Select to expand quotekiteboy dave said...glendog said..
Because riding without jumping or tricking is flippin boring. This is a big circle convo. Hahaha but im not sold.
Good, don't foil.
Everyone is into something different, like Kemp & Dafish have said already.
I personally don't see any point in wakestyle, totally boring to me, but it won comps for a decade because it's technically difficult to land a triple spinny roll with double bar pass to blind. Even if it looks like every other wakestyle flippy spinny thing done 1m off the water. But I know other guys see that as the core of kiting, for them, so I don't see any point in knocking it. Whatever floats your boat.
But it's worth mentioning that there's a whole lot of styles of foiling emerging. Surf. Big air. Race. Speed (distinct from Race). Freestyle.
You can jump big because you have the ingredients: speed, load, and a built in ramp better than any TT pop.
But you can also do tricks if that's your cup of tea. Look at the kite flying in these vids, 3.5m kite in gusting 40kts.
Greg Drexler of BRM blows me away pushing freestyle foiling. Check here how he's flying it like a rev. I've never seen anyone do this in 15 years of kitesurfing.
Have a look at the transition at 2:20 - kite roll under on the water, there's 3 or 4 of them in the vid, it's deliberate. Again, totally unique.
Faaarkk offfff!! Those guys can absolutely shred. The kite control on that little white kite was epic. And the foils offs on the slinggy blew my mind. Thanks you for sharing. I think I'm gonna buy one tomorrow
I love how Greg does those tacks to toeside ( tack with no foot switch). Makes it look super easy, which it's not (for me anyways)
Good points here. I am cynical about fads and about zealots. I also have a surf-first attitude. But I can report that foiling is a nice addition to the quiver. It isn't "the answer!!!" or "going to change everything!!!", but it's a new challenge that can make those "meh" days fun again.
I took kite lessons in France on a family vacation in 2010 and saw a guy out on a foil. At that time, the only foiling in media was the Laird tow-in show. I thought it looked pretty wild, but figured it was out of reach. When I got home, someone had posted an ad for that same original carafino, for "cheap" (relative to the crazy $ new). A very rare fluke ... so I grabbed it, even before I could kite. It sat in the corner for 2 years, while in the meantime foiling took off in the kite racing world, then hit the mainstream.
Anyways, point is, that early carafino foil was a modified AirChair they use for waterskiing. Designed to ride at about a 30 degree angle like a water ski, tons of drag, very slow, easy to get up but low top end. Fun novelty to be up above the water, but that's about as far as it went. No one would call that a game changer. But I upgraded to a stringy foil (similar to zeeko black/white or carver wing) and it's insane how different it is. Like a knife through butter, no resistance in the water, turns crazy fast, and holds as much speed as I realistically want. This is different enough, and offers enough new capabilities, that you could spend a whole bunch of time and still have stuff to learn.
I am finding my main foil interest is carving swells downwind, it's a super cool feeling. I want to carve tacks like Greg Drexler ... though the gymnastics elude me. On any given day, I have foil, twintip, and surfboard on the beach, and ideally use all 3, mix it up, keep it fun. But if there's breaking waves, no question, I'll be on my surfboard.
Bottom line, if you have a few extra $ sitting around, definitely a fun new toy. Or review the DIY threads for cheap options!
PS
Boards: I agree, most of the focus on boards is nonsense. People are using wakeskates, skimboards, and surfboards, makes little difference for non-racers.
Roller: foilers are NOT the rollerblades of kiting, that is twintippers, especially in boots! Foilers are the unicyclists of kiting. Complete with red clown nose and horn. 
Definetly some artistic lines being drawn by some! How good is some of the drone footage around nowadays. I don't get how you can drop your power source ie kite or tow in and ride an ocean swell. Isn't the water in front going up the face plus the foil has so little area to be pushed. ??? Can you do that once the wave has broken or does the turbulence in front of a wave stop you? Can you only ride the tip of a wave not a trough?
Select to expand quotekiteboy dave said..
Greg Drexler of BRM blows me away pushing freestyle foiling.
Greg would definitely have to be the George Greenough of kite surfing (or foiling.. confused now).
Who's GG you young grommets ask?
Enjoy and praise the Lord himself! (maybe this should have been posted in the Longboard group)
Select to expand quoteMiser said..glendog said..
Never tried it so i dunno but to me it looks boring as bat sh!t. I get the learning part would be not so boring but seriously once your comfortable riding around is it honestly still fun? Or do people just do it because you can ride in hardly any wind? Seriously i recon id rather just go for a swim.
1. spend 3k$ on something
2. hurt yourself
3. eventually get the hang of it becuase you spent 3k$ n something
4. find it boreing but tell everyone its the future because you have to sell the damn thing now
5. claim its good for health because your market is unhealthy rich people
Where are these people that buy foils, hate them and then sell them? Where are they on this thread and where are they in general?
Out of the hundreds of stoked dudes I've heard of one that was "Meh" after he tried it.
The only people on this thread bagging the foils are the non foiling dudes.
Select to expand quoteeppo said..
Wanna try it before I comment on whether it's good or not. Maybe some of us should do the same hey.
Recon you would love it Eppo. It will literally pull your low end of super powered days down 8 knots.
You would be able to take your airstyle to the foil in winds that otherwise would see you supping or mowing with no jumps or just sitting on the beach waiting for fun winds getting pissed off that its not windy enough.
Then also a choppy ****ty day becomes an epic flatwater session. No more chop. Chop is gone! I hate chop. No more grinding upwind endlessly. Upwind is fun and fast and stupid angles.
Like others have said choose the tool for the job.
Sweet waves go ride a surfboard,
Epic wind go boost until your scratch gods eyes out,
Epic flat water do your airstyle.
****ty average wind, crappy chop foil like fark.
Yeh mn just waiting for someone to come down and offer me one to try. I'm past chasing anything lol. One day....
right now my average days are teaching my son. he stayed upwind today...fck yeh.
Select to expand quotePlummet said...eppo said..
Wanna try it before I comment on whether it's good or not. Maybe some of us should do the same hey.
Recon you would love it Eppo. It will literally pull your low end of super powered days down 8 knots.
You would be able to take your airstyle to the foil in winds that otherwise would see you supping or mowing with no jumps or just sitting on the beach waiting for fun winds getting pissed off that its not windy enough.
Then also a choppy ****ty day becomes an epic flatwater session. No more chop. Chop is gone! I hate chop. No more grinding upwind endlessly. Upwind is fun and fast and stupid angles.
Like others have said choose the tool for the job.
Sweet waves go ride a surfboard,
Epic wind go boost until your scratch gods eyes out,
Epic flat water do your airstyle.
****ty average wind, crappy chop foil like fark.
This from the guy who said regularly foil riders were just in an overly excited honeymoon phase :D
Select to expand quotePlummet said..
Miser said..
glendog said..
Never tried it so i dunno but to me it looks boring as bat sh!t. I get the learning part would be not so boring but seriously once your comfortable riding around is it honestly still fun? Or do people just do it because you can ride in hardly any wind? Seriously i recon id rather just go for a swim.
1. spend 3k$ on something
2. hurt yourself
3. eventually get the hang of it becuase you spent 3k$ n something
4. find it boreing but tell everyone its the future because you have to sell the damn thing now
5. claim its good for health because your market is unhealthy rich people
Where are these people that buy foils, hate them and then sell them? Where are they on this thread and where are they in general?
Out of the hundreds of stoked dudes I've heard of one that was "Meh" after he tried it.
The only people on this thread bagging the foils are the non foiling dudes.
first foiled in nelson 3 years ago been foiling since in oz
dont pay for kite equipment so im not endentured one way or the other.
you have met hundreds of dudes in the naki plumbobs? that were stroked?
bagalagadagdag gag a magagagdag
Select to expand quoteKamikuza said..Plummet said...
This from the guy who said regularly foil riders were just in an overly excited honeymoon phase :D
I never bagged hydrofoiling and always wanted to do it. And yes until you have done it to death its the honeymoon phase. Select to expand quoteeppo said..
Yeh mn just waiting for someone to come down and offer me one to try. I'm past chasing anything lol. One day....
right now my average days are teaching my son. he stayed upwind today...fck yeh.
Stoked about your boy going upwind! Kiting time is now family time! You cunning bastard!Select to expand quoteeppo said..
Yeh mn just waiting for someone to come down and offer me one to try. I'm past chasing anything lol. One day....
right now my average days are teaching my son. he stayed upwind today...fck yeh.
My kids aren't showing interest. yet.
You can't try It like having a go on a different board. Like when you first started kitesurfing you have to commit to a learning phase before the true glory reveals its self. Select to expand quoteMiser said..
You have met hundreds of dudes in the naki plumbobs? that were stroked?
No. I've seen one tourist foiling I the naki and that's. I'm talking about stoked internt warriors like dudes on this thread.
My, we have a short memory...and I don't think you understand what honeymoon means 
Select to expand quoteKamikuza said..
My, we have a short memory...and I don't think you understand what honeymoon means
its that period where the sheep still thinks you are just helping it over the fence
or just for you kuza
its that period when you still believe the local ladys love you because you are great and not just because they have for thousands of years been convinced they are superior race and they only see you as a cheeky bad boy gimmick or expensive oddity. that being said it helps your rivals are mostly living in parents living room playing super mario and going to bed with their female pillows.
Select to expand quoteKamikuza said..
My, we have a short memory...and I don't think you understand what honeymoon means
Find me some examples then. Link some threads. Put your money where your mouth is and prove your heckling is correct and not just another trolling attempt.
Select to expand quotejuandesooka said..
Roller: foilers are NOT the rollerblades of kiting, that is twintippers, especially in boots!
Go pull the other one mate.
Foiling is just a craze. It'll never last. They'll try it and maybe have one for light wind days. As soon as the wind gets stronger they'l be back on their windsurfers ...
I gave it a go but in the end found myself wanting to get on my surfboard. I was still in the learning phase but I could get up and go back and forth. I just didn't want to commit the hours needed to progress when I had more fun on my surfboard. It was real fun though at the beginning though and I don't think it's just a craze, just depends on your taste.
Viewing from the outside foiling seems a lot like tantric sex,.. you spend a long time to perfect this art which gives you a feeling greater than any other form. Me personally,. I would rather **** like a porn star!
Select to expand quoteGazuki said...
Viewing from the outside foiling seems a lot like tantric sex,.. you spend a long time to perfect this art which gives you a feeling greater than any other form. Me personally,. I would rather **** like a porn star!
You do know this is a kitesurfing forum right?
Select to expand quoteGazuki said...
Viewing from the outside foiling seems a lot like tantric sex,.. you spend a long time to perfect this art which gives you a feeling greater than any other form. Me personally,. I would rather **** like a porn star!
What if you could be a tantric porn star?
Select to expand quoteGazuki said..
Viewing from the outside foiling seems a lot like tantric sex,.. you spend a long time to perfect this art which gives you a feeling greater than any other form. Me personally,. I would rather **** like a porn star!
so you're all smoke and mirrors then ?? :)
Select to expand quoteGazuki said..
Viewing from the outside foiling seems a lot like tantric sex,.. you spend a long time to perfect this art which gives you a feeling greater than any other form. Me personally,. I would rather **** like a porn star!
why on earth do you want to s hit like a porn star? just one big piece clogs the dunny
Select to expand quoteMiser said..Kamikuza said..
My, we have a short memory...and I don't think you understand what honeymoon means
its that period where the sheep still thinks you are just helping it over the fence
or just for you kuza
its that period when you still believe the local ladys love you because you are great and not just because they have for thousands of years been convinced they are superior race and they only see you as a cheeky bad boy gimmick or expensive oddity. that being said it helps your rivals are mostly living in parents living room playing super mario and going to bed with their female pillows.
Um . . . ohhh-kay.
the worm has turned.
You will notice in all those comments I never bagged hydrofoiling. I simply stated that for the most part most if not all of the people commenting are still in the honeymoon phase. Now that may or may not be a perfect term for what I mean. But I stand by those statements.
If you have exhausted your progression with what ever other sports or disciplines. The new sport or discipline will be more fun, more enjoyable, you will want to do it more often while you have that steep learning curve compared to the other sports you are very competent at.
It is only when you have reached equal saturation and equivalent skill levels can you compare which sports you actually enjoy more.
It took me 15 years to reach that point mountain biking, 6 years for landboarding, 7 years of regular kitesurfing, 3 years for longboard skating,
How long will it take for the hydrofoil? I don't know.
Shall we change the term so your virgina doesn't get a wide on about it when mentioned?
Lets call it "progression saturation"
Until you have reached your progression saturation of the new sport your wont truly know it fits in with the other sports you have already reached progression saturation with.
Progress saturation...man I'm still learning new tricks (that I generally can't do) on my supposedly prehistoric twin tip...
Select to expand quotePlummet said...
You will notice in all those comments I never bagged hydrofoiling. I simply stated that for the most part most if not all of the people commenting are still in the honeymoon phase. Now that may or may not be a perfect term for what I mean. But I stand by those statements.
If you have exhausted your progression with what ever other sports or disciplines. The new sport or discipline will be more fun, more enjoyable, you will want to do it more often while you have that steep learning curve compared to the other sports you are very competent at.
It is only when you have reached equal saturation and equivalent skill levels can you compare which sports you actually enjoy more.
It took me 15 years to reach that point mountain biking, 6 years for landboarding, 7 years of regular kitesurfing, 3 years for longboard skating,
How long will it take for the hydrofoil? I don't know.
Shall we change the term so your virgina doesn't get a wide on about it when mentioned?
Lets call it "progression saturation"
Until you have reached your progression saturation of the new sport your wont truly know it fits in with the other sports you have already reached progression saturation with.
You didn't read my post did you 
S'alright, even with the basics like the three R's, not everyone reaches "progression saturation" at a level that leaves them competent...
Select to expand quoteeppo said..
Progress saturation...man I'm still learning new tricks (that I generally can't do) on my supposedly prehistoric twin tip...
That's the advantage of being a trickster. You can entertain yourself for years on slightly different variations of the same thing.
I've tried to embrace tricks but i'm not a trickster in any of my sports. I call myself a terrain rider. I love aggressive riding and jumping in interesting terrain. That could be a gnarly root infested mountain track on my mtb. dicing it out in big waves down the coast. Punting sweet jumps when its super windy, ripping the dunes in the kite buggy or now figuring out how the hell to ride 2m swell on a hydrofoil!
The downside. There is a limit to my progression in each sport. Thus I keep adding additional types of terrain riding when I find my personal limits of the previous sports.
Yeh I kind of get ya...trust me we get all sorts of 'terrain' on the Wild West coast...
I suppose my gig is mastering what I do, but I am fastidious (to my detriment) about things.
Slight variations....not really. a darkslide is very different to a Jesus walk. a simple tweaked say tail grab jump jump is very different to a couple of tail grab tweaked vertical forward rolls at high altitude. A powered loop...is very different to even a high altitude loop with a late back roll. Rotational board offs are very different to static jump board offs...then add in to blind work. Doing this in the waves adds an entirely new set of skills. Different transitions are not slight variations.
All these categories take a very different approach. The master of variations is someone like Airstyle Toby...he just takes it waaaaayyy to far.
But sometimes i I wish I was more casual and try more sports, even if I only got to a certain level (reached that saturation point as you call it) for sure.
I never get bored even after 17 seasons. Always challenged. always something else to master. Suppose I'd rather be pretty good at one thing than average at a lot of things...
I think a better way to put it, is when people reach that risk/reward ceiling. When the risk to injury starts to far outweigh the reward. But this is a subjective thing.
To say people reach a saturation point, nah I don't buy that. They just have reached a point where there balls become become smaller than their logical self preservation state of mind. Must admit I'm getting close to that point however.
