Forums > Windsurfing General

Trailer build - DIY vs pay to get one built

Reply
Created by Orange Whip > 9 months ago, 6 Jul 2019
Stretchy
WA, 938 posts
7 Jul 2019 8:11PM
Thumbs Up

I bought a standard single axle 8 x 5 trailer with with cage. It was then a relatively simple job to cover the top and front with sheet metal. Gear is locked away and protected from sun and rain from above, but not the sides. It gets rolled into the shed at home.




Jacko51
SA, 219 posts
7 Jul 2019 9:46PM
Thumbs Up

Before


After









Used 25 x 25 tube welded together with a $100 Aldi gasless mig welder. Skinned with aluminium composite panel stuck to frame using
3M VHB Tape. Finished off with angle trim fixed with long rivets to panel/ frame. ( Photo wont rotate )

ballast
QLD, 500 posts
8 Jul 2019 9:52AM
Thumbs Up



30 something year old trailer that is in it third incarnation. Originally built by a friend of a friend as a windurfing/camping trailer with a canvas enclosure on the frame. I had a cheap Chinese camper trailer tent on it for around 5 years. that's when I fitted the new axle and bigger wheels.
Nose cone is fabricated from timber by myself as I have zero welding skills. Marine ply attached to original frame. And a split door on the back using old tail gate as well. One of my sailing mates has a full door, which I considered doing, but he needs to open it before he parks because of bollards, then can't lock it after. Great to hide from a shower under, but a bit of a PITA I think.
Has survived 4 years in this form, including an accident which wrote of my tow vehicle.
Inside racks are 1 inch square aluminium tube with those plastic joints from Bunnings. Not ideal, but easy to use. A few have cracked over time and needed to be replaced. Couple of dollars each, so no biggy.
I would suggest keep it as short as you can. I can fit a 3 boards 10 sails and 3 booms etc in this and I can park in a standard car park at my regular spot. Longer than 295 needs to go on top. Was built to suit that size at the time.
Best things are Galv frame and marine ply, no rust issues at all. No chucking salty gear in or on my car. No trying to remember everything I need. Pretty secure at the beach and at home.
Would change a few things if I had the time or motivation, but for now does me just fine.
Trust me if I can do one, anyone could.

Mark _australia
WA, 22285 posts
8 Jul 2019 8:33AM
Thumbs Up

Jacko / ballast spot on that's what I'm talking about.

Peter, I was not ever talking about building a whole trailer, rather just an enclosure. No need for 3mm steel, and $500 covers it easily if one shops cleverly and/or uses secondhand signwhite sheeting. No way would I suggest somebody just goes ahead thinking they can build what you or Kato do.

eckas
NSW, 323 posts
8 Jul 2019 2:04PM
Thumbs Up

I hybridised, custom-building a removable windsurfing enclosure that sat on a stock 8 x 5 box trailer. Rego is therefore just the flat $66 p/a without inspections. Enclosure made from welded Steel RHS, aluminium composite panel etc as per most examples you are seeing. White-side-out ACP is awesome at keeping boards cool, being both reflective and modestly insulative. The enclosure is removable (without having to remove the W/S gear) via 4 manual hydraulic jacks, allowing access to the box trailer for more conventional trailer duties. I built out over the wheel-arches, but I must say the extra rearward visibility created by the small cut-in above the wheel arches but beneath the box his very handy for rearward visibility of cars behind me. I think total cost was around $1600 (on top of the stock trailer), comprising steel RHS, Aluminium Composite Panel, Plywood for the floor, fittings (hinges), fixings (rivets), aluminium trims to finish off around the ACP, vinyl liner to contain dripping salt water. Not as cheap as I thought it would be, but the perfect customisation to what I wanted to carry (including a kayak, 11"11' SUP, formula board and 6 other boards) is priceless.

I posted a fairly comprehensive update on the build at the time on the forums if it's of interest to you.

olskool
QLD, 2445 posts
8 Jul 2019 2:43PM
Thumbs Up

HIJACK ! Ballast, thats the BEST WOD ive seen! So practical, will fit in a skipbin perfectly.

peterowensbabs
NSW, 459 posts
8 Jul 2019 6:16PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
Mark _australia said..
Jacko / ballast spot on that's what I'm talking about.

Peter, I was not ever talking about building a whole trailer, rather just an enclosure. No need for 3mm steel, and $500 covers it easily if one shops cleverly and/or uses secondhand signwhite sheeting. No way would I suggest somebody just goes ahead thinking they can build what you or Kato do.


Ok My misunderstanding!

peterowensbabs
NSW, 459 posts
8 Jul 2019 6:41PM
Thumbs Up

One other thing Im feeling is that here in NSW as with so many other things we are over regulated and over controlled. Here draw bar minimum has to be 50x50x6 Angle (hence my comments about penetration) as a for instance. To be legal the trailer must not be altered in any way from its original compliance inspection. E.g if it was a box and you add a cage it's supposed to get a now compliance cert, or the addition of any welded bolted or permanently fixed on fitting. So bolting on a tradies side door tool box, need a new cert. Last January just up the top of the hill from me (Roseville Bridge for the sydney siders) during the last week of double demerits they did a blitz on tradie utes and trailers over 400 fines issued over 3 mornings for unsafe loads (no net/straps) and un compliant alterations to vehicles and trailers. Mate lost his licence in one hit trailer ute and load trifecta. Looks like you get away with much more in other states.

kato
VIC, 3391 posts
8 Jul 2019 7:20PM
Thumbs Up

Never used EA for a drawbar.Not much Torsion strength in angle. 70x38x2.5 RHS for light trailer
90x50x3 RHS for a heavier one
All Dura gal

olskool
QLD, 2445 posts
8 Jul 2019 7:51PM
Thumbs Up

Built a few duragal boat trailers. Only ever use box sections. Wouldnt even consider anything less than 100x50x6. Its amazing just how much thatll flex with only 1200kg load.

kato
VIC, 3391 posts
8 Jul 2019 8:24PM
Thumbs Up

^^^^^ Yes correct , but there are other structural elements in play not just the box section. It's not like a boat trailer with no support. Built right the frame will supply additional strength and control the flex.

ballast
QLD, 500 posts
8 Jul 2019 8:42PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
olskool said..
HIJACK ! Ballast, thats the BEST WOD ive seen! So practical, will fit in a skipbin perfectly.


Yeah Olskool. I modified it so I could store it in the trailer. Wouldn't want it getting stolen.

Ian K
WA, 4048 posts
8 Jul 2019 6:45PM
Thumbs Up

The other theory is that if a chassis can flex from one end to the other stresses are not concentrated as they would be if there was a sharp transition from stiff to flexy. Check this video showing how the Landcruiser chassis is flexing from one end to the other under the rubber mounts loosely connecting it to the body. Landcruisers last forever but the axles, springs and drawbars fall off trailers after a fraction of the punishment. Lack of shockers on the typical trailer don't help. The specialist off road trailers, having shockers and soft, long-travel suspension are built to last but they cost a bomb.

FormulaNova
WA, 14537 posts
8 Jul 2019 8:11PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
peterowensbabs said..
One other thing Im feeling is that here in NSW as with so many other things we are over regulated and over controlled. Here draw bar minimum has to be 50x50x6 Angle (hence my comments about penetration) as a for instance. To be legal the trailer must not be altered in any way from its original compliance inspection. E.g if it was a box and you add a cage it's supposed to get a now compliance cert, or the addition of any welded bolted or permanently fixed on fitting. So bolting on a tradies side door tool box, need a new cert. Last January just up the top of the hill from me (Roseville Bridge for the sydney siders) during the last week of double demerits they did a blitz on tradie utes and trailers over 400 fines issued over 3 mornings for unsafe loads (no net/straps) and un compliant alterations to vehicles and trailers. Mate lost his licence in one hit trailer ute and load trifecta. Looks like you get away with much more in other states.



Are you sure about the draw bar minimum specs? Is there even a specific document that describes this stuff other than the general RMS document that describes the fitting of lights, reflectors, and the like?

I registered a home built trailer from scratch a few years back, and the guy that inspected it was a guy that did a lot of caravans and trailers. He seemed to apply more of a 'the workmanship looks good, and the general construction appears sound' approach to it. At the time, the requirements called for rated/stamped chain for the safety chain, which was almost impossible to get, but he accepted the non-rated chain and argued that it was more than sufficient for a safety chain. (Me, I am one of those people that prefer two chains... just in case.)

I used RHS for the drawbar and from memory it was 50x75 at 3mm, and it was fine. I don't even know how you would compare angle to RHS and argue whether one is stronger or not.

This guy was pretty spot on. When I mentioned thinking about going home and trying to drop the weight below the magic 250kgs, he advised me not to bother as a trailer this size was always heavier than 250kgs and I wouldn't be achieving much. In retrospect, I might have registered it as a flat platform instead of sides, which would have kept the weight down.

I am also not sure about your comments about being able to get good welds from home equipment. Granted, my crappy cigweld mig is meant to use a 15amp circuit, it welds fine. I would love to have some decent gear though and I am sure it makes things easier.

Ian K
WA, 4048 posts
8 Jul 2019 9:09PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote

FormulaNova said..

I don't even know how you would compare angle to RHS and argue whether one is stronger or not.



Curiosity got the better of me and I did a little more googling. It looks like the box section vs. C section frame debate has been going forever with no clear winner. (OK not angle but maybe half way between). Ford and GM only recently went to box sections on the full sized utes whereas the Toyota Tundra and Tacomas have gone to C section.
www.treadmagazine.com/features/open-c-versus-boxed/

peterowensbabs
NSW, 459 posts
9 Jul 2019 9:32AM
Thumbs Up

FormulaNova said..

peterowensbabs said..
One other thing Im feeling is that here in NSW as with so many other things we are over regulated and over controlled. Here draw bar minimum has to be 50x50x6 Angle (hence my comments about penetration) as a for instance. To be legal the trailer must not be altered in any way from its original compliance inspection. E.g if it was a box and you add a cage it's supposed to get a now compliance cert, or the addition of any welded bolted or permanently fixed on fitting. So bolting on a tradies side door tool box, need a new cert. Last January just up the top of the hill from me (Roseville Bridge for the sydney siders) during the last week of double demerits they did a blitz on tradie utes and trailers over 400 fines issued over 3 mornings for unsafe loads (no net/straps) and un compliant alterations to vehicles and trailers. Mate lost his licence in one hit trailer ute and load trifecta. Looks like you get away with much more in other states.




Are you sure about the draw bar minimum specs? Is there even a specific document that describes this stuff other than the general RMS document that describes the fitting of lights, reflectors, and the like?

I registered a home built trailer from scratch a few years back, and the guy that inspected it was a guy that did a lot of caravans and trailers. He seemed to apply more of a 'the workmanship looks good, and the general construction appears sound' approach to it. At the time, the requirements called for rated/stamped chain for the safety chain, which was almost impossible to get, but he accepted the non-rated chain and argued that it was more than sufficient for a safety chain. (Me, I am one of those people that prefer two chains... just in case.)

I used RHS for the drawbar and from memory it was 50x75 at 3mm, and it was fine. I don't even know how you would compare angle to RHS and argue whether one is stronger or not.

This guy was pretty spot on. When I mentioned thinking about going home and trying to drop the weight below the magic 250kgs, he advised me not to bother as a trailer this size was always heavier than 250kgs and I wouldn't be achieving much. In retrospect, I might have registered it as a flat platform instead of sides, which would have kept the weight down.

I am also not sure about your comments about being able to get good welds from home equipment. Granted, my crappy cigweld mig is meant to use a 15amp circuit, it welds fine. I would love to have some decent gear though and I am sure it makes things easier.


Ok I may have been caught out as I was told the min draw bar is 50x50x6 but Yes RHS will always out last angle for durability and strength. We use a safety officer / auto engineer to clear all our on road stuff, some for stunt work, some for camera work (modified vehicles/roll over rams/camera mounts/remote driving positions/roll cages/Camera ports etc) and like your guy he uses common-sense but is still pretty sticky on the rules as he has to be covered for professional liability and he is who told me. Almost none of ours are able to be fully road registered only conditionally. With the massive down turn in our game and the rise of CGI its been years since we got to do a really exciting vehicle build.

Yes there are some documents - (more pencils stuck in eyes!)
I have not read them but have them on file for risk assessment docs references. I warn you they would not be very exciting reading.
www.legislation.gov.au/Details/F2007C00494/Html/Text
www.infrastructure.gov.au/vehicles/vehicle_regulation/bulletin/vsb1/vsb_01_b.aspx#anc_16

mathew
QLD, 2037 posts
9 Jul 2019 10:22AM
Thumbs Up

... move to a different state. Problem solved.

WA is windy in summer, VIC has Sandy Point, QLD has 25 degrees for most of the year.

olskool
QLD, 2445 posts
9 Jul 2019 11:10AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
mathew said..
... move to a different state. Problem solved.

WA is windy in summer, VIC has Sandy Point, QLD has 25 degrees for most of the year.



Sez the Transient Windsurfer Mathew. How do you do it? Whats the secret ? Youre not of the pension age.

FormulaNova
WA, 14537 posts
9 Jul 2019 9:50AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
mathew said..
... move to a different state. Problem solved.

WA is windy in summer, VIC has Sandy Point, QLD has 25 degrees for most of the year.


I tried to move to Vic back in 2008... just before the GFC hit, and I could not find a job anywhere! No one was hiring at all... except the job I had just left back in Sydney.

Do you want another GFC?

kato
VIC, 3391 posts
9 Jul 2019 12:40PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
olskool said..

mathew said..
... move to a different state. Problem solved.

WA is windy in summer, VIC has Sandy Point, QLD has 25 degrees for most of the year.




Sez the Transient Windsurfer Mathew. How do you do it? Whats the secret ? Youre not of the pension age.


Mat has a very understanding boss who has no idea of what state he is in. But his work keeps seeping down the phone lines

choco
SA, 4027 posts
9 Jul 2019 4:31PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
kato said..
^^^^^ Yes correct , but there are other structural elements in play not just the box section. It's not like a boat trailer with no support. Built right the frame will supply additional strength and control the flex.


I've seen your craftsmanship Kato



olskool
QLD, 2445 posts
9 Jul 2019 5:40PM
Thumbs Up

^^ Oooppsss!! Too many boards n gear?

FormulaNova
WA, 14537 posts
9 Jul 2019 4:47PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
choco said..
kato said..
^^^^^ Yes correct , but there are other structural elements in play not just the box section. It's not like a boat trailer with no support. Built right the frame will supply additional strength and control the flex.


I've seen your craftsmanship Kato





Cool, I went looking for that as well! With his special, articulating rear steering trailer. He should stick to the nail-gun. Maybe lash a 90x45 to it and nail it down?

kato
VIC, 3391 posts
9 Jul 2019 8:14PM
Thumbs Up

I was waiting for someone to post that .
The first time I've ever used "off the shelf" U bolts to fix the axel and springs together. I normally use HT bolts in a cage set up. The issue with U bolts and a square axel is the corners create a stress point . This is what failed when I was bouncing along the LG track to the point. It was a rough track last year. But it went back together with no issues or damage to the chassis.
I don't often use off the shelf products , preferring to build my own systems with know properties. Another learning experience

gmitton
SA, 1428 posts
12 Jul 2019 9:12PM
Thumbs Up











Mark _australia
WA, 22285 posts
13 Jul 2019 2:06AM
Thumbs Up

^^^ nice setup...... and that reminds me also
4ft wide

if it sits in the same wheel track as your vehicle it is sooo much more comfy on sand, no side to side wriggle as it tries to climb up a wheel rut (and the drag that comes with it).

Hard to find, but an 8x4 trailer to start building on is ideal

Orange Whip
QLD, 1044 posts
13 Jul 2019 7:04PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
gmitton said..











Nice trailer, thanks for posting. Did you build it yourself?

gmitton
SA, 1428 posts
14 Jul 2019 1:22AM
Thumbs Up

Had it built by a custom trailer maker. All aluminium and stainless but cost a bit. Been happy with it though. Hold 7 boards, 20 sails 5 booms and 10 masts. Took three designs to get it right though! Mark is right about the wheel tracks...

Chris249
357 posts
14 Jul 2019 2:34PM
Thumbs Up

Just a word of advice from a mate. If you DO spend time designing the perfect trailer; earning the money for the perfect trailer; getting the perfect trailer built at significant cost; then start off by measuring your driveway.

Apparently it's a really bad feeling to get your new and expensive pride and joy home and suddenly realise that you are either going to have to knock a wall down, or sell the trailer and get a new one built that is about 6" narrower but just as expensive. A true, sad and costly story.

musorianin
QLD, 581 posts
16 Jul 2019 12:44PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
olskool said..
HIJACK ! Ballast, thats the BEST WOD ive seen! So practical, will fit in a skipbin perfectly.


I assumed that was just so he could fit it in the trailer



Subscribe
Reply

Forums > Windsurfing General


"Trailer build - DIY vs pay to get one built" started by Orange Whip