Forums > Windsurfing General

Whats the Best Wagon?!?!?!

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Created by sflack > 9 months ago, 27 Apr 2008
CJW
NSW, 1717 posts
28 Apr 2008 8:58PM
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In VR/S the model hierarchy goes

Exec (base)
Acclaim
Berlina
I don't think they made the calais in a wagon in VR/S

Exec is pretty basic and in may or may not have aircon, depending on options.

Acclaim has aircon/power steer and cruise control with executive like trim

Berlina adds better trim and power windows over the acclaim.

I think VT was similar but somewhere around there they started renaming all the models so stuff like lumina, omega and everything in between etc appeared.

latedropeddy
VIC, 417 posts
28 Apr 2008 9:30PM
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I have a BA falcon wagon(petrol), i can fit my GO150, carve 111, 3 masts, 2 booms (longest is 200-250cm), 3 sails (biggest is a 8.5m) easily.
Only can carry 1 passenger (squashed in the front).

I would hate to be in an accident with all the gear in the car.

Im thinking of converting it to LPG, the tank will go in the spare wheel space, the spare wheel will then sit upright in the back on the driver side. With the gas conversion the rear wheel will take up a bit of space.

It has been a pretty reliable car besides the diff going at 80k, probably depreciate into your price bracket in 6 months

My next set up will be a big 4cyl and enclosed aero trailer - I hate the load/unload thing.

decrepit
WA, 12061 posts
28 Apr 2008 7:52PM
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Greenroom said...

Hey Decrep, have you tried taking the back seat out? Then you push the front passanger seat as far forward as it goes. Then wind it down as far as it goes. This allows you then to put the backrest of the back seat down. >>>>>>


Not sure I follow you here, I can put the backrest down fine with the rear squab still in place.
But I have thought about removing the rear seat all together, save a bit of weight, and give a bit more room, but I'd need to add a bar or something to support the front of the boards.

x sport guy
VIC, 110 posts
28 Apr 2008 9:55PM
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Rider5 said...

Get a commodore! my 94 VR(lexcen) cost 2k it chews 10 lires on a country road and 11.5 to 12 litres around town which I think is great for a 3.8 ltr. I disagree with the x sport guy 150 000 k's on a v6 is fine my last commodore had 290k on it when I sold it, body was rusty but the donk was fine. I think 150k is high for a 4cylinder. It's the rust that kills my cars, bloody salt spray.


yeah to fair i probably wasnt specific enough with the problems falcons and comms have.
its not so much the donk itself in BOTH cases, aussie six's are pretty tough, its just the accesories bolted to them, like power steering parts, air cons, cooling systems which as someone else said in falcons are guaranteed to expire between 150-200 ks, autos that havnt been REGULARLY serviced which when they go in both cases can cost as much to replace as the car is worth.
that all said theres not many cars from anywhere in the world other than comms and falcons that can comfortably seat 5 people and all their crap when going away, are cheap to service and maintain, can tow a boat/caravan/horsefloat etc and get 10litres / 100 kms (if ya dont lead foot it).

FormulaNova
WA, 14527 posts
28 Apr 2008 8:02PM
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decrepit said...

Greenroom said...

Hey Decrep, have you tried taking the back seat out? Then you push the front passanger seat as far forward as it goes. Then wind it down as far as it goes. This allows you then to put the backrest of the back seat down. >>>>>>


Not sure I follow you here, I can put the backrest down fine with the rear squab still in place.
But I have thought about removing the rear seat all together, save a bit of weight, and give a bit more room, but I'd need to add a bar or something to support the front of the boards.


On the VS and VR the rear headrest is a bit bulkier and makes it hard to push the back of the rear seat down. I think the VN and VP use slimmer headrests, which is probably why you can push the rear seat's back down all the way.

If you want to remove the base of the seat its a simple matter of sitting in between the front and rear seats and kneeing the rear squab until the clips come out and the seat can be taken out. It will take you all of 2 minutes. It won't save much weigh in itself though, but I think taking out the back wouldn't be worth the trouble as it won't get in the way either.

Go all the way and take out the front passenger seat too! :)




sflack
VIC, 574 posts
28 Apr 2008 10:11PM
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ka43 said...

Ive got a 2000 VT wagon. Best car Ive ever owned. It takes heaps of gear inside and is super reliable.
I can get 4 boards, masts down the centre, booms on top of masts and 5 sails in no worries. If the family is included then everything fits in except boards and booms on roof.
If you take the head rest off passenger seat, move it all the way forward and wind down its perfect.
Admittedly it does chew the gas being a 3.8l V6 but if you dont lead foot it its OK!!
The Fords lose space in the back with the spare standing up instead of under floor like Commodore.
Hope this helps.


Yeah im swinging this way at the moment... Just a few questions.. What special things did you get with it.. aka Air Bags, Air Con, Climate Control, Cruise Control etc etc

Also how much are they selling for these days and at what Kms... How much do you think they will be in a years time?

Cheers

sflack
VIC, 574 posts
28 Apr 2008 10:17PM
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And... not too sure if you answered it... BUT are you able to fit:
2 Boards
4 Sails 6.2 - 4.5
2 Booms
2 Masts 200cm each (two piece)
Plus a box of fins etc


WHILIST A PERSON IN THE PASSANGER SEAT?
or must it be folded down?

Cheers For all the replies fellas!

Rider5
WA, 567 posts
28 Apr 2008 9:28PM
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sflack said...

And... not too sure if you answered it... BUT are you able to fit:
2 Boards
4 Sails 6.2 - 4.5
2 Booms
2 Masts 200cm each (two piece)
Plus a box of fins etc


WHILIST A PERSON IN THE PASSANGER SEAT?
or must it be folded down?

Cheers For all the replies fellas!


I've had Gazza in the front seat, both our boards, 3 booms 3 masts 8 sails plus wetsuits, harnesses,etc munchies and drinks etc all inside easy. Just folded down the back seat 2 boards slide in between the 2 front seats.

check out forums.justcommodores.com.au/

landyacht
WA, 5921 posts
28 Apr 2008 9:56PM
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Look out for a Lexcen wagon (VP Commodore) with an extra seat in th back. My wife tried to take out a landcruiser in it and when they rebuilt it the windscreen leaked water onto the computer. $1000 each time we had a heavy rain, then the heater core, then the headgasket.............
The cooling system is supposed to get anticorrosion tablets when it is serviced but a mechanic friend told me they never put them in because the damn cars would never break down.
Oh , and NEVER jumpstart them with one of those jumper kits, It shocks the fuelpump INSIDE the fuel tank and the pump dies about 100kms later requiring the fuel tank to be dropped out of the car

nobody
NSW, 437 posts
29 Apr 2008 1:06AM
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You guys should just change the name of this thread to:
"Which Falcadore wagon?" or "Which Commodore Wagon?"

Sorry, I haven't read most of the posts, too "Commodorish" for me.

I would have thought the Camry wagon would be worth a look for reliability vs economy vs cost. Preferably manual.

landyacht said...

Look out for a Lexcen wagon (VP Commodore) with an extra seat in th back. My wife tried to take out a landcruiser in it and when they rebuilt it the windscreen leaked water onto the computer. $1000 each time we had a heavy rain, then the heater core, then the headgasket.............

As you probably know, one likely caused the other. Let me guess. After they finished the head gasket work the car never quite ran the same again?

The cooling system is supposed to get anticorrosion tablets when it is serviced but a mechanic friend told me they never put them in because the damn cars would never break down.

Wouldn't surprise me. I've heard bad things about dealer servicing like they are full of apprentices etc. There is a common term called "mechanicd". This refers to all the problems you get when you get the car back after it has been "fixed". Or when you go to work on your car later to find stripped threads etc.



nobody
NSW, 437 posts
29 Apr 2008 1:07AM
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choco said...

The way fuel prices are you can't beat this model for economy.




Is that why only rich people have them?

nobody
NSW, 437 posts
29 Apr 2008 1:09AM
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DavMen said...

Go Magna Wagon "better built" - the 3.0V6 actually uses less fuel thanits 2.5/4cyl.
post 1994 is best, no rust usually.

I'd get the latest model you can afford with the Magna. They got better as the years went on '98+ I've heard good things about.

nobody
NSW, 437 posts
29 Apr 2008 1:13AM
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FormulaNova said...

If you want to remove the base of the seat its a simple matter of sitting in between the front and rear seats and kneeing the rear squab until the clips come out and the seat can be taken out. It will take you all of 2 minutes. It won't save much weigh in itself though, but I think taking out the back wouldn't be worth the trouble as it won't get in the way either.

Go all the way and take out the front passenger seat too! :)


Is this legal?

nobody
NSW, 437 posts
29 Apr 2008 1:16AM
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Rider5 said...

Get a commodore! my 94 VR(lexcen) cost 2k it chews 10 lires on a country road and 11.5 to 12 litres around town which I think is great for a 3.8 ltr. I disagree with the x sport guy 150 000 k's on a v6 is fine my last commodore had 290k on it when I sold it, body was rusty but the donk was fine. I think 150k is high for a 4cylinder. It's the rust that kills my cars, bloody salt spray.

Most Jap 4 pots get to 300K these days (if serviced regularly). I don't usually start buying them until they've done 150K.

Greenroom
WA, 7608 posts
28 Apr 2008 11:38PM
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nobody said...

You guys should just change the name of this thread to:
"Which Falcadore wagon?" or "Which Commodore Wagon?"

Sounds like your just busting to start a "Which Camry" or "Which Magna" thread

nobody
NSW, 437 posts
29 Apr 2008 1:44AM
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No I just enjoy winding up people when its late and I'm tired. Might delete these posts in the morning when I'm thinking more sensibly. Going to sleep now.

Greenroom
WA, 7608 posts
28 Apr 2008 11:48PM
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Yeah me too
Looks like its almost 1am for you?

ka43
NSW, 3069 posts
29 Apr 2008 9:53AM
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If your looking at a VT or later make sure you get a "Series II". Most problems from when they changed the shape have been sorted. I got the basic Executive model.
Has power steering, air con, drivers airbag, power mirrors, trip computer.
They still have the Berlina nd Acclaim in that model.
I got it from a dealer that does ex-government cars. This was from a regional health service and they are strict on looking after the cars. It was immaculate and had only done 22,000 k's. Full service history etc. Been a very reliable car.
All I have done is new power steering and water pump. That was after I had added 100,000 k's to it.
Not sure of the prices these days but Im guessing 8-10k, prolly less.

Harrow
NSW, 4521 posts
29 Apr 2008 9:59AM
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Toyota Camry. Only trouble with them is that sometimes the engine can start to show subtle signs of wear after the first 400,000km.

sflack
VIC, 574 posts
29 Apr 2008 10:18AM
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ka43 said...

If your looking at a VT or later make sure you get a "Series II". Most problems from when they changed the shape have been sorted. I got the basic Executive model.
Has power steering, air con, drivers airbag, power mirrors, trip computer.
They still have the Berlina nd Acclaim in that model.
I got it from a dealer that does ex-government cars. This was from a regional health service and they are strict on looking after the cars. It was immaculate and had only done 22,000 k's. Full service history etc. Been a very reliable car.
All I have done is new power steering and water pump. That was after I had added 100,000 k's to it.
Not sure of the prices these days but Im guessing 8-10k, prolly less.


Yeah thats true, i was reading the problems about the VT etc, saying was a problem with the body, but in the later models (series 2) they had fixed them etc... What was the name of the company you went through, do they have one in Victoria?

Cheers

sflack
VIC, 574 posts
29 Apr 2008 3:05PM
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Is there anything i should be looking for in the VT Series 2... Were they a good build? nice to drive etc?

Thanks Fellas!

DavMen
NSW, 1498 posts
29 Apr 2008 3:36PM
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sflack said...

Is there anything i should be looking for in the VT Series 2... Were they a good build? nice to drive etc?

Thanks Fellas!


Disc brakes usually need machining (common ailment)- lightly ride the brakes down a steep hill - to see if it pulses/vibrates through the brake pedal. Not an overly expensive fix though.

sflack
VIC, 574 posts
29 Apr 2008 3:38PM
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DavMen said...

sflack said...

Is there anything i should be looking for in the VT Series 2... Were they a good build? nice to drive etc?

Thanks Fellas!


Disc brakes usually need machining (common ailment)- lightly ride the brakes down a steep hill - to see if it pulses/vibrates through the brake pedal. Not an overly expensive fix though.


But generally are they pretty good? Unlike the ford that blows head gaskets? Last thing i wanna do is buy a lemon!

nobody
NSW, 437 posts
29 Apr 2008 3:41PM
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sflack said...

DavMen said...

sflack said...

Is there anything i should be looking for in the VT Series 2... Were they a good build? nice to drive etc?

Thanks Fellas!


Disc brakes usually need machining (common ailment)- lightly ride the brakes down a steep hill - to see if it pulses/vibrates through the brake pedal. Not an overly expensive fix though.


But generally are they pretty good? Unlike the ford that blows head gaskets? Last thing i wanna do is buy a lemon!


EA and early EB series were problematic. I heard by EB II they had it sorted.

nobody
NSW, 437 posts
2 May 2008 9:24PM
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nobody said...

landyacht said...

The cooling system is supposed to get anticorrosion tablets when it is serviced but a mechanic friend told me they never put them in because the damn cars would never break down.

Wouldn't surprise me. I've heard bad things about dealer servicing like they are full of apprentices etc. There is a common term called "mechanicd". This refers to all the problems you get when you get the car back after it has been "fixed". Or when you go to work on your car later to find stripped threads etc.




Exhibit A:
www.drive.com.au/Editorial/ArticleDetail.aspx?ArticleID=52034&vf=12

Krusty
NSW, 441 posts
2 May 2008 10:01PM
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Ive had a few older falcon and commodore wagons and found the following;

The EB falcon i had was very big and its rear seat could fold down 2 or 1 seats allowing for a passenger to sit in the back whilst it was loaded with lots of gear, this was very usefull. Older commodores didnt do this I had a VN its boot wasn't anywhere near the size of the falcon and you had to fold all the seats down if putting large things in the back, no split seats like the falcon.

My falcon drove like a barge had no steering feed back and would lose its rear on wet roads easily. My VN commodore drove more like a car and was much grippier on the road.

In my opinion, as a windurfing wagon goes the falcon is hard to beat. But if you do lots of driving without the intention of windsurfing the commodore would be the go.

decrepit
WA, 12061 posts
2 May 2008 8:48PM
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I've just noticed a hole in the rail of one of my boards, had me really scratching my head.
Then I twigged, this was the board I tried in the falcon wagon, I heard a "clunk" when I put it in, then noticed the back seat bolt sticking into the cargo space, but didn't bother to check the board.

Must have hit it harder than I thought, there's a nice bolt size hole in the rail.
So if you go for a falcon wagon be very careful, or do something about the bolt.

Richiefish
QLD, 5610 posts
2 May 2008 11:01PM
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any wagon is fine....just paint your wagon red............

mkseven
QLD, 2314 posts
2 May 2008 11:36PM
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I have a VT equipe.

Have driven quite a few falcons for work in the past, and now drive camrys.

When I got the equipe I really only considered the commodore or the magna, falcons are very hit and miss- you can get one with no issues at all and never have to touch it or you get one with all the problems in the world. The falcons are nice to drive though, and are more comfortable on long distance trips than a commodore.

Magna's I like and they are very well equiped for the money. 3 things I didn't like when I looked at them- space, no split/fold rear seat, whilst they are smooth I just don't appreciate the way they drive when compared to a commodore or falcon (ie engine response wise and where they make their power). As said only consider post 98 but for the money I wouldn't really bother with anything earlier than TJ. Interior is a little plain, and seats are a bit flat also. Another point is they don't have roof rack rails like the commodore. Post '05 has excellent warranty also.

Subie's I like, however someone said they are fuel economical- its the one thing the boxers aren't, the do go through more fuel than a standard 4. I'm told they do like fouling lifters. Brilliantly simple engines though. In an ideal world i'd be driving a b-spec liberty wagon to the beach.

Commodores- earlier commodores VR is the pick of the bunch, from memory the VS swapped over to ecotech and it stuffed a few things up. I found the VS nice to drive at the time though. VT wise- go with the VT II. Probably biggest thing to look for is rear suspension, if it's leaning on inside tyre then suspension will need replacing. Also as I recently found out expect radiator to go at any time with this sort of age car. Biggest annoyances are slight movement in body makes doors rub say when going over speed bump, can't really figure out why this annoys me so much- probably some silicon spray would fix anyway. The don't brake anywhere near as well as earlier commodores. And fuel caps break, look at every second VT series car.

Camry's- apart from the latest model I haven't been impressed. I'm not going to list all the reasons why.

Regarding removing seats- the car should be complianced for the new number of seats.

boardboy
QLD, 554 posts
3 May 2008 12:08AM
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www.redbook.com.au

is a great place to do price and spec comparisons before your buy. THis site provides national wholesale and private sale average prices for most vehicles.



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"Whats the Best Wagon?!?!?!" started by sflack