Forums > Windsurfing General

sailing with the plug out !!

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Created by DunkO > 9 months ago, 23 Jan 2012
Captain_Morg
TAS, 728 posts
26 Jan 2012 9:19AM
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Wow my Dad is pretty smart with the old bung trick
God bless and goodnight

Waiting4wind
NSW, 1871 posts
26 Jan 2012 10:20AM
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DunkO said...

geared4knots said...

best method is have a CHInook style two bolt deckplate. your bung when fully removed 'clips' into the plate and is just big enough not to fall out. Have used this method for years, along with other mates i have told. the good thing is you caN NOT connect your mast base/go sailing until the bung is removed from the plate!!simple


where was this post three days ago, as you can see that is the base plate i have.

will post photos of the carnage soon, drowning my sorrows at the moment.


The best thing is not to take the bung out. Over the last few decades of board ownership I've never had board damage due to pressure or heat (I do take a bit of care though) however i have had water in boards on the couple of occasions I took the bung out and forgot to replace it .

Sorry for your loss!

geared4knots
TAS, 2647 posts
26 Jan 2012 11:50AM
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yes i do mainly leave my bungs in, BUT my mate and myself both delaminated a board on the same occassion from leaving them in a hot car on the same day.
Both boards popped their bottoms the next sail.
Another friend of mine who stores his boards under the tarp on his ute has popped two boards!.
Basically if it is hot and you leave your board in the car / under ute cover then take bung out . The only board left out of 10 of one brand that i bought into the state many years ago is the board that has always had its bung removed. that says something.
Anyway here is a pic of the chinook base method that us tassies love. Perfect and simple. It is just big enough that it does not fall out. Try it!. i personally leave my track position once i find the spot i want so fixed plate no probs.


Mobydisc
NSW, 9029 posts
26 Jan 2012 12:00PM
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I too can vouch for locking the board bolt in the Chinook deckplate. It would probably work with the old Tyronsea system too. Basically impossible to go for a sail without the vent bolt in place.

Also I rarely unscrew the bolt. Its never unscrewed when going in the board bag and the footstraps are wet. However when its dry and not going to be used for a while I'll unscrew it.

What alternative is there to these fragile boards that suck in water if the hull is not intact? I'd be willing to buy a plastic board that weighs two or three kgs more but is extremely tough.



mybrosweeper
NSW, 1016 posts
26 Jan 2012 12:18PM
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I know sh%t little about windsurfing,but I use to repair large fibreglass reinforced concrete panels on multi storey buildings.Sometimes they had massive amounts of water behind them which soaked the concrete making them impossible to repair in this wet state.We use to drill holes in them and put in a "wick"to drain the water out.It takes time,but evapouration might be your best friend to dry your board out.But definately not the sun.
Ian

Sailhack said...

Fancy-shmancy systems...I gave up on the 'proper' way to remove the moisture & simply cut a strip off our mop 'wick' (about 250x10x2mm strip), inserted it into the screw vent on the board & placed it out in the sun on 'warm' days - left it in there most of the time & in the shed on 'hot' days and in winter sat it in our spare bedroom (ducted heating = dry air). After about 30mins the 'wick' is dripping wet, which evaporates & draws more moisture out (convective evaporation?). That removed 'most' of the moisture over a period of time...

...then again, my board is now shagged, so don't try this cheap-skate method...although it does work ok if you only got a small bit of water in the board (hit water, notice screw missing instantly, oops, jump off board & return to shore). Also if you've got heaps of time, too lazy to set up a vac system and aren't overly worried about your 'old' board.

Mark's method will ensure the longevity of your board.


Mark _australia
WA, 22521 posts
26 Jan 2012 11:22AM
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I think all those who say they never remove the vent screw need to qualify their remarks with where they live and what sort of heat their board sees. Garage to car parked in shade, yeah maybe you can get away with it.

My gear lives in my car so I can sail after work so every day for 3 months it sees 15 deg to about 60+ degrees cycling. That is a lot of expansion and contraction.

Why take the chance? geared4knots has seen it happen (even in Tas?) - 2 boards on the same day is not a random event it was obviously the heat

Leave it undone that's what it is there for....... unless sailing or straps are dripping wet and it is in a bag. Even then if straps are damp just undo vent, bag it and leave bag open about a foot on one side.

Waiting4wind
NSW, 1871 posts
26 Jan 2012 2:30PM
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I hope all you bung removers give the the bung a good licking before reinserting!

I've seen situatuins where sand grains on the bung have caused it to leak.

jh2703
NSW, 1222 posts
26 Jan 2012 3:28PM
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Never taken a vent screw out, My boards live in my black van all year round, most weekends it's in the sun. I've done some long stints in the WA summers as well where the boards are subjected to heat all day for up to six weeks, I've not had a problem. I think the problems start when you first get water in, I think once this happens you need to take the screw out when not sailing. The only time I'd take it out is if I was going to fly. One of my mates takes the vent screw out after every session, He's made himself a laminated card that is attached to a rubber band. He puts it on his front foot strap as a reminder. The card reads "DO UP YOUR VENT SCREW", He does not remove the card untill he has done up the vent and then he attaches the card to his screw driver. Is it over the top? It works for him and he's never gone sailing with out the scew being done up.

I may have been lucky but i'll leave mine in until I pop my first board, I like to learn the hard way

FormulaNova
WA, 14808 posts
26 Jan 2012 12:36PM
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Mobydisc said...

<snip>

What alternative is there to these fragile boards that suck in water if the hull is not intact? I'd be willing to buy a plastic board that weighs two or three kgs more but is extremely tough.



So put your money where your mouth is and buy a BIC! I think there are some Mistrals still made like this too.

I think a few of these are still made as a plastic ASA construction.

No vent screw, and a tough plastic skin.

Tell us which one you buy.

Mobydisc
NSW, 9029 posts
26 Jan 2012 4:20PM
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FormulaNova said...

Mobydisc said...

<snip>

What alternative is there to these fragile boards that suck in water if the hull is not intact? I'd be willing to buy a plastic board that weighs two or three kgs more but is extremely tough.



So put your money where your mouth is and buy a BIC! I think there are some Mistrals still made like this too.

I think a few of these are still made as a plastic ASA construction.

No vent screw, and a tough plastic skin.

Tell us which one you buy.




I'm kind of in the market for a new board but the purchase of one depends on a few factors out of my control. If and when I buy a new board I'll check out these ones. However what I wish for is a modern shaped roto moulded polypropylene board, like the Bomboras. Of course doing this would be a huge financial risk that would probably not be paid off.





jh2703
NSW, 1222 posts
26 Jan 2012 5:41PM
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Mobydisc said...

What alternative is there to these fragile boards that suck in water if the hull is not intact?


Go custom, Get them to make the core out of closed cell foam and from what I hear these don't take on water. I hope that's the case, My new quad is rumored to be made out of this....Hope so! Apparently they don't use it because of weight but my new board is 115L and weighs in at 7.0 kgs on the dot, That's light enough for me.

....and custom don't cost any more then production boards and you get to do anything you want as far as design.

Beaglebuddy
1595 posts
26 Jan 2012 3:42PM
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Go custom, Get them to make the core out of closed cell foam and from what I hear these don't take on water.


Closed cell foam is a bit of a play on words, most all boards are made of EPS which is styrofoam and is closed cell foam, problem is EPS is a bunch of closed cell foam beads crunched together and while water will not penetrate those individual beads it will very much invade the spaces between those beads.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polystyrene
True closed cell foam boards are made of XPS or XTR and there is a bit of a problem with delamination, XTR board have a series of vents all around the board to deal with this.
allaboutsurfboards.com/surfboard-foam/
Chinese popout boards are all stytofoam, it's cheaper and easier to make.
A true closed cell foam board would be all custom, a bit heavier and more expensive.

Waiting4wind
NSW, 1871 posts
26 Jan 2012 8:21PM
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Mark _australia said...

I think all those who say they never remove the vent screw need to qualify their remarks with where they live and what sort of heat their board sees. Garage to car parked in shade, yeah maybe you can get away with it.

My gear lives in my car so I can sail after work so every day for 3 months it sees 15 deg to about 60+ degrees cycling. That is a lot of expansion and contraction.

Why take the chance? geared4knots has seen it happen (even in Tas?) - 2 boards on the same day is not a random event it was obviously the heat

Leave it undone that's what it is there for....... unless sailing or straps are dripping wet and it is in a bag. Even then if straps are damp just undo vent, bag it and leave bag open about a foot on one side.


I would suspect that some boards are more prone to it due to their construction. My mate stores his gear in his van, parked in the street all year round. It is Sydney and probably not as hot as WA but we do get some hot ones.

The same guy also forgot to remove the bungs when we went for a sailing trip to Fiji. We thought for sure they would have popped in the plane, but they were fine.

So I wonder what is the deal with my Fanatic sups, they dont have bungs!

shear tip
NSW, 1125 posts
26 Jan 2012 8:36PM
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I wonder why there aren'e more board manufacturers using gore-tex vents like CarbonArt? Simply not an issue for scatter-brains like myself...

littlefeet
VIC, 33 posts
26 Jan 2012 11:10PM
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I'm sorry to hear too...as a woman I would have taken it to a board repairer...because I don't tinker in the shed.

DunkO
NSW, 1146 posts
27 Jan 2012 12:51AM
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hello very **** faced, hhappy australiia dy bitches.

my camera memory card has been stuck into ny computer so can not tke photos of the board.... you board gore sickos..$.

if i was to build a board i would use some sort of closed cell constructiont around the plug area so idiots like me didnot absorb the ocean into there board.


slalomfreak
NSW, 304 posts
27 Jan 2012 6:34AM
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shear tip said...

I wonder why there aren'e more board manufacturers using gore-tex vents like CarbonArt? Simply not an issue for scatter-brains like myself...


It's probably because tight arse board manufacturers don't want to spend $2 on the goretex valve.
It's like steel board bag zippers.why anyone would make a bag with a steel zip when plastic is obviously so much better and unaffected by salt water is beyond me.

aus301
QLD, 2039 posts
27 Jan 2012 7:11AM
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slalomfreak said...

shear tip said...

I wonder why there aren'e more board manufacturers using gore-tex vents like CarbonArt? Simply not an issue for scatter-brains like myself...


It's probably because tight arse board manufacturers don't want to spend $2 on the goretex valve.
It's like steel board bag zippers.why anyone would make a bag with a steel zip when plastic is obviously so much better and unaffected by salt water is beyond me.


Actually it is probably more likely that many manufacturers don't believe the gore-tex valve works, myself included. Gore-tex works against water drops, so you will likely be safe while sailing, my concern is it does not work against water vapour molecules - well it does it's purpose, it lets water vapour molecules through.

Maybe, just maybe water vapour will accumulate in the board over time and destroy it?? I don't know, but I would rather the more mechanical option.

Another one here for not removing the plug, In QLD with board in van 100% of the time. To this date I have never had an issue.

DunkO
NSW, 1146 posts
27 Jan 2012 5:58PM
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sorry about my last post few too many shandies yesterday.

anyway here is photo of some of the damage. the crack runs all the way round and half way across the top. there is also a smaller one on the tail.


this looks repairable sure, but worse is the fact the whole board is warped and delaminated.

once again pretty stupid

thanks for the board loan offers but i yesterday purchased a second hand fanatic quad, which im looking forwrd to giving a go this weekend at the NSW wave comp, seen plenty of good comments on these boards.

i do recommend a nude chopper to anyone considering one of them. really surfs well and carves hard. works well as quad or twin.

DunkO
NSW, 1146 posts
27 Jan 2012 6:08PM
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notice the water drops. when i picked up the board a fere amount of wate poured from the crack. so plenty got in there.

sboardcrazy
NSW, 8045 posts
27 Jan 2012 6:54PM
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What a bummer Dunko!
When I first got my boards I was paranoid re vent plugs.I had a sign on cardboard -vent plug! that I kept in my board bag on the footstraps so I was reminded everytime I opened them. I got into the habit of screwing up the plug everytime I put the fin in but today I didn't.. I think I thought I'd wait till the last minute as the board is blue & it was out in the sun so i didn't want it overheating..
I went out for an hours sail and came in and realised the plug was in but not tight..@##$. Luckily it was only 5-7kts of wind and flat water and I didn't plane so I don't think much got in..
Someone once told me to suck on the vent to see if there was any water in it so I did and there was a little bit first go but none after..maybe water sitting in the top? Anyway I've put a wick of tissue in it after taking the plug out and the wick is dry ??..Serious lack of hot sunny days here this season so I can't see me placing it out in the sun to evaporate much.
How do you know if there is enough water in it to be a problem? What sort of extra weight can it get with water and if it delaminates can it be fixed by a repairer?
I don't really feel its a big issue today as the wind was so light and the sail a really dry one but I'm interested.

174
NSW, 190 posts
27 Jan 2012 7:20PM
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DunkO said...

this looks repairable sure, but worse is the fact the whole board is warped and delaminated.


What are you on about? Some duct tape and that will be fine!

DunkO
NSW, 1146 posts
27 Jan 2012 8:40PM
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sboardcrazy said...

What a bummer Dunko!
When I first got my boards I was paranoid re vent plugs.I had a sign on cardboard -vent plug! that I kept in my board bag on the footstraps so I was reminded everytime I opened them. I got into the habit of screwing up the plug everytime I put the fin in but today I didn't.. I think I thought I'd wait till the last minute as the board is blue & it was out in the sun so i didn't want it overheating..
I went out for an hours sail and came in and realised the plug was in but not tight..@##$. Luckily it was only 5-7kts of wind and flat water and I didn't plane so I don't think much got in..
Someone once told me to suck on the vent to see if there was any water in it so I did and there was a little bit first go but none after..maybe water sitting in the top? Anyway I've put a wick of tissue in it after taking the plug out and the wick is dry ??..Serious lack of hot sunny days here this season so I can't see me placing it out in the sun to evaporate much.
How do you know if there is enough water in it to be a problem? What sort of extra weight can it get with water and if it delaminates can it be fixed by a repairer?
I don't really feel its a big issue today as the wind was so light and the sail a really dry one but I'm interested.


leave it with me, i'll get that water out.

DunkO
NSW, 1146 posts
27 Jan 2012 8:43PM
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174 said...

DunkO said...

this looks repairable sure, but worse is the fact the whole board is warped and delaminated.


What are you on about? Some duct tape and that will be fine!


yeah not sure about that? your welcome to it.

just for the record what happened to the board is no reflection of build quality. it is however a reflection of poor water removal practises.

nick0
NSW, 510 posts
27 Jan 2012 8:48PM
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or just mabey u leave it in tight all the time and get the same result...witch is nothing

sboardcrazy
NSW, 8045 posts
27 Jan 2012 10:33PM
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DunkO said...

sboardcrazy said...

What a bummer Dunko!
When I first got my boards I was paranoid re vent plugs.I had a sign on cardboard -vent plug! that I kept in my board bag on the footstraps so I was reminded everytime I opened them. I got into the habit of screwing up the plug everytime I put the fin in but today I didn't.. I think I thought I'd wait till the last minute as the board is blue & it was out in the sun so i didn't want it overheating..
I went out for an hours sail and came in and realised the plug was in but not tight..@##$. Luckily it was only 5-7kts of wind and flat water and I didn't plane so I don't think much got in..
Someone once told me to suck on the vent to see if there was any water in it so I did and there was a little bit first go but none after..maybe water sitting in the top? Anyway I've put a wick of tissue in it after taking the plug out and the wick is dry ??..Serious lack of hot sunny days here this season so I can't see me placing it out in the sun to evaporate much.
How do you know if there is enough water in it to be a problem? What sort of extra weight can it get with water and if it delaminates can it be fixed by a repairer?
I don't really feel its a big issue today as the wind was so light and the sail a really dry one but I'm interested.


leave it with me, i'll get that water out.


No thanks.. Unless you guarantee a new 2012 replacement board if you stuff it up...If so when can you do it?

sboardcrazy
NSW, 8045 posts
27 Jan 2012 10:35PM
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Anyone in Newcastle ( other than Dunko.a reputable repairperson who could dry out my board? Also if it's a few days after the vent was left out that I get it to them is that too late?

WindWarrior
NSW, 1019 posts
27 Jan 2012 10:49PM
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DunkO said...

174 said...

DunkO said...

this looks repairable sure, but worse is the fact the whole board is warped and delaminated.


What are you on about? Some duct tape and that will be fine!


yeah not sure about that? your welcome to it.

just for the record what happened to the board is no reflection of build quality. it is however a reflection of poor water removal practises.




Hey Dunko have dropped you a PM regarding possible board surgery

Mark _australia
WA, 22521 posts
27 Jan 2012 8:05PM
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sboardcrazy said...

Anyone in Newcastle ( other than Dunko.a reputable repairperson who could dry out my board? Also if it's a few days after the vent was left out that I get it to them is that too late?


If you put a wick in it within a day or so and it was dry, no probs

sboardcrazy
NSW, 8045 posts
28 Jan 2012 9:42AM
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Mark _australia said...

sboardcrazy said...

Anyone in Newcastle ( other than Dunko.a reputable repairperson who could dry out my board? Also if it's a few days after the vent was left out that I get it to them is that too late?


If you put a wick in it within a day or so and it was dry, no probs



So a tissue stuck in it & the board upside down & not damp means ok..?



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"sailing with the plug out !!" started by DunkO