Just looking at fin options for a new stubby single...was thinking of going with a Greenough or a Ryan Lovelace 8inch flexi from http://www.alkalifins.com/...will the Volan be stiffer....will that be too much fin for a 6 x 21 x 3 board...rails will be really knifey and its going to be a flat to vee bottom?
Don't be afraid to go a bigger fin if it's a wider tail. I've got a 9" in my shorty as it has a big arse and it loves it. I like a stiff dolphin type fin for smaller waves and flexy more upright,or narrower base for when it's bigger. 
Select to expand quotesurfbroker said..
I had this 12" flexy on a 7'4" wide tail Tolly..and it was great.
Thanks guys...I might go teh whole hog and get the 10inch Flexi...decision decisons
Those 10 inch flexi from Alki are amazing in the flesh. Love them.
when do we get to see pics of the new board build?
Select to expand quoteTed the Kiwi said..
Those 10 inch flexi from Alki are amazing in the flesh. Love them.
when do we get to see pics of the new board build?
The just finished one or the stubby
Yeah big and flexy pushed up in the box.
Or short and stiff at the back of the box.
Short stiff fins at the back will give you a more pivoty feel and the big flexy one is likely to draw your turns out and be more carvy.
Select to expand quoteTed the Kiwi said..
All pics are good but had not seen the single fin yet
I will get onto it bro!!
Select to expand quoteTux said...Ted the Kiwi said..
All pics are good but had not seen the single fin yet
I will get onto it bro!!
Can't believe he had to ask
Sorry lads its still in the roughing out stage...if its any consolation I have been surfing to much to take pictures or do much shaping.....hahahahahahahaha
Select to expand quotechrispy said..
Tux said...
Ted the Kiwi said..
All pics are good but had not seen the single fin yet
I will get onto it bro!!
Can't believe he had to ask
+ 1
Tux - happy to view pics of the partially shaped new beast
*** PIMP ***
Fair to say i'm an Alkali fin whore 
... I own three of them and the quality amazing...
That Ryan Lovelace Volan flex is siiiiick, just punches you out of those turns and sooooo smoothe. I run a 9" on the 7' SubX, last surf on some overhead freight train lefts the grip was amazing, the boys couldn't believe I was surfing a single... buy one, you wont be dissapointed
Select to expand quotesurfbroker said..
I had this 12" flexy on a 7'4" wide tail Tolly..and it was great.
awesome set up up dude, awesome!!! 
Select to expand quotesurfbroker said...
And Andy..it was as loose as a goose..another one I kick myself for moving on 
Dude!!! Selling a boards like selling a kidney, not to be taken lightly... Actually, id probably place more importance the board
If you are refusing to show pics I have a good mind to come down and check it myself. Next Friday is yr deadline
I could comment and make suggestions but there's a sour individual here who will whinge to the admin because I make fins.
Anyway I stayed on singles throughout the 80's and 90's and took great delight in roasting thrusters with them. In those days it wasn't the done thing.
Re. fins: the foil is of the utmost importance, I used to refin most of mine with fins from Wayne Parkes as the usual fins supplied were crap.
Once I started making my own boards in '94 I went straight to Spitfire fins, they are so much more precise than the Greenough type and have more drive. Of course most people just want the retro look, such is the backward mentality of the masses.
I had a look at Alkali fins... better than some but as can be seen in the picture below they have the usual appalling foiling in the bottom third of the fin. The base area has a huge flat zone and the glass contour lines converge at leading and trailing edges at the base. This creates lots of drag and causes stalling. It's almost impossible to hand foil a fin with a box tab without that problem.They still work but nowhere near as well as they could.
Here's a comment on a blog post on flat zones in foils from 2009
www.roystuart.biz/2009/01/surfboard-fin-guide-part-two-flat-spot.html?q=flat
Note that the tests were done with a 0.5mm flat spot which is insignificant compared with the huge flat areas ( and resulting corners) on the fins shown here.... but the reduction in lift ( which also means an increase in drag) is huge. i.e. 10% to 15% less than a correctly foiled fin. The large flat zone will reduce lift and increase drag much more. and that's just the start of the problems.
The issues are less when at a low angle of attack i.e. when not turning. Turns will need to be 'nursed' or jabbed at to avoid loss of speed and drive, plus stalling. Extreme tip flex will make matters worse as well.
"This is an interesting topic and got me thinking about putting some science behind it to prove or disprove otherwise. I used some CFD (Computational Fluid Dynamics) software which is computer based modelling of flows around airfoils. I used XFLR5 for this. I initially did an analysis of a NACA 0012 symmetrical 2D foil. Tested for Reynolds numbers from 3E5 to 1.5E6 which is indicative of a fin with a base of 100 mm with speeds from 3 m/s to 15 m/s in seawater. Angles of attack from 0 to 20 degrees.
Results - peak lift values ranging from 1.1 to 1.5 at angels ranging from 13 to 17 degrees.
I then altered the exact same foil to add a very small flat spot (0.5mm) at the wide point of the camber on each side of the foil and performed the same analysis.
Results - peak lift values ranging 1.0 to 1.3 at angles ranging from 10 to 14 degrees. The lift values were less and occurred at smaller angles of attack.
It would seem that flat spots on a foil do reduce lift.
The values for drag showed a similar theme with drag values higher for the foil with the flat spot than for the NACA 0012 foil. The drag values are closely bunched up to an AOA of 6 degrees before they start to separate. The highest drag values occur at the lower Reynolds numbers and start appearing at an AOA of about 12 degrees.
Conclusion - flat spots would appear to reduce lift and increase drag on a fin foil."
TK
Select to expand quoteRoyStuart said..
I could comment and make suggestions but there's a sour individual here who will whinge to the admin because I make fins.
Anyway I stayed on singles throughout the 80's and 90's and took great delight in roasting thrusters with them. In those days it wasn't the done thing.
Re. fins: the foil is of the utmost importance, I used to refin most of mine with fins from Wayne Parkes as the usual fins supplied were crap.
Once I started making my own boards in '94 I went straight to Spitfire fins, they are so much more precise than the Greenough type and have more drive. Of course most people just want the retro look, such is the backward mentality of the masses.
Hilarious! Welcome back Roy!
You have hit the trifecta by singlehandedly taking a swipe at someone else on the forum, telling as how sh&t hot you surf, and that no one else in the surf industry knows what they are doing design wise - all within the space of a single post.
We missed you.
Well I reckon it's good to see someone speak on their theory/design....It's up to the individuals who read ideas to determine if it's a workable option.
There are plenty of informed surfers that read this forum so it opens up discussion...read Geoff McCoys and Grant Millers ideas...they are fairly one eyed when it comes to design..all shapers have their own slant on what works.
Select to expand quotesurfbroker said..
Well I reckon it's good to see someone speak on their theory/design....It's up to the individuals who read ideas to determine if it's a workable option.
There are plenty of informed surfers that read this forum so it opens up discussion...read Geoff McCoys and Grant Millers ideas...they are fairly one eyed when it comes to design..all shapers have their own slant on what works.
aint that the truth Jim....maybe because its all unscientific...well Roy has thrown some science at us but I'm afraid my intellect is not that great....I guess.....as captain Goodvibes used to say " I may not know art....but I know what I like".....and the other catch cry "only a surfer knows the feeling....just this morning I finally got to stage two of a little experiment I have been working on...which by the way backs up Roy's theory. Most breazers on this site would be aware of my good mate John Deveraux's fin artistry...perhaps I'm a bit biased but I think John is one of the top fin foilers in the world....anyway test boards are my ladyfinger log...because it is a single fin design.....ladyfinger one....10" fin box....10" fin 6" base 6" rake 10" from tail....matt finish
ladyfinger two ....exact same fin...stick on.....10" from tail....................full polish
both boards were computer shaped and glassed single six ounce bottom...double six on the decks
as you will see in the photo's...ladyfiger one (watermelon colour)...due to the fact that its a fin box...John's foil lines dont quite go all the way to the base...creating that little flat spot...the foil is allmost perfect as the lines of the ply dont lie.
ladyfinger two(ferrari red)...no flatspot....(together with no screw heads and box hole I know) but the foil is spot on..leading edge to trailing edge and top to bottom
both boards perform really nice in waves they were designed for....but the moment I started paddling the red one I could feel the difference...same,same,but different the thing felt like number one but it had just been oiled...it just slipped through the water...it really did feel like it had NO DRAG...and heaps more inertia....to be honest I didnt think that on a log you would be going fast enough for all this to be that noticable, but it was heaps....so when you know what fin works for you and you know were to put it....stick it on and glide 
oh and I think they look uber cool
Arkgee I love your work mate and you have probably forgotten more than I know about surfingI think if your surfing with a legrope which probably most of us do all this theory goes out the window as the drag from the leggie would far outweigh any drag that the foil might have. If you were paddling two identical boards and your body position was an inch forward or back on your paddle into a wave that would contribute to more or less drag I cant beleive that you could feel the drag from a bit of box section hanging out of the finbox
Select to expand quoteboofy said..
Arkgee I love your work mate and you have probably forgotten more than I know about surfingI think if your surfing with a legrope which probably most of us do all this theory goes out the window as the drag from the leggie would far outweigh any drag that the foil might have. If you were paddling two identical boards and your body position was an inch forward or back on your paddle into a wave that would contribute to more or less drag I cant beleive that you could feel the drag from a bit of box section hanging out of the finbox
I cant believe it either Boofy....I honestly got into this experiment to prove my theory..."that the speeds we do... will not be great enough to warrant all that fine tuning"and to prove to myself the debate on box or fixed was neither here nor there
like I said though "same, same, but different....both boards worked fine but the red one feels like its on oil...which I guess is what it feels like when you have less drag when you are moving slow so, I dont think I could feel the drag...more so the lack of it if you know what I mean....sure felt good let me tell ya.
sorry I'm guilty of not wearing a leggie
6 oclock in the moring...half dozen out, you would be unlucky to get hit by my board
Select to expand quotearkgee said..boofy said..
Arkgee I love your work mate and you have probably forgotten more than I know about surfingI think if your surfing with a legrope which probably most of us do all this theory goes out the window as the drag from the leggie would far outweigh any drag that the foil might have. If you were paddling two identical boards and your body position was an inch forward or back on your paddle into a wave that would contribute to more or less drag I cant beleive that you could feel the drag from a bit of box section hanging out of the finbox
I cant believe it either Boofy....I honestly got into this experiment to prove my theory..."that the speeds we do... will not be great enough to warrant all that fine tuning"and to prove to myself the debate on box or fixed was neither here nor there
like I said though "same, same, but different....both boards worked fine but the red one feels like its on oil...which I guess is what it feels like when you have less drag when you are moving slow so, I dont think I could feel the drag...more so the lack of it if you know what I mean....sure felt good let me tell ya.
sorry I'm guilty of not wearing a leggie 6 oclock in the moring...half dozen out, you would be unlucky to get hit by my board
I take your word for it mate and would love one of your mates fins
Oh Roy on the pm.you sent me about retracting my post about you being a scam,sorry I don't reply to private messages, just on here. Oh it was a joke,I am one of only a few people who encourage you to post on here. So relax. Yet I do think your full of ****,and suffer delusions of grandeur.... But who cares what I think,you sold a sled for a cool million buckaroonies and i could only dream of that kinda genius
Select to expand quotedamo666 said...RoyStuart said..
I could comment and make suggestions but there's a sour individual here who will whinge to the admin because I make fins.
Anyway I stayed on singles throughout the 80's and 90's and took great delight in roasting thrusters with them. In those days it wasn't the done thing.
Re. fins: the foil is of the utmost importance, I used to refin most of mine with fins from Wayne Parkes as the usual fins supplied were crap.
Once I started making my own boards in '94 I went straight to Spitfire fins, they are so much more precise than the Greenough type and have more drive. Of course most people just want the retro look, such is the backward mentality of the masses.
Hilarious! Welcome back Roy!
You have hit the trifecta by singlehandedly taking a swipe at someone else on the forum, telling as how sh&t hot you surf, and that no one else in the surf industry knows what they are doing design wise - all within the space of a single post.
We missed you.
You sir have also found genius with that post
Select to expand quotechrispy said..
Oh Roy on the pm.you sent me about retracting my post about you being a scam,sorry I don't reply to private messages, just on here. Oh it was a joke,I am one of only a few people who encourage you to post on here. So relax. Yet I do think your full of ****,and suffer delusions of grandeur.... But who cares what I think,you sold a sled for a cool million buckaroonies and i could only dream of that kinda genius
Farrk I thought Roy was your father .
Nasty TB nasty,the only thing I see in common is they both have the same hair style
