However, while I don't think this sail would give any significant advantage on a conventional slalom board, it may be very applicable to a foil board, as the apparent wind is going to be further forward a lot of the time, and good lift / drag ratio rather than power factor is going to be important.
Be very interested to see it trialled on a board with a foil to see how it performs.
Select to expand quotePacey said..
From the web site - "This is first in the world asymmetrical, reversible, soft wing windsurfing sail."
I remember using a proto Gaastra sail the same as this in 1982-83.
Let's get a review from someone on here & see how the wingsail performs.l like to try it on my foil board.at least it floats.
Good on you for giving it a go.
I was going to make a negative comment, about the science, then I realised it is no more sketchy than just about every "innovation" on every board and sail I own.
If it works it works.
That's exactly what I am thinking, he spent a lot of time developing and testing his ideas and this will benefit everyone. He never claimed that this is a sail for breaking records or winning races.
Select to expand quotepowersloshin said..
That's exactly what I am thinking, he spent a lot of time developing and testing his ideas and this will benefit everyone. He never claimed that this is a sail for breaking records or winning races.
If it can't break speed records or win races, I am not that interested anymore.
Select to expand quotesailquik said..powersloshin said..
That's exactly what I am thinking, he spent a lot of time developing and testing his ideas and this will benefit everyone. He never claimed that this is a sail for breaking records or winning races.
If it can't break speed records or win races, I am not that interested anymore.
Who knows though? No one has given it a go just turned their noses up at it.
Steve Allen has ridden a foil fin successfully. The Virus fin.
People say that such and such would be fast on a door with a sheet, hell put him on this rig with a windsurfing board and see what happens.
Someone has to be given one to test.
Select to expand quoteNelsonFoils said..
"Real life" Rigging video
Seems like a lot of frigging around to rig it.l still have trouble rigging my own sails on some occasions.
Select to expand quoteBSN101 said..sailquik said..powersloshin said..
That's exactly what I am thinking, he spent a lot of time developing and testing his ideas and this will benefit everyone. He never claimed that this is a sail for breaking records or winning races.
If it can't break speed records or win races, I am not that interested anymore.
Who knows though? No one has given it a go just turned their noses up at it.
Steve Allen has ridden a foil fin successfully. The Virus fin.
People say that such and such would be fast on a door with a sheet, hell put him on this rig with a windsurfing board and see what happens.
Someone has to be given one to test.
The designer of the wingsail is negative about other sailmakers and sailors in his marketing, so he can hardly complain if some people point out that some of his claims are untrue according to people who actually design world record holding wings and winning wingsails.
If people use negative terms like "Ridicules debate.....People's mind was so fogged....no one even payed attention....these developers came to foolish conclusion....totally useless" then they can hardly complain if other people are negative towards their claims.
what surprised me - was sail sizing
there are plenty of good sails in the 5.8-6.3 range
for me as a heavyweight - 5.8 means almost 25 knots
in that kind of wind ... why go complex ??
Good on you Mr Wing Sail for having red hot crack, way beyond my wildest skill level dreams, you are a clever and determined bugger. :)
I'm sure they thought the bloke with the noisy smelly horseless carriage was a tosser at the time, don't let the knockers deter you , go for it keep pushing. The first kitesurfing kites looked like back yard mini hangliders with ski's ...look what they have become now!
The design probably does have some merit at high performance levels , past my knowledge to know, maybe it's a good foil match?
For me I'd like to see it has a simple roll out design , insert mast, attach pump , to a single high flow valve, attach boom and away you go. too complex and slow currently.
So for this Shark , its a No, Not yet anyway...but keep working on it. Well done you.
Joe ,
You can sail the 5.8 in 15kn and never need to come in for a smaller sail
"A new type of thinking is essential if mankind is to survive
and move toward higher levels."
- Albert Einstein
Select to expand quoteJonesySail said..
Good on you Mr Wing Sail for having red hot crack, way beyond my wildest skill level dreams, you are a clever and determined bugger. :)
The design probably does have some merit at high performance levels , past my knowledge to know, maybe it's a good foil match?
For me I'd like to see it has a simple roll out design , insert mast, attach pump , to a single high flow valve, attach boom and away you go. too complex and slow currently.
I agree here too.
The Mk2 will be one. (NP are up to X)
if if he can get some demos out he might be in with a chance.
Select to expand quoteNelsonFoils said..
Joe ,
You can sail the 5.8 in 15kn and never need to come in for a smaller sail
"A new type of thinking is essential if mankind is to survive
and move toward higher levels."
- Albert Einstein
never thought much of Einstein as a philosopher
and definitely NOT much of a windsurfer ... 
in any case at 105 kilos - would like to see any 5.8 get me on a plane in 15 knots
and obviously excluding foil boards in that statement
Select to expand quoteChris 249 said..
The designer of the wingsail is negative about other sailmakers and sailors in his marketing, so he can hardly complain if some people point out that some of his claims are untrue according to people who actually design world record holding wings and winning wingsails.
If people use negative terms like "Ridicules debate.....People's mind was so fogged....no one even payed attention....these developers came to foolish conclusion....totally useless" then they can hardly complain if other people are negative towards their claims.
Kudos for the passion to innovate, however I agree. His dismissal of all that has gone before is the nail in his coffin. Also, Wingsails have been done many times before - rigid wings as well as softer ones very much like his. Dan Kaseler of Gaastra, Naish, Vandal, & Avanti built one very similar in concept for Naish back in the early 2000's.
www.olypen.com/dkaseler/inflatable.htm
It's a start and with some positive and constructive input who knows where it could lead.
Select to expand quoteRAL INN said..
It's a start and with some positive and constructive input who knows where it could lead.
True, hard to see how he could patent it though... considering the Kasseler sail especially.
Select to expand quotegorgesailor said..RAL INN said..
It's a start and with some positive and constructive input who knows where it could lead.
True, hard to see how he could patent it though... considering the Kasseler sail especially.
Bet theres several or more big sail brands with something very similar on the market shortly. Single piece, single inflation point...the improvements will come.
Select to expand quotepirrad said..gorgesailor said..RAL INN said..
It's a start and with some positive and constructive input who knows where it could lead.
True, hard to see how he could patent it though... considering the Kasseler sail especially.
Bet theres several or more big sail brands with something very similar on the market shortly. Single piece, single inflation point...the improvements will come.
As others have said, it's not a new idea. If big brands haven't already gone down this route, they aren't going to start now. I bet they won't be swinging this way. This gentleman will be the go to man, in a niche market.
Select to expand quoteJohn340 said..
The finished product looks great.
I have a few questions
- what are the comparative sizes of current PWA race sails to the 4.5 & 5.8 MW Storm?
- similarly, what are the expected wind range for each sail for a 85kg sailor on a 110lit slalom board?
- have you or other sailors used the Storm for GPS sailing and is there any GPS data available for these sessions?
- is there any leach twist or is it not necessary?
- do you have any video of the sail in use?
- is the specification for the mast unique to the Storm or can current constant curve masts be used?
- how does the sail account for different boom heights or is there only one height available?
-
Hey John! Leach twist about 5 degrees . Boom adjustments 11 inches closed on each side with adjustable velcro strips ,mast sdm 460 wind range 14 - 42 kt.
Select to expand quotejoe windsurf said..
you ship from NJ ??
max sail is 5.8 meters ?
at that price does it come with mast ?
if not - flex, cc or hard top ??
if i visit Long Island or CT - can go to NJ and try one ??
thanks
joewindsurfer.com
Joe, I can demo my sail anytime .
Select to expand quotegorgesailor said..RAL INN said..
It's a start and with some positive and constructive input who knows where it could lead.
True, hard to see how he could patent it though... considering the Kasseler sail especially.
Patent granted April 2016 . Patent number stated on website. Enjoy
Select to expand quotegorgesailor said..RAL INN said..
It's a start and with some positive and constructive input who knows where it could lead.
True, hard to see how he could patent it though... considering the Kasseler sail especially.
Patent granted April 2016 . Patent number stated on website. Enjoy
Select to expand quoteSparky said..pirrad said..gorgesailor said..RAL INN said..
It's a start and with some positive and constructive input who knows where it could lead.
True, hard to see how he could patent it though... considering the Kasseler sail especially.
Bet theres several or more big sail brands with something very similar on the market shortly. Single piece, single inflation point...the improvements will come.
As others have said, it's not a new idea. If big brands haven't already gone down this route, they aren't going to start now. I bet they won't be swinging this way. This gentleman will be the go to man, in a niche market.
FYI Great idea never born in one place and fully matured.
Select to expand quotegorgesailor said..Chris 249 said..
The designer of the wingsail is negative about other sailmakers and sailors in his marketing, so he can hardly complain if some people point out that some of his claims are untrue according to people who actually design world record holding wings and winning wingsails.
If people use negative terms like "Ridicules debate.....People's mind was so fogged....no one even payed attention....these developers came to foolish conclusion....totally useless" then they can hardly complain if other people are negative towards their claims.
Kudos for the passion to innovate, however I agree. His dismissal of all that has gone before is the nail in his coffin. Also, Wingsails have been done many times before - rigid wings as well as softer ones very much like his. Dan Kaseler of Gaastra, Naish, Vandal, & Avanti built one very similar in concept for Naish back in the early 2000's.
www.olypen.com/dkaseler/inflatable.htm
even on this picture is very clear that Dan's sail is fully symmetrical. It is as good as flat plate profile with only difference it will endure pressure drag . If you put plastic bag on the stick, results will be adequate.
Select to expand quotegorgesailor said..Chris 249 said..
The designer of the wingsail is negative about other sailmakers and sailors in his marketing, so he can hardly complain if some people point out that some of his claims are untrue according to people who actually design world record holding wings and winning wingsails.
If people use negative terms like "Ridicules debate.....People's mind was so fogged....no one even payed attention....these developers came to foolish conclusion....totally useless" then they can hardly complain if other people are negative towards their claims.
Kudos for the passion to innovate, however I agree. His dismissal of all that has gone before is the nail in his coffin. Also, Wingsails have been done many times before - rigid wings as well as softer ones very much like his. Dan Kaseler of Gaastra, Naish, Vandal, & Avanti built one very similar in concept for Naish back in the early 2000's.
www.olypen.com/dkaseler/inflatable.htm
even on this picture is very clear that Dan's sail is fully symmetrical. It is as good as flat plate profile with only difference it will endure pressure drag . If you put plastic bag on the stick, results will be adequate.
