I have a 2013 10m C4 with the new C4 bar and I haven't had any issues with a short depower throw. In fact I don't see a huge amount of difference between this and my 2012 7m C4 flown on a standard bar. I haven't yet flown my 13 C4 on the older bar.
Anyway, there isn't much pull if you stack. Kite depowers just fine and is pretty forgiving. C4 is also much more on/off in terms of power compared to the edge which just wants to keep going even when you sheeted right out.
As far as big airs are concerned, C4 jumps high and I'm sure in right hands will easily get you as high as the edge but you don't get the same float. It tends to drop you a bit and soft landings are bit harder to time right than with the edge. But I think I easily reach the same height as I do with my edges (i dont boost super high, prob around 6-7 meters, which feels like 20 :D).
If I want a big boosting session on a TT I'll take one of my edges out.
But if I'm riding SB or just want general all round fun on TT I'll use my C4s. Way better for downlooping and more forgiving.
Well, just had the opportunity of testing again.
This time in winds ranging from an average of 14 to 18 with gusts hitting up to about 28 knots.
So average winds around the low end of the 11m C4 and gusts in the high end figures. I weigh about 72 Kg.
To be honest, these were pretty challenging conditions. Pretty high lumpy chop combined with being underpowered, near overpowered and back again in a couple of seconds.
especially the shorter, violent bursts of wind came through pretty hard on the C4, direct feeling and great communication of the kite has a downside too :D
even though the conditions were far from perfect, I never felt out of control. The short throw depower offered enough range to keep me safe and kiting. The on/off feeling talked about in the previous posts did make it a bit more challenging to "absorb" the gusts manually in perfectly smooth manner. The kite never got unstable, but it doesn't like to fly fully depowered. Controlling the power from the board and lengthening the depower strap was the way to go.
I surely struggled with the timing for nice jumps, in general, lift seemed very vertical and quite "sudden". Redirection should be timed more precise for a nice landing, indeed, the kite tends to drop you a bit. If you jump and the wind lulls.... Be ready for impact :D
Downlooping the kite is usually nice and powerfull, but not overbearing. Very controllable. However, there was this time a big gust hit just before I initiated the loop, the following moments may best be described as ..sswWWOOOOOOSH! Zero to sixty in 0,5 seconds!
Pop was great, though hard to test with the varying windspeed. Often aborting because wind dropped or increased.
For the 1 to 2 meter waves, the C4 was actually quite nice to surf with.
I'm still on a limb whether this kite is for me. The conditions of today would have been a lot smoother on a Cat or Bandit. Jumping would have been way easier and loftier for sure. However there is this feeling of getting a better kitecontrol and boardtechnique in the process of using a C4 rather than something more easy going. Obviously, the techniques I learnt to jump, work on a delta-shape kite, little edging, half assed timing, pull the bar and go big. The question is whether one wants to invest in getting such "better" techniques, developed from flying a C-shaped kite. For one-day-a-month-easy fun-kiters, I would expect the answer to be negative.
Only thing left is to figure out where I fit in.... Now, but also in 2 or 3 years....
I might struggle a bit with it now, but it MIGHT make me a better kiter down the line,... Tough call.
Interesting.. I had/have exactly the same dilemma/doubts. I learnt on an old C kite. Kites evoluted, ended up on hybrids. But last year or so went back to an old C kite just to see the difference and discovered I couldn't jump on them anymore at all. Technique (however little there was) gone. Now decided to buy a 2012 C4 which i haven't received yet. Expect it to be difficult/disappointing at first but surely technique should return quick enough ? After that nothing but positive surely.
nothing difficult about flying or jumping a 2012 c4. its easy peasy. just fly in actively.
2013 is wake style specific. its not longer a kite for the masses. bar pressure is too heavy for my liking and it sits further back in the window for my liking. its still jumps and flys nice but if for me and my stuffed elbows. far to heavy bar pressure.
Got the 9m riding in some good winds lately, at first i tought it was too much wakestylish because the kite sits a bit deeper.
Of course some people don't like the heavier barpressure, i really needed some sessions to get used to the new C4 (i've had all years C4's) and the 2013 is different but in good ways one's you get to know em.
I have the C4 bar with 23m lines and feels solid and very stable, more barpressure (i even shortened the steering lines to max) ,still jumps easy and higher with more hangtime and landings are noticeable softer !
Kiteloops are more agressive and goes lower because it sits deeper + the shorter lines the kite shoots up very fast, the depower throw is shorter and i noticed there still is some power left when riding in the upper wind range of that size kite.
I would say it still is a great allround kite that boosts big and gives a bigger pull on kiteloops than the 2012 C4.
I don't think you should change to a catalyst if you want a 2013 kite and got an older C4, catalyst may be too friendly for your style.
mmm I don't know. Got an a C4 2011 the other day and my 2013 Cat....yeh maybe a touch friendlier, but not much in it. But the Cat develops better apparent wind and is better in the surf. But the C4 2011 is no slouch. What a great kite.
Tomorrow final testing day for the C4, one thing still bugging me is the punchyness in gusty conditions. Would it make sense to have an 11m C4 and combine it with an 8m Catalyst for smoother high end ?
And if going this route, would you argue it hinders the riders development since they are two different beasts ?
Pros and Cons ?
yes a c4, cat combo is good thats what i have. al be it 2012 10m c4 and 8m cat.
the punchyness of the c4 is fun in the low end but a pain 30+ the cats gust munching ease is a boring in the mid range but glorious in the gusts.
that said id go 10 edge, 8 cat now in the 2013 range.
No different style kites don't inhibet your perfance. it infact makes you a better flyer. also i find you have different requirements for a kite as the wind speed increases. why fly a kite design that rocks in lighter winds but sucks arrse in high winds?
that said id go 10 edge, 8 cat now in the 2013 range...
yeh me to...
That being said that 2011 C4 (8m) my bro picked up, damn that's a good kite. We were out in 20 to 30...gusty as hell and my bro reckons he could easily take it to 35. Man he was getting some serious height on that thing!
yep serious height by also very punchy. i find the cat way more fun in those winds. particularily in the waves.
man my england is bad today.
Yeh and chuck in that little bit more C this years it really is a dynamic kite in those winds for sure.
hey guys sorry if this has already been asked. I have 2011 c4 can i use the same bar on 2013? is there any changes in the bar this year? sorry im a bit behind.
Select to expand quoteMRPAPY said..
hey guys sorry if this has already been asked. I have 2011 c4 can i use the same bar on 2013? is there any changes in the bar this year? sorry im a bit behind.
You can use the 2011 bar for sure, I've done it and the 2013 kite works fine for most riders. Advanced riders will prefer the shoter lines (23M) and shorter bar (45cm) and shorter throw (about 12cm less from memory) of a 2013 bar, plus the 2013 bar has a larger chicken loop for easier unhooking and re-hooking.
For anyone reading this topic and wondering what happened,.. I bought a 11/8 set of 2013 C4's
Haven't tried the 8 yet, but after a small adaptation period I'm starting to love the 11... If I could marry it, I would.
Well after 11 pages....maybe this thread will finally soon die :-( Why? If Andy Yates has his quiver for sale on seabreeze you'd have to assume he has either changed brands or more likely, has his new set of 2014 C4's as I type.
After living with mine 2013 C4 for a while now and only having cats and a 2011 edge to compare to it is my favourite ride yet-to be technical, it's simply the funnest kite I've ridden, gut wrenching boost and powerful turns, the end!
WHERES THE WIND PERTH
i can start a 2014 topic if you guys want?
still loving my 2013's, only thing i might upgrade is the bar
Select to expand quoteBig eeeZeee said..
i can start a 2014 topic if you guys want?
still loving my 2013's, only thing i might upgrade is the bar
Definitely time for a 2014 C4 thread. I reckon we could get it to 20 pages, and 10 before it's even released.
I respectfully request that Eppo and Plummet leave it alone though - Edgeheads.
Select to expand quoteBig eeeZeee said..
only thing i might upgrade is the bar
Ive been saying that for the last 3 years 
Select to expand quotedjdojo said..Big eeeZeee said..
i can start a 2014 topic if you guys want?
still loving my 2013's, only thing i might upgrade is the bar
Definitely time for a 2014 C4 thread. I reckon we could get it to 20 pages, and 10 before it's even released.
I respectfully request that Eppo and Plummet leave it alone though - Edgeheads.
Your request will be honoured. By me anyway. Yep it's moved well an truly beyond my field of vision. Go you good things...
OK Big eeeZeee, crank that new thread up. If it was me I'd call it the 2014 C4 speculation spectacular, but as an Ozone team rider no longer on C4s, but who may be lured back to that deep-sitting goodness, I feel too many cross currents of vested interest to take a credible stand as an OP.
But if a hobbit happens to leak me a pic of a prototype I'll be sure to post. (Not that that would happen - FBI and inter-dimensional diplomacy n all.)
Anyone using a 2013 C4 bar on a 2011/2012 C4? Does it change the feel or effect the performance much vs the contact bar? I like the idea of the shorter depower, the contact bar always had just a little too much for me.
Select to expand quoteHybrid_Z said..
Anyone using a 2013 C4 bar on a 2011/2012 C4? Does it change the feel or effect the performance much vs the contact bar? I like the idea of the shorter depower, the contact bar always had just a little too much for me.
i use a 2013 c4 bar on a 2011 7m c4. works fine. nicer with the shorter lines too
I agree, used my 2012 12m on the c4 bar the other day and loved it. Felt more like my 9 on the contact bar.
Select to expand quoteHybrid_Z said..
Anyone using a 2013 C4 bar on a 2011/2012 C4? Does it change the feel or effect the performance much vs the contact bar? I like the idea of the shorter depower, the contact bar always had just a little too much for me.
Works fine, and the reverse works ok too, but I think I prefer the 2013 bar, shorter throw. I have 2 new bars with me now, drop in the sydney store and you will see what they look like. The bars I have are not the final final production bars, but they are very close and I know whats changing. Back in Sydney in 24 hrs.
