Select to expand quoteMr Milk said..
If you are measuring global warming from air temperatures, almost any bit of land will have its average temperature rising faster than the global average simply because 3/4 of the world is out at sea, and thus benefits from a cool sea breeze.
"One way that the world's ocean affects weather and climate is by playing an important role in keeping our planet warm. The majority of radiation from the Sun is absorbed by the ocean, particularly in tropical waters around the equator, where the ocean acts like a massive, heat-retaining solar panel. Land areas also absorb some sunlight, and the atmosphere helps to retain heat that would otherwise quickly radiate into space after sunset.
The ocean doesn't just store solar radiation - it also helps to distribute heat around the globe. When water molecules are heated, they exchange freely with the air in a process called evaporation. Ocean water is constantly evaporating, increasing the temperature and humidity of the surrounding air to form rain and storms that are then carried by trade winds. In fact, almost all rain that falls on land starts off in the ocean. The tropics are particularly rainy because heat absorption, and thus ocean evaporation, is highest in this area.
Outside of Earth's equatorial areas, weather patterns are driven largely by ocean currents. Currents are movements of ocean water in a continuous flow, created largely by surface winds but also partly by temperature and salinity gradients, Earth's rotation, and tides. Major current systems typically flow clockwise in the northern hemisphere and counterclockwise in the southern hemisphere, in circular patterns that often trace the coastlines.
Ocean currents act much like a conveyor belt, transporting warm water and precipitation from the equator toward the poles and cold water from the poles back to the tropics. Thus, ocean currents regulate global climate, helping to counteract the uneven distribution of solar radiation reaching Earth's surface. Without currents in the ocean, regional temperatures would be more extreme - super hot at the equator and frigid toward the poles - and much less of Earth's land would be habitable."
oceanexplorer.noaa.gov/facts/climate.html#:~:text=The%20ocean%20influences%20weather%20and,globe%2C%20and%20driving%20weather%20systems.
Select to expand quotedecrepit said..
well that's very close to 3/4, meet you half way 72.5% / 27.5%, now do you feel better.
My mistake, read the Milkmans wording wrong.
Excellent discussion on the psychology of climate change belief.
The Behavioural Sciences and the Populist Revolt - Ben Pile on The Corbett Report (odysee.com)
Select to expand quotePcdefender said..
For the last 2 months it seems Perth has been freezing.
May and June have average max temperatures of 22.3 and 19.5 yet nearly every day it seems the max has been around 17C.
Global Warming it seems also causes significant cooling.
The update you've all been waiting for...
April 2024, mean maximum temperature 29.2 degrees. Perth climate average for April 25.9 degrees.
My bad, pressed the wrong button ... 28.2 for April this year. That's 2.3 degrees above average.
Wowser- remery wow-sir-ee.
You learn something new everyday.
I never knew the global daily temperature could be measured to an accuracy of .. (well judging by how many points are fitting between those scales) at least 1/200th of a degree C in 1940.
Oh, my wrong, 1/200th of a degree for the daily global average temperature in 1850.
I mean Burke and Wills were the first to transit the entirety of the Australian continent from north to south in 1860 (and most of 1861, and well, most of them didn't actually make it), but measuring the global average temperature every day of the year was good to 1/200th of a degree.
Pretty wild this science thing.
Oh sorry, my bad.
I didn't notice it came from a Guardian graphic.
Yeah, ...probably printed upside down and where it says 1940 it means 20 minutes to 8 o'clock last wednesday. I'll save some time and just wait for the Guardian retraction / re-issue before I read further....
"Copernicus is the Earth observation component of the European Union's Space programme, looking at our planet and its environment to benefit all European citizens. It offers information services that draw from satellite Earth Observation and in-situ (non-space) data.
...
The CDS datasets are assessed by the Evaluation and Quality Control (EQC) function of C3S independently of the data supplier. EQC encompasses a framework of processes aimed to assure technical and scientific quality harmonized across all dataset types available through the CDS. During the EQC process, the documentation provided with the dataset is scrutinized and data are checked for usability and reliability.
How do you go about measuring a daily global average??????
Even with our high tech and satellites, I don't see how you can get temps from everywhere. And where is the temp measured at ground surface, sea level, or somewhere else.
I asked Copilot, the AI chatbot that comes with the Edge browser. This is its reply
Scientists measure global average temperature by combining data from various sources across the world.
Here's how they do it:
Temperature Measurements: Tens of thousands of temperature observations are taken daily from land stations and at sea. These measurements come from weather stations, weather balloons, radars, ships, buoys, and satellites1.
Anomalies: Scientists compare the temperature at each land and ocean station to what is considered "normal" for that location and time. Typically, they use the long-term average over a 30-year period as the reference. The differences between the measured temperature and the long-term average are called "anomalies." A positive anomaly means the temperature is warmer than average, while a negative anomaly indicates cooler temperatures.
Monthly Averages: Daily anomalies are averaged together over a whole month. These monthly averages help scientists evaluate how temperature is changing over time.
Datasets: Scientists use four major datasets to study global temperature:
HadCRUT4: Produced jointly by the UK Met Office Hadley Centre and the University of East Anglia's Climatic Research Unit.
GISTEMP: Comes from the NASA Goddard Institute for Space Sciences (GISS) in the US.
MLOST: Created by the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA).
JMA: Produced by the Japan Meteorological Agency2.
Grid-Based Approach: To get a complete picture of Earth's temperature, scientists divide the planet into a grid of smaller squares. They combine data from all available stations within each grid box. Smaller grid boxes provide more accurate estimates of global temperature when aggregated3.In summary, global average temperature is determined by collecting measurements from various sources, calculating anomalies, and using grid-based approaches to create a comprehensive picture of Earth's temperature trends. ?????
Select to expand quoteMr Milk said..
I asked Copilot, the AI chatbot that comes with the Edge browser. This is its reply
Scientists measure global average temperature by combining data from various sources across the world.
Here's how they do it:
Temperature Measurements: Tens of thousands of temperature observations are taken daily from land stations and at sea. These measurements come from weather stations, weather balloons, radars, ships, buoys, and satellites1.
Anomalies: Scientists compare the temperature at each land and ocean station to what is considered "normal" for that location and time. Typically, they use the long-term average over a 30-year period as the reference. The differences between the measured temperature and the long-term average are called "anomalies." A positive anomaly means the temperature is warmer than average, while a negative anomaly indicates cooler temperatures.
Monthly Averages: Daily anomalies are averaged together over a whole month. These monthly averages help scientists evaluate how temperature is changing over time.
Datasets: Scientists use four major datasets to study global temperature:
HadCRUT4: Produced jointly by the UK Met Office Hadley Centre and the University of East Anglia's Climatic Research Unit.
GISTEMP: Comes from the NASA Goddard Institute for Space Sciences (GISS) in the US.
MLOST: Created by the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA).
JMA: Produced by the Japan Meteorological Agency2.
Grid-Based Approach: To get a complete picture of Earth's temperature, scientists divide the planet into a grid of smaller squares. They combine data from all available stations within each grid box. Smaller grid boxes provide more accurate estimates of global temperature when aggregated3.In summary, global average temperature is determined by collecting measurements from various sources, calculating anomalies, and using grid-based approaches to create a comprehensive picture of Earth's temperature trends. ?????
That's a very comprehensive reply. AI frightens me. But then you ask it questions like how many n's are there in banana and I'm kind of reassured.
Even Remery knows there are two n's in banana
Select to expand quotedecrepit said..
How do you go about measuring a daily global average??????
The daily global average temperature from 1850 to 1900 that forms the base reading is measured via the width of tree rings and volume of coral growth from 150 year old trees and coral.
I kid you not.
I am not suggesting the planet is not warming and I am not suggesting it is not driven by human induced factors. I am also not suggesting average temperatures from 1850 cannot be estimated and temperature trends plotted.
But anyone who claims to be able to tell what the global daily average temperature was for every day in 1850 to an accuracy of 1/200th of a degree and then say the global daily temperature has changed to an accuracy of 1/100th of a degree is more crack-pot than PM33 having his horoscope read by mystic Meg.
What I if told you
you the read the first line wrong
Same the with second
And also the third?
Select to expand quoteCarantoc said..decrepit said..
How do you go about measuring a daily global average??????
The daily global average temperature from 1850 to 1900 that forms the base reading is measured via the width of tree rings and volume of coral growth from 150 year old trees and coral.
I kid you not.
I am not suggesting the planet is not warming and I am not suggesting it is not driven by human induced factors. I am also not suggesting average temperatures from 1850 cannot be estimated and temperature trends plotted.
But anyone who claims to be able to tell what the global daily average temperature was for every day in 1850 to an accuracy of 1/200th of a degree and then say the global daily temperature has changed to an accuracy of 1/100th of a degree is more crack-pot than PM33 having his horoscope read by mystic Meg.
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5544117
^
you suggesting the accuracy of the base data must be better than 1/200th of a degree because that chart is actually showing anomolies and you can't process data to result in a greater degree of accurary than the base data itself ?
I was giving them the benefit of the doubt that the number of decimals was the same as the base data. I do agree it should be less, but that means somebody is reading a thermometer to 1/1000th degree C accuracy. We are at PM33 having mystic Meg read his astrology whilst chatting to a Queensland politican level quackery now.
^ explain to me how you determined that the "accuracy of the base data must be better than 1/200th of a degree"?
"Contrail formation has been studied and is regularly forecast, particularly by military organizations that seek to avoid visual detection of their aircraft. The Appleman Contrail Forecast chart has been in use since 1953 to predict contrail formation.
Further study by the United States Air Force, concluded in 1993 suggests that contrail formation is most likely at altitudes at or above 35,000 feet and at temperatures below -58?F (-50?C). This research conducted by the USAF resulted in new prediction tools for contrails."
Figure 1: High Bypass Engine Contrail Algorithm - New Techniques for Contrail Forecasting, Capt. Jeffrey L. Peters, Air Weather Service, Scott Air Force Base - 1993
Thanks to our warm weather, I managed to harvest some more watermelons. The small ones were a bit shaded, and the smallest wasn't edible, but the others were of Coles quality. The first crop in January was exceptionally good.
Select to expand quotemyscreenname said..
You have to give some credit to Pcdefender for finding that meme. It's funny.
You think he 'finds' these memes? I think he just receives them and then forwards them on.
A while back he was posting a video of an old 'film' that showed contrails in it. When you looked at it further, it was an ad and someone had gone back and added a new sky background, with contrails in it.
I am not sure you can win. If its an old photo that has contrails in it, CTers ask why these are editted to show contrails that didn't exist. If it doesn't have contrails in it, CTers ask why we have them now.
Here's a photo I took from my spaceship in WW2:
Mid-May and 30 in Freo yesterday. Cold beers, thongs and singlets at a bbq in the arvo. Research complete.
Its all in my upcoming book im being sued by BIG SPIDER www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Kitesurfing/General/Paragliding?page=4
I dont understand why you all keep saying theyre clouds ive been in them in person its nothing but spiders from 6000 feet and up
