks like the JP Slate won't be available until mid Jan 2015 so I'll just wait till then. I actually really hurt my back on my Double Helix just wit the relentless balance correction.
Select to expand quotePiros said..
Yes 90 % of my riding is on the new JP 8-6 , looks like the JP Slate won't be available until mid Jan 2015 so I'll just wait till then. I actually really hurt my back on my Double Helix just wit the relentless balance correction.
Was the "relentless balance correction" because it was a much tippier board than your 8-6 JP? Even though it was a foot shorter, I would have thought that it might have felt a little more stable when paddling because the width extends so far forward and backward.
